NYPD cop: videoing me breaking the law is a terrorist act

phillamb168

There are lots of things wrong with what happened in this video, on the part of the NYPD -and- on the part of the videographer. He had a pretty good point, right up until the moment he started cursing out a woman who was 1. retired, and therefore 2. older than he was and 3. a former cop. I’m very much pro-civil liberties, and that woman was completely wrong when she was stating that people ‘weren’t supposed to film cops because of the terrorism.’ However! It’s really not helping your case much to use such strong language.

The cop, retired cop and videographer should all grow up.

JackCastile

The guy doing the video taping is an idiot.

Uniform cops don’t have to obey parking regulation and shouldn’t have to. It’s funny that at the end of the video, he cites the police officer not wearing a seat belt. There’s actually a documentated legislation for most municipalities that states uniform police officers do not have to wear their seat belts if they choose not to in order to facilitate easy exit from their cruisers during patrols and\or pursuits.

This guy’s just another confrontation hungry, love me daddy moron looking for attention.

Nuff said.

geekazoid

This is a really old video, recently reposted to youtube, and amongst the lamest cop ‘gotcha’ videos ever. Like parking in front of a fire hydrant while 50 feet away is somehow A Big Deal. Personally, I think the videographer’s bad manners are a more serious offense.

Why are you posting this shite? C’mon, we deserve better.

Alan

Over at Obscure Store and Reading Room there was a lengthy debate on cops illegally parking. Many a person said cops need to park close to where they are in case of an emergency call. Well, this woman ain’t a police officer, so she won’t be going on any emergency calls. Yet there she is, parking illegally because she knows she won’t get in trouble, and there was the predictable back-up, spouting scare tactics to keep her out of trouble.

Cause of the terrorism. Geesh. Seems to me, if you’re a cop breaking the law, you’d want terrorists to know. That way, they’ll know you don’t respect the law and you’ll get medieval on their asses if you catch one.

angusm

Because everyone knows that traffic cops are in the front line of the fight against terrorism. if they got Al Capone for tax evasion, surely we can get Osama bin Laden for unpaid parking tickets.

Takuan

oh, so that was a CIVILIAN UNIFORM! OH, OK then!

LogrusZed

phillamb168: I believe she (the old, supposed retired, porker) cursed the cameraman first, so his swearing back wasn’t really out of line. Unless you feel that “cunt” is like the nuclear missile of cuss words and therefore it should never be used (unless on is British, I guess). But I’m of the opinion that if you start a cussing match then you can’t rightly claim a foul because the other party engaged in escalation.

phillamb168

@JackCastile I’m in -partial- agreement with you. I don’t know the law when it comes to traffic and parking regulations involving the PD, but clearly this lady WASN’T sitting in that diner in the Line of Duty or something. Parking next to a fire hydrant because you just saw someone rob a bank and you jumped out of your vehicle to pursue them is one thing. Parking next to a fire hydrant because you needed a little snack is quite another.

pasmith

I have to come down on the side of the cops this time out. The videographer is just being a nuisance, and is using language that just makes me take him even less seriously.

So the cop blocks a fire hydrant to go inside this shop. Let’s say there’s a fire and the NYFD has to get to that hydrant. You think that cop won’t be aware of this situation?

On the other hand, let’s say the cop parked 3 blocks away legally, and now is needed for some emergency. The additional time it takes her to get back to her car is enough time to cause the loss of someone’s life. It could happen.

I just think there’re more important issues facing us than cops parking in front of a hydrant for 5 minutes to run in and get a bite to eat.

mcgirt

First of all for all of you who can distinguish uniforms that is not a cop thats a a so called traffic cop, which pretty much is a meter maid. Get it right before yall start to rant and rave. A real cop would not even put themselves in that position especially with cameras around.

LogrusZed

JackCastile: you know what facilitates easy exit from a motor vehicle? Not being a huge fucking whale.

Also, at least in my city and I’ll wager it’s probably pretty uniform, police on a call may be exempt from observing parking/traffic guidelines (obvious reasons). Unless there was a 911 call about a sammich that needed to be eaten this fatso was not on the job.

glace neuf

i think the on-duty cop showed tremendous restraint in not whooping the butt of the videographer – that guy annoyed me and i was just watching the video. too bad the “terrorism” angle got lost in a bunch of obnoxiousness.

bardfinn

#11 JackCastile:

So, so very sorry to inform you that you are wrong. Police have to follow the law like everyone else. That’s so important that I’m going to repeat it:

Police have to follow the law like everyone else.

They have special dispensations when in active pursuit of their duties – not at any other time.

