Canadian Industry Minister lies about his Canadian DMCA on national radio, then hangs up

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37 Responses to “Canadian Industry Minister lies about his Canadian DMCA on national radio, then hangs up”

  1. midnightsimon says:

    hah! delicious!

    I’ll be spreading that link around!

  2. jim.cowling says:

    “I can’t wait for Charlie Angus to play this back in Parliament during the next Question Period: Ministers who lie on national radio about their legislation don’t fare well in Parliamentary democracies.”

    Except that questioners cannot present multimedia materials during Question Period, and they can (and often will) be ejected from the chamber for accusing another member of being a liar.

    Ministers who lie on national radio, or TV, or in the papers, or anywhere else, actually do fare pretty well in Parliamentary democracies. And other democracies.

    Seriously, Cory, evangelism is great and I oppose the legislation with every fibre of my being, but at least know what you’re talking about before you throw around stuff like this. It doesn’t serve the message.

  3. paul567 says:

    @15:

    I would agree that you can’t fault him for answering questions for 10 minutes.

    This being said, Prentice also promised to talk to Canadians about bill C-61. By not agreeing to come on Search Engine again he broke that promise.

  4. David Newland says:

    I’m ruminating over Prentice’s answers to the cleverly and carefully crafted questions, and here’s what I want to know: does Prentice genuinely believe the use cases suggested are marginal, and hence a distraction from the real substance of the bill, or is he willfully obfuscating on these points because they ARE in fact the substance of the bill?

    Despite Cory’s laudable efforts to keep us informed on the issue, I’m still yearning for a balanced “pros and cons” reading of the issue at hand.

  5. CraigGNoble says:

    Okay… so can I use the content of this interview as a defense when I get my arse sued for viewing/using/moving content that I have already paid for?

    I want to get this guy. How can we pin him down and actually get answers?

    ‘Let the market decide’? WTF? WTtGDMFKJFC?

    Does he not realize that he was elected by the citizens? Isn’t his job to advocate the people who elected him?

  6. markhaas says:

    Let me start by saying I don’t know the details of the legislation in question here, but as I listened to this interview, I did not get the sense that the minister was being evasive.

    On the question of overriding the locks on CDs to move jazz recordings to an iPod, I though he was being quite reasonable. He can’t just come out and say it’s OK to do that, because apparently under the legislation it is illegal, and no minister is going to say it’s OK to break the law. However, I though he made it quite clear that while it is illegal, the chances of being prosecuted for this kind of activity are minuscule if not zero.

    On the matter of the cell phone, I thought he clearly said it was OK to unlock it if the intent is to make the phone functional, which is not a copyright issue.

    Can someone point out to me the specific lies, evasions and other bad behavior this minister is being accused of?

  7. Takuan says:

    the bribes are taken, the deal done, Mulrooney V.20 has shipped.

  8. christ says:

    @#33 Markhaas,

    I’m sorry. But come on…

    Let me start by saying I don’t know the details of the legislation in question here, but as I listened to this interview, I did not get the sense that the minister was being evasive.

    So you’re basically saying “I’m uninformed… but here’s what I think anyway”?

    On the question of overriding the locks on CDs to move jazz recordings to an iPod, I though he was being quite reasonable. He can’t just come out and say it’s OK to do that, because apparently under the legislation it is illegal, and no minister is going to say it’s OK to break the law. However, I though he made it quite clear that while it is illegal, the chances of being prosecuted for this kind of activity are minuscule if not zero.

    As #34 Madjo pointed out. Why spend time and taxpayer money writing the law that is basically a poke poke nudge nudge, sure we say you can’t do it but go ahead… That’s just insulting.

    On the matter of the cell phone, I thought he clearly said it was OK to unlock it if the intent is to make the phone functional, which is not a copyright issue.

    Prentice then went on to say that he’d misunderstood the scenario in question and that it’d only be okay if the cellphone were unlocked outside of Canada. Thank you Mr. Prentice for explaining that Canadian Laws only apply in Canada. Derp.

    Can someone point out to me the specific lies, evasions and other bad behavior this minister is being accused of?

    I’m not going to but perhaps taking the time and effort to inform yourself about the bill will help you.

  9. Russell McOrmond says:

    “I oppose the legislation with every fibre of my being, but at least know what you’re talking about before you throw around stuff like this.”

    Not everyone has experience with parliamentary process, or is a weirdo like me that has CPAC on a television beside me and watched Mr. Angus ask questions about Copyright during Question Period today.