They have to obey the speed limits unless the lights are flashing, they have to refrain from littering unless it’s part of an actual operation, and parking in front of a fire hydrant while not actively answering a call is clearly illegal.

jakerome

I think the only person who handled herself with any dignity is the on-the-duty cop. The man is a major-league asshole, who failed in his attempt to get a reaction out of the cop. Both he and the retired cop were attempted to use intimidation tactics to get what they wanted and failed miserably.

Really, this is nothing more than proof that assholes can use video cameras, too. Nothing to see, folks.

themindfantastic

After watching this video we have a real life example where the videographer is “right” but still “an asshole”. Im not in NYC, but its reasonable to say a) parking in front of a hydrant is illegal for citizens and police not on emergency business, b) driving without a seatbelt is not the most smart thing to do in most places its illegal, police officer or not. He is however quite badgering and just being an asshole. Yes document, yes call to light whats going on to the individual involved. But badgering people (anyone, police or otherwise) is likely to get something less than nice to happen to you.

phillamb168

LogrusZed: I wasn’t raised to swear back at someone. It never solves anything, and usually only serves to escalate the situation. Swearing back is something petty people do.

error404

Hilarious that so much chatter is about the size of the copper.

Delightfully missing the point.

She broke the law twice.

That’s all there is.

Cops are bound by the law, all laws.

Sure if they are excused in the course of duty but that doesn’t pertain here.

The retired cop is a total idiot to think that cops can’t be filmed.

The guy who filmed this is a collosal arse for wasting so eveyone’s time.

Takuan

police that cannot conduct themselves at all times at a HIGHER THAN MINIMUM STANDARD are unworthy of respect. Their BASIC DUTY IS GREATER. If she is supported by the department that she belongs to in this behaviour, then her department is also not worthy of respect. After respect is lost, police become just another armed gang of thugs.

It really is the citizens of the cities choice. If you accept thugs, you deserve thugs. You all have a vote, a voice, cameras and computer access.

noen

Jimmy Justice is deliberately being a jerk. In fact I think his actions border on harassment. If he was really only concerned that the police follow the law then he would simply note the policewoman’s badge and then report it. But he doesn’t because he has an audience and a channel on YouTube so he escalates the situation.

The policewoman is of course wrong and so is the retired one. Sadly, for many terrorism = expanded police powers. That’s wrong but it doesn’t make Jimmy Justice’s actions right either.

Maybe it’s different here in Minn. because if I walk out my door I’m happy to see the police and I’ve never had problems with them.

MackLimelight

The title of the story is factually incorrect, and this story is junk and doesn’t belong on boingboing.

I have a whole lot to say on the subject and readers comments but none of them deserve a logical response.

Elysianartist

Is today the day when BB readers have their sarcasm detectors turned off?

koolkev

Seconds count when getting a sammich, I mean putting out a fire.

I would think that double parking somewhere else would be more justifiable than parking in front of a hydrent.

Not only did she break the law. It appears that she did it with no reason. It looks like there was open parking in front of and behind her car. When you are so above the law that you don’t even need to think about it you need a wake up.

Good work! Zoom on the badge. Zoom on the seatbelt sticker in the car. Zoom on the finger.

Cussing and NYC = efficient communication. It’s kind of sweet anywhere else if you cussed out someone they would get bent. In NYC ahh.

She new she was wrong, she had no comeback.

JackCastile

To Bardfinn:

You just merely laws that cops and citizens both have to and can both easily follow. Littering? Please.

You are wrong in stating that cops have to follow all laws “like everyone else”. They don’t. They shouldn’t and they couldn’t do their jobs if they had to.

Cops in pursuit of criminals do not have to obey the speed limit. Cops are legally able to take a law breaking citizen into custody, forcibly if necessary. If a citizen did that it could very well be considered unlawful imprisonment or even kidnapping.

The retired cop was probably just trying to help out the on duty cop. If you saw one of your friends getting harassed by some idiot with a video camera you’d probably intervene also.

Also, perhaps the on duty cop was taking advantage, but if she was the street’s meter made, so what? We all take liberties.

The video guy is just an indignant jerk.

He’s the “Billy has more cookies than I do…”, wah, wah, wah, tattler brat that we all hate.

scissorfighter

I’d have to say I’m a little disappointed at the overall tone of the comments here, most of them seeming to support the camera holder and not the cop. This guy is the real-world equivalent of an on-line forum troll, just lurking about looking to stir up trouble. Yes, in general police DO have to obey the laws just the same as you or I, with specific exceptions while performing their duties. But why would you go out of your way to make such a complete ass of yourself just to harass a cop who parked in front of a hydrant? Is that really such a big deal? And is the camera wielder suggesting that he has never parked illegally in the great city of New York? If you’re going to get on a cop’s case about something, harass them about something that matters, like improper use of excessive force.