    I think Cory does a great job, given the time he has available to do all the stuff he is taking on. I also happen to think that Cory’s understanding of parliamentary process is far superior to Minister Prentice’s understanding of Bill C-61.

  10. Edgar Matias says:

    @33,

    Basically, Minister Prentice was asked very specific questions about the legality of various behaviour, under the proposed law.

    In each case, the answer would be “no”, but the minister didn’t want to admit that seemingly reasonable rights that we currently have would be illegal under the new law.

    So, instead of saying “no, that would be illegal”, he instead answered “yes” to a different question. It went something like this…

    Is it legal to do X + Y under the new law?

    Yes, it’s legal to do X.

    But is it legal to do Y?

    OH, you want to know if it’s legal to do Y?!? Why didn’t you say so? I thought you wanted to know if it was legal to do X.

    Most people don’t do Y. People haven’t done Y for years. Why would you want to do Y? Most people only do X now. X is totally okay.

    Y is… well… technically… illegal under the proposed law… but… uh… no one would ever sue you for it… so don’t worry your pretty little head over it.

    BTW, you’re 10 minutes are up. I gotta go… CLICK

    Here’s an abridged, Non-Evasive English translation of what was said…

    Am I allowed to by-pass a digital lock on a CD that I’ve purchased, in order to put it on my iPod?

    Blah, blah, blah… Yes, you are allowed to copy a CD onto your iPod.

    But, am I allowed to by-pass the digital lock?

    Blah, blah, blah… No, you’re not, but the consequences for breaking the proposed law are minimal.

    I’m a little confused. Do you mean, I should break the law because the record companies won’t sue me? I thought I could be sued for upto $20,000?

    Um… Er… Uh… Blah, blah, blah…

    It might be $20 or $500 or $20,000… It depends on how much they sue you for… You only need to pay if they sue you and win…

    If it makes you fell any better, the police would’t be allowed to raid your house to see if you have stolen music.

    If I’m successfully sued for breaking a digital lock, how much of the money I pay will go to the actual artist?

    All the money with go to the record company.

    Are you doing anything to make sure the artist gets any of the money?

    Blah, blah, blah… No, the record company gets all the money. It’s up to them to give it to the artist, if they feel like it.

    If someone unlocks their cellphone, so that they can use it in another country, is that illegal?

    It is totally legal if you unlock it in another country.

    What if I unlock it in Canada?

    Under the new law, it MIGHT be illegal. It depends on what you do with the phone.

    I gotta go now…

    It looks like the anti-lock breaking provisions of the law make it illegal to record TV shows and watch them later, like what people have been doing for years with VCRs.

    What’s to stop the cable companies (Rogers and Bell) from putting a lock on EVERYTHING?

    That’s up to them to decide.

    If they do that and lose all of their customers as a result, then they’ll have learned not to do that.

    But if they want to try, just to see if their customers fall for it, then the proposed law will enforce their right to try.

    I gotta go now… CLICK

    My apologies for any misrepresentation of what was said. Deciphering political double-speak is tricky business.

  11. markhaas says:

    The rudeness of your reply doesn’t change the fact that it is now you who are being evasive and ducking the questions.

  12. Alys says:

    Well, Jim Prentice’s annual Stampede breakfast here in Calgary is on Saturday July 5th from 9-11am in Kensington in the Osteria de Medici parking lot (that’s Kensington Road and 10th St NW). I’m planning to attend, and I hope other Calgarians will as well.

    As for the interview – though he did give the 10 minutes, he spent most of his time doing exactly what politicians do – dancing around questions, interjecting useless information, and just generally decrying the questions as ‘too technical’.

    What I would like to say to him is ‘If the questions being asked were too technical, then why are you Industry minister?’ It’s his job to understand all of the legislation he’s wanting to pass, and of its possible effects.

  13. Contrasoma says:

    In addition to sending a letter to Prentice, I sent an e-mail to Angus encouraging him to keep pursuing the issue in parliament. I’m not sure that he needs much encouragement given the coverage C-61′s received, but rephrasing “what the hell’s the deal with this bill” as “I’m concerned about copyright legislation and I vote” can’t hurt.

    PS: “Let the market decide”? Then why on earth would we ever require any legislation regarding standards for products sold in Canada? Malware on the new Hip CD? The market’ll sort it out. Lead paint on children’s toys? Someone’ll put together a boycott eventually.