Most NYC officers (and those of other cities too, I’m sure,) are professionals that care about the public and perform a difficult job of doing their best to keep citizens safe. Jerks like this guy only serve to drive a wedge between the public and the police, which is the exact opposite of what we should be doing. It’s not us vs. them , and the more that mentality is promoted the more difficult it will be to hold onto the civil liberties we do have.

Oh, and by the way, the classy language used by the guy at the end should have been enough in and of itself for the editors of BoingBoing to say, “you know, we’re better than this, let’s not post such rubbish.”

Atomische

Quick! Call 311! A police officer parked illegally!

jgriffiths

@70

It was deliberately sarcastic, so Godwin’s Law doesn’t really apply there.

MrCerulean

Notwithstanding the issue of whether or not she was breaking the law, the videographer threw all of his credibility out the window when he devolved to the level of the retired cop that was cussing him out.

If you’re going to take this kind of stand, it’s important that you hold yourself to a standard higher than that of the ones you are criticizing…

ronhayden

Being a bully emboldened by carrying a video camera isn’t “justice,” it’s being a prick.

Yes the officer blocked the fire hydrant illegally. Is ambushing her with a camcorder and launching immediately into a confrontation the best way — or even the most interesting way — to handle the situation? Would Jimmy have acted the same way if he *weren’t* holding a video camera?

The whole thing came off as a cheap shot.

JeanHuguesRobert

Sometimes the law is stupid. Even a police officer can figure that out!

takeshi

@ LogrusZed:

If a cop flips you off, and you feel like pursuing it, it’s simple assault. If a retired cop calls you an “asshole,” simple assault. If you call a retired cop a “cunt,” simple assault.

It doesn’t really matter who does what first. If the retired cop punched the guy, and he defended himself, he would have a good defense, but the fact that the retired cop calls him “asshole” doesn’t really mean too much. Basically, if anyone says anything to you that you’re not happy with, threatens you, looks at you funny, or in any other way demeans or belittles you, you have the right to press charges in most counties and municipalities.

One of the side effects of living in an overly litigious society.

@ Antinous:

The first invocation of Godwin’s law is at the beginning of the video.

Benjamin

Yeah he actually did illicit a reaction from the officer – the middle finger.

He didn’t have to be such a dick, but the something to think about – if he wouldn’t have garnered the reaction from the retiree, we wouldn’t be informing people that it’s perfectly legal to film on public property.

Also, wasn’t that a diner that the cop was in? I doubt that was official police business. Unless you consider NOM NOM NOM offishul p’lice bizniss.

waugsqueke

Hm. What’s scaring me a bit here, reading through the comments, are the folks who are saying that the police don’t have to follow the law like other people do.

That’s a bit frightening to think that people believe that is true.

yooper1019

Great opportunity for a video ruined by a total douche-bag filming it. “C” word? Really? Nice life!!

Chorske

Seriously, Cory, I am disappointed. First, the videographer behaves like a jerk- if he wants to play the moral superiority card, he should politely approach the officer… this feels more like a video mugging. Second, he inflames the situation with his behaviour, aggressively following her and pestering her. Third, who walks around getting uppity over a temporarily blocked hydrant? The whole video is annoying and beneath the standards of this site. If it wasn’t for the stupid “it’s cos of the terrorists” bit, there wouldn’t be anything here worth looking at.

hbee

A real cop would not even put themselves in that position especially with cameras around.

Not true. I talked to a cop in Boston who did the exact same thing – parked in front of a hydrant to go get food. When he came out, I asked him if he would give himself a ticket. He grinned to stupidly and said “no”.

“Because you’re above the law you enforce, right?”

“Yup,” he said, “I am.”

Takuan

how about this time? was this a good time to have a camear handy?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q9nrFoUFsO8

angusm

People seem to be mostly overlooking the fact that the policewoman filmed is a traffic cop (dark blue police vehicle, as opposed to white). Therefore (a) she should know better than to park in front of a hydrant and drive without a seatbelt, and (b) she’s not required to dismount quickly and pursue an offender on foot.

None of the three people in the video (videographer, traffic cop, retired cop) come off well, but the most disturbing part is the way that it illustrates how many people believe the myth that “You can’t do X ‘because of the terrorism’”.

We should really get that slogan on T-shirts: “I have the right to take your donut ‘because of the terrorism’.”, “Your girlfriend has to come home with me ‘because of the terrorism’”, “I need you to give me all your money ‘because of the terrorism’.”

Takuan

this one?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9GgWrV8TcUc

Takuan

who knows? perhaps the local vernacular. One must make allowances for the native ways.

Takuan

are cameras not a good thing?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ibSwITK4jjQ

takeshi

@ jgriffiths:

Godwin’s law still applies. Context doesn’t matter.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_law

a random John

Johnny Justice is a jerk, so what?

This officer is in clear violation of the law. Why on earth shouldn’t the police be hold themselves to the same standards they enforce on everyone else?

The failure to do so is the motivating force behind disrespect of the police. Cops would do themselves a real favor by being professional at all times.

Ibrahim

1) The title here is disingenuous; the police officer never says that filming her is illegal.

2) It seemed like the guy had been harassing her prior to going into the restaurant. He calls her by name without ever seeing her name tag, or so it seemed to me.

Sad to see something like this given credibility when it’s just some obnoxious twit emboldened by a camera.

Duke Countu

The guy is a fucking idiot and deserves to have his video camera shoved up his ass. I was expecting to see some cop brutality and after looking at the video I wish I had seen the guy get hog tied and thrown face first into a paddy wagon.

padster123

“Looking at someone funny” is classified as a form of assault in the US?

Wow.

Mike H

I have no sympathy for either cop.

If you’re a cop and this video bothers you, I’m happy.

Takuan

wait, let guess? cop?

ROSSINDETROIT

Here’s why even traffic cops should obey the minor laws whenever possible: The police rely heavily on citizen cooperation to do their jobs. Citizens who do not respect the police do not cooperate. When people see someone in uniform taking personal advantage of their position for grand or petty personal reasons it undermines respect for all in uniform. It’s not just a quick double park to pick up their laundry, it’s the status and effectiveness of the uniform that’s at stake. Any cop that doesn’t take that seriously is squandering the public’s trust and goodwill, which is as powerful a tool as the gun on their hip.

JSG

One thing, she isn’t a cop, she is a meter maid (was that politically incorrect? good.) She has no power to arrest, if she notices a crime taking place, she has to call the real police, she can’t investigate herself. And apparently they feel above the law.

Here is the info from the NYPD’s own website, it is under civilian opportunities….

Traffic Enforcement Agent

Traffic Enforcement Agents perform work of varying degrees of difficulty in traffic enforcement areas. When required, an agent issues summonses to illegally parked vehicles, directs traffic at an intersection, testifies at administrative hearing offices and court, prepares required reports, and may operate a motor vehicle. Traffic Enforcement Agents at assignment level III are required to operate a tow truck. At all assignment levels, personnel may be required to work nights, weekends, and holidays.

Qualifications:

A 4 year high school diploma or its equivalent.
Candidates must successfully complete a psychological, medical and drug screening, and a background investigation.
Candidates must possess a Driverâ€™s License valid in the State of New York. Candidates for assignment level III must possess a towing endorsement in addition to their regular license.
Candidates must be NYC residents within 90 days of appointment.
Salaries: Level I $27,013 ($31,065 after 2 yrs)
Level II $33,478
Level III $36,900
Level IV $38,764

Base salaries are increased by overtime, night shift differential, uniform allowance, and holiday pay. Benefits include paid sick and annual leave, medical, dental and optical insurance, pension, and deferred compensation, 401K and IRA options.
Advancement opportunities exist both within the Traffic Enforcement title series and through promotion to Police Officer, if you meet the educational and citizenship requirements.

To apply, please send your resume with a cover letter to:
New York City Police Department
Employment Section – Selection and Processing Unit
1 Police Plaza, Rm. 1014
New York, NY 10038
Att: TEA Position
You can also email you resume and cover letter to:
empsec@nypd.org
Filing will be open for the civil service examination for this title from January 2 – February 26 , 2008. The examination will be given on May 3, 2008. You can file by mail or online through the NYC Department of Citywide Administrative Services. For more information, please visit their website at: http://www.nyc.gov/dcas.

pepsi_max2k

>> The guy doing the video taping is an idiot.

yup. the guy’s an idiot. film it, report it, the end. this is probably the reason all legitimate photographers and videographers are being harrased. thanks, man. well done. :o\

Oshkosh John

You people who think cops are breaking the law when they “park illegally” are wrong. A cop may park his official cop vehicle anywhere he wants, even on the sidewalk. If there is an actual emergency which needs a fire hydrant, the cop and the fire department can work it out.

In most jurisdictions, a cop who is a “sworn officer of the law” is on duty, even when he is “off the clock.”

Now then, when a cop shoots a handcuffed, unarmed civilian on a train station platform, THAT needs to be photographed.

Merc

The guy filming is an asshat, but he’s right. Police officers break the law all the time because they know they can get away with it. According to those “broken window” theories (i.e. major crimes are more likely when minor crimes go unpunished) I wouldn’t be surprised if police speeding while not on a call, parking illegally, etc. made them less likely to respect more serious laws.