  14. joeposts says:

    He sounds a little shaky. Probably should have studied up on his legislation.

    “I’m gonna have to run here… uh..”

  15. Krytes says:

    I clocked Prentice’s interview at 8 minutes before he hung up, not even the promised 10. Not exactly impressive. Not to mention that a 10 minute interview is entirely inadequate to address a decent percentage of the problems with this bill.

    I’m curious, mrdroctopus: how did you know that Prentice didn’t go to a cabinet meeting after the interview?

  16. Keith Talent says:

    “Ministers who lie on national radio about their legislation don’t fare well in Parliamentary democracies.”

    Ha! Good one.

    I’m chalking this line up to the fact that I suspect you figure if you say it aloud enough, it just might come true.

  17. foobar says:

    What confuses me is why someone who it has been suggested could be a potential future leader of his party would fall on his sword so fully. Does he truly not realize he’s dashed any hopes of getting the top spot in doing this?

  18. madjo says:

    @#33 Markhaas,
    if from the get-go it’s clear that the chances of prosecution for breaking this law is slim to none, then why introduce the law in the first place?

  19. Blackbird says:

    Ahh…another Industry Minister who is short on time in his job. Didn’t the last 3 ministers who tried to bring this up get fired? Or at least moved to a different post? And why was he speaking about it? He seems to be one of very few ministers who are able to speak for themselves within this Parliament.
    Of course, NOW we see why ministers aren’t ‘allowed’ to talk to the media…they may have to answer tough questions. Actually…answer EASY questions…

  20. Takuan says:

    Facebook group to fight Canadian DRM scam now up to 65,000 members

  21. jim.cowling says:

    “Not everyone has experience with parliamentary process”

    And those people shouldn’t make assertions about it from a soapbox.

    Anyhow. By all accounts, this bill is opposed by the Liberals and the NDP. If’n we want this bill to fail, it’s the Bloc that we need to convince.

  22. Takuan says:

    just listened to Prentice: verdict: lying, little pimp-weasel.

  23. wagepeace says:

    I did’t even have to listen to it to know that he is a weasel, but after, its even worse! Good lord, how far will this go before someone realizes that Prentice is just being bought and is now a puppet? I mean…..er…..wait…..don’t we all know that?

  24. mrdroctopus says:

    BTW,

    He didn’t actually go to a cabinet meeting like he said he did.

  25. Jerril says:

    I’m a little sad that this is on Search Engine, and not on the 6:00 news where more of the nation will hear him, but with any luck someone will pull some really choice sound bites for the national news by 4 or 5.

    Or, better yet, one of the bright sparks at the CBC will hold on to choice sound bites, and drag them back out again when the bill goes to a vote in September (assuming it doesn’t get withdrawn before then).

    Don’t let the Cons bury it over the summer and slip it through in the fall session! Keep reminding everyone how ridiculous it is!

  26. Strixy says:

    Interesting….

    I listened to the whole show and discovered that this was the last episode of the award winning, widely popular Search Engine radio broadcast. It will continue as a podcast, web forum, and from time to time on the CBC TV news.

    “Mr. Prentice has specialized in property rights, focusing on relocations, environmental protection suits and restricted development areas.”

    Someone want to explain to whoever placed this guy in office what the difference is between intellectual property and land property? Oh shoot, that would be our PM wouldn’t it. Bloody hell.

  27. noen says:

    Sometimes your job depends on NOT understanding something. This is the result.

  28. hubbledeej says:

    If anyone would actually like some answers to similar questions that Prentice couldn’t answer – the Globe and Mail just did an excellent Q&A with University of Ottawa prof Jeremy deBeer: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20080613.wgtcopyrightchat0613/BNStory/Technology/home

  29. Mister N says:

    Wow…I wonder if the rest of the Conservative Party knows what the current Minister of Industry is doing. In my opinion, if there’s a noticeable public discontent , and the opposition starts doing their job as well, this subject could trigger an election.

    Also, think about this, in the interview the H. Minister of Industry HANGED UP on the CBC. Imagine how he would react if you, a common citizen , write to his office.

  30. jbettineski says:

    “It is difficult to get a man to understand something when his salary depends on his not understanding it.” -Upton Sinclair

  31. eenerz says:

    What happens when a common citizen writes his office is that it gets trashed before it’s read. As what happened to my letter.

    If I did my job this bad I’d be fired. Why can’t I fire