And “you can’t do that because of the terrorism” is an excuse that needs to be challenged more.

jgriffiths

@27

The police are allowed to break certain laws, however, there are very specific guidelines around them.

For example (based on British law, but I’m assuming US law is similar or the same):

Police cars are allowed to exceed the speed limit, but only when pursuing other vehicles or en route to an emergency and only with the flashing lights on. A police car speeding without lights is the same as anyone else.

Police officers are allowed to be more aggressive in taking people into custody than citizens, but there are all sorts of laws regarding just cause, as well as the officer being uniformed / otherwise identifiable as a police officer.

As has been stated above, this woman was a traffic officer, therefore not required to respond to an emergency, therefore she could have easily parked legally and walked to her destination.

But anyway, as many people have said, the guy completely ruined his case by being such a dick. He should have been polite to the officer at the beginning of the video and there was no need to respond to the ‘retired’ police officer, who didn’t really cuss him out that bad.

HornCologne

Oh people! There are serious issues here, sure, but anyone who has lived in NYC has got to be laughing out loud right now at all of the “Oh my golly goodness! They used naughty, naughty potty words!” … come on! An F-You has always been as good as a “good morning” in New York.

This was the Best. Thread. Evar. (until the uptightness won out). Summing up the bestness:

“Ok, let’s just suppose that that woman really is a cop. Suppose an actual crime happened right there on the corner in front of her, a mugging say. Are we supposed to believe that this “cop” is going to be able to chase and catch anyone?”

“I bet she could chase the shit out of a pastry thief; sadly, however, all the evidence was “lost” during the arrest. No, I was covered in crumbs before the chase!”

“There’s actually a documentated legislation for most municipalities that states uniform police officers do not have to wear their seat belts if they choose not to in order to facilitate easy exit from their cruisers during patrols and\or pursuits.”

“Because everyone knows that traffic cops are in the front line of the fight against terrorism. if they got Al Capone for tax evasion, surely we can get Osama bin Laden for unpaid parking tickets.”

“You know what facilitates easy exit from a motor vehicle? Not being a huge fucking whale.”

manicbassman

I’m very surprised the idiot with the camera didn’t get busted for using the C word in public…

jgriffiths

@48

Excuse my non-American ignorance, but that’s a joke right? Please tell me that wouldn’t actually be possible?

Takuan

why? the profanity started from the busy-body “retired cop”

Johnny Coelacanth

Way to stand up for civil liberties there, Count Dooku. To all of you who are shocked, shocked by the naughty words, allow me to suggest you are unfamiliar with the patois of New York City. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with the videographer’s attitude, either. The cop could have given a sheepish grin, said “sorry” and gone on her way and there would be nothing to it. The moron who interjects herself into the conversation and says “cause of the terrists” is a complete bint.

DMcK

#94 Horncologne: Oh people! There are serious issues here, sure, but anyone who has lived in NYC has got to be laughing out loud right now at all of the “Oh my golly goodness! They used naughty, naughty potty words!” … come on! An F-You has always been as good as a “good morning” in New York.

HA! Exactly. Their little exchange reinforced my NYC pride in hilarious fashion. Also, it’s worth re-stating that there are no actual police officers in this video — NONE. I wonder if Jimmy Justice ever gets all like, “Those FASCIST VIDEO STORE CLERKS! Always charging me exorbitant late fees, yet they keep their movies out for days at a time, even if they’re not supposed to! BUSTED!”

takeshi

It varies, but yes… in many cities, the definition of what constitutes a “simple assault” is just plain idiotic. I have even heard of people being brought up on charges for mumbling. Basically, if you disturb your neighbor in any way, they have the right to press charges.

Playing pattycakes is probably safe, though.

MasterSauce

Good night. Johnny Justice, What is he really fighting for? He’s acting like a grade a prick. This is so small and petty that I can’t believe he bothered to mess with it. Why did he have to jump all over her the second she walked out the door? He’s just another arse hole with some axe to grind.

Listen Kids with camcorders: Go find something of real importance, some real injustice or corruption. Film that and don’t give cops a reason to hate every video camera wielding citizens with dumb little problems.

Also, 99% of all cops are good people just working like everyone else. They do their job, which is a lot more dangerous than yours, and they do it the way that they were taught. Point out when cops do something truly awful and let the rest of them lead their lives like everyone else. Cops are not part of some fascist conspiracy, get over it.

Grow up Johnny and BoingBoing, This is a waste of good blog space.

Napkins

How do we know she went in for a sammich?

MasterSauce

I know at least six cops and a number of people in the security profession. All of my interactions with cops as well lead me to believe that they are just working stiffs like me. The occasional YouTube video shows me that there are bad cops out there, but on the whole they are a great group of people who would save my life at the risk of their own. Don’t get so high minded about this kids. No harm no foul.

Michael Brutsch

The police are legally allowed to break any law they please, anytime they please. Just get over it.

Takuan

yeah! and they can kill ya too!

hassan-i-sabbah

#50 Kudos for the use of the word “bint”.

jgriffiths

And torture, I mean waterboard ya.

drivenbyboredom

i dont see why a cop couldnt park in front of a fire hydrant
if there was a fire a cop could be radiod at once and get the car removed

that being said, i am pretty sure there is no rule agsinst filming a cop

Hawkman

This guy is the Grizzly Man of street justice! You remember what a whack-job he was? Basically well intended, kinda ballsy – then he loses it. Integrity out the window…until he becomes the lunch of an angry grizzly…will idiots never learn?

Santa’s Knee

Mastersauce:
“Also, 99% of all cops are good people just working like everyone else.”

Uh-HUH.

Apparently you don’t know (m)any cops, do you?

LogrusZed

phillamb168: I wasn’t raised to allow any jagoff in a position of authority, or who want to make you think they have some authority, to get away with shit that any citizen can’t get away with. I was also not raised to allow myself to get steamrolled by people, this means fighting back through varying degrees of escalation, words, shoving, punching, etc.

Generally if I’m calm and someone insults me then I’ll respond in the manner I feel will best shame them. Depending on my perception of their intellect this may be subtle or it may be vulgar, sometimes it is subtly vulgar. If I’m dealing with some form of imbecile or I’m stressed (perhaps anticipating a further escalation into physical violence) then I may go right towards cussing.

You’re treating profanity as if it involved sacred words or words which violate some sacred trust. All swear words do is function as a form of abbreviated emotional indicator. I would put it to you that you have too much reverence for the English language, and that your reverence is not shared by a majority or at least not to a degree that they would insult someone for responding to a cussing out with cussing of their own.

jlbraun

thnk tht cmpct vd rcrdrs r gng t bcm th nrm fr cps n th nxt fw yrs, nd tht t’s gng t drm lt f bd cps t f jb.

DMcK

Man, all this RIGHTEOUS OUTRAGE over the parking violations equivalent of swiping the odd office supply from the mailroom. On her salary I’d be tempted (decent bennies, though!) Yeah, Mme. Recently Retired is an ignoramus, but I’m guessing she left “the job” (traffic officer? receptionist?) some ways back , so who knows how current her knowledge of the laws regarding photography is (assuming she had any to begin with). This “Jimmy Justice” character sure is a peckerhead though (he lost me right at “TRAFFIC NAZIS”).

takeshi

@ MasterSauce:

I take issue with your “no harm no foul” assessment. I, too, am friends with a few cops, but I’m no apologist.

Let’s assume that there is some potential harm that could arise from this. Like, oh, I dunno… the building catching on fire, and the fire department being unable to do their job because this cop didn’t want to walk the extra block.

Yes, cops are working stiffs. Fine. Go ask a hundred working stiffs if they’ve ever received parking citations that they felt were undeserved.

elmlish

This guy sounded like an old school shamer of the Vandershamerson clan from Northern Public Humiliationia . Not the approach my west coast sensibilities would allow, but hey, when in New York, do as the New Yorkers do.

I would have preferred a more smarmily passive aggressive approach, complete with dripping sarcasm and feigned hero worship and maybe a hug filled reconciliation at the end.

LogrusZed

MasterSauce: No reasonable person is suggesting that all or even a majority of cops are assholes when compared to any normal societal standard. However several points should be acknowledged:

1) Cops and related persons are responsible for enforcing laws. If they disregard those laws in matters concerning themselves or other cops then you have a class based justice system in which members on ons profession enjoy an exemption from the general standard which we all must observe. Allowing this to proliferate leads to further trespasses against the public good of a more serious nature.

2) While most cops, just like most non-cops, are good people; the few assholes out there are often protected by what is referred to as a “blue wall of silence”. This is an article of police culture which basically prohibits even good cops from assisting in any investigation of bad behavior on the part of other police officers.

3) While the camera person and many people who support this kind of action are indeed kind of pricks about it, this is usually the kind of party to make the more general populace aware of an issue. It is seldom the moderate party that initiates change, it is typically the extreme minority which makes the larger moderate majority aware that something is taking place and through agitation they stir up the complacent masses into action.

bedlamite23

Wow, does anyone else find it disturbing that the cops weight gets so much attention. How does what she weighs have anything to do with it, I bet if someone said anything about her color, well…you get the idea. And who the hell is this Jimmy guy, yikes what a nightmare he is. Not all cops are bad, some are even dare I say it; Heros … but sadly that doesn’t get as much attention as this, sure she broke the law, twice… but really, is this all this guy has to do with his life? How sad for him.

takeshi

Doesn’t matter how old the video is, or how disagreeable the cameraman is. Cops should be held accountable whenever they break laws.

Todd Sieling

Personally I think all 3 parties were bullshit: the ignorant cop for being so ignorant, the ‘retired cop’ for being a paranoid puppet, and the cameraman for his fetish-like video humiliation project.

Seriously, it wasn’t about watching for law-breaking cops, it was about creating an art project out of humiliating a human. If he really cared about the law being violated by those who are supposed to uphold it, he would have ended it with recording the offense and the car that was involved, and maybe the officer. The following and taunting questions just washed away any good that could have come from it.

Santa’s Knee

@#81:

“2) While most cops, just like most non-cops, are good people; the few assholes out there are often protected by what is referred to as a “blue wall of silence”.”

This makes all of them “Bad Cops” – Qui tacet consentit

takeshi

A few of you are getting hung up on the language issue. Let’s be clear on this. If someone calls you a “tree” and you feel that the words are said in a threatening way, you can have them charged with simple assault. If you retaliate by calling them a “happy-go-lucky astronaut” and they take offense, they can do the same to you.

Giving the finger, shaking your fist, winking, sticking your tongue out, picking your nose, playing a game of pattycakes… all of these can be interpreted as illegal activities. Welcome to America.

And if parking your police cruiser in front of a fire hydrant while you take advantage of your civil servant’s coffee discount prevents a firefighter from doing his or her job, or slows them up in any way, even if only for a millisecond, the perp should be held accountable.

Mitch

The guy filming is really a dink.

I’d give him one warning to get away or prepare
to fight if he did that to me. I’d be badly tempted
to just pop him without a warning, but I believe in
giving people a chance.

Salguod

So, a few things.

I helped with the creation of http://nyc.uncivilservants.org There you can find out everything you want to know (and more, far more) about when an official can violate traffic laws.

When can an official vehicle park in front of a fire hydrant and leave the vehicle? The short answer: only when conducting an Emergency Operation. This term is broader than you might think (it includes, for instance, transporting prisoners) but it simply doesn’t extend to anything that a traffic enforcement officer does.

As for the “oh, she was in the restaurant and could come running out if there was a fire,” note that this doesn’t work. During the daytime only, anyone can block a hydrant *if they stay in the car, ready to move their vehicle*.

That said, I have some very serious issues with how the videographer behaved. There’s a reason why I drafted this language: http://nyc.uncivilservants.org/risk

Takuan

so, you are saying you would commit an illegal, unprovoked assault?

Michael Brutsch

waugsqueke said: “That’s a bit frightening to think that people believe that is true.”

I think you’re confusing “believe that is true” with “believe that *should* be true”. It *is* true, at least in the US (and any other part of the world to which we want to spread Democracy). Police *can* do as they please, and their brethren in blue will back them all the way. I don’t think it’s right, but I have no gun and no badge, so I have no say in the matter.

corpse 1

@phillamb168 (#10): You know, respect is a two-way street. If you watch the video you’ll realize she was the one who started with the language (“Hey asshole”). Because she’s older that somehow makes responding in a similar manner foul play? Come on. Give it to get it.

kip w

It’s okay to have a few dirty cops if they help catch the bad citizens.
It’s okay to have a few dirty citizens if they help catch the bad cops.

Pick one. I think it’s important for the police [including the "world's police"] to follow the rules they’re supposed to enforce. Even if someone who points out their failings says a bad word.

padster123

#61 Wow, does anyone else find it disturbing that the cops weight gets so much attention. How does what she weighs have anything to do with it,”

… well, being so unfit that you aren’t able to do your job might be a concern. And the fact that she’d parked as close as possible to a restaurant – well, you get the point.

As a Brit, I gaze at the sheer colossal bulk of some US police officers, and marvel.

otob

just another white guy picking on a black woman. meh.

Antiglobalism

Terrorism, like “freedom,” is just another word we spew out to feel important and attack those who deviate from our Order of how things should be. This is an interesting demonstration of this neurotic behaviour in action.

bedlamite23

and how exactly does her weight affect her job performance? This fixation of her weight is sick, and way to many people are ok with it. If i said “wow, look how black she is” “oh my god she’s so black” or “how can she do her job and be so black” the uproar would be overwhelming. But her weight, well that’s a free target, so shoot shoot shoot.

I guess all the “Brit” cops are skinny little waifs?

padster123

@#67 “I guess all the “Brit” cops are skinny little waifs?”

In comparision to this example – yes, they are.

I really don’t believe someone would be able to stay in the job of police officer in the UK at that level of obesity. I expect a desk job would beckon, if the condition was judged to be glandular or something.

Being able to stay on one’s feet much of the day, move fast if necessary, is considered to be part of the job.

takeshi

@ Michael Brutsch:

Not true. That’s what they want you to think. Most cities have Code of Conduct offices, and in most cases complaints are taken very seriously. What some people don’t seem to realize, also, is that a lot of Internal Affairs investigators dislike beat cops. A lot of IA are promoted through the ranks, but their review process is understandably very rigorous.

The biggest reason cops get away with this sort of thing is because no one ever complains. There is a belief that making a formal complaint is ineffectual, or that the police might retaliate against the tattletale. All complaints are supposed to be anonymous, and I understand why people would be skeptical, but sometimes the system can work for you. My feeling is that publicly shaming the cops into good behavior might be one way of decreasing the number of these kinds of infractions. Getting people involved is the first step, and unfortunately there is no popular database that I know of where citizens can post badge numbers and voice their complaints. I’ll do a little digging, though.

jahknow

Cory, thanks for bringing to light all the examples you’ve been posting of this sort of bull$hit…

ROSSINDETROIT

Hornet’s Nest, meet Stick.
Stick, Hornet’s Nest.

takeshi

Okay… here’s one.

http://ratemycop.com/

Not sure how popular it is, but it does seem to have search features.

ill lich

To be fair,

1. the guy filming is a jerk (or maybe I should refer to him as a “c*nt”).

2. I don’t think cops should be allowed to break laws for no reason, but a parking violation is OK with me if the cop is on duty (EVEN if they’re just eating lunch)– fireplug laws exist so the FD can access the water, if the cop is right there I don’t see a problem with them getting at the water. (And I don’t particularly like the police, but they are a ‘necessary evil’ in our society, like speed limits or income taxes).

3. “because of the terrorism” is a ridiculous excuse. 9/11 did NOT “change everything” like Rudy loves to say. Making it illegal to film police is pointless- IF a terrorist wants to film the police for some reason he will find a way to do it with a hidden camera; the “law” she cites (if it exists) only hurts law abiding citizens and protects dirty cops.

4. for a PARKING cop, I don’t think her weight matters much. Her suspects aren’t going to be running down the street and jumping fences. Filling that position with someone overweight saves the more able-bodied cops for more important duties.

Elysianartist

Ok, let’s just suppose that that woman really is a cop. Suppose an actual crime happened right there on the corner in front of her, a mugging say. Are we supposed to believe that this “cop” is going to be able to chase and catch anyone?

LogrusZed

I believe M.C. Ren said it, with authority, “Fuck the police”.

rosethornn

Elysianartist:

Body Fascist! Just because someone’s weight prevents them from doing their job properly, that doesn’t mean you should say as much. You nazi, you.

Antinous

Excuse my non-American ignorance, but that’s a joke right? Please tell me that wouldn’t actually be possible?

If you’re asking about being arrested for language, the answer is yes, you can be. Communities can have obscenity laws, usually enforced with a fine. If someone screams obscenities at you, they’re disturbing the peace, which is good for a fine and possibly a night in jail. If someone screams obscenities at you and you punch his head, you can commonly get out of trouble on the grounds that he was disturbing your peace. Free speech rights are not a get out of jail free card.

And Godwin’s Law after only 5 comments. It’s going to be a long day.

shutz

I guess this answers the eternal question “Who watches the watchers?”

Terrorists.

LogrusZed

Elysianartist: I bet she could chase the shit out of a pastry thief; sadly, however, all the evidence was “lost” during the arrest. No, I was covered in crumbs before the chase!

Also: any internet lawyers want to speak out on the notion of the (il)legality of filming our porcine overlords? Citing some official text would probably be a plus.

DMcK

Say it with me now: THERE ARE NO COPS IN THIS VIDEO! Just an underpaid civil servant taking advantage of an unofficial perk, and a couple of other blowhards. Civilians all.

Teresa Nielsen Hayden / Moderator

ElysianArtist, the point is not that the policewoman is overweight — and you have no idea how fast she can move. The point is that she parked directly in front of a fire hydrant, and gave the guy the cold shoulder when he asked her about it. That would have been wrong no matter how much she weighed.

Subsidiary point, the retired policewoman claiming that you can’t photograph or film anyone who works for the NYPD “Because of the terrorism.” Very wrong. Also? She’s retired. Not a police officer. No authority.

NYPD cop: videoing me breaking the law is a terrorist act

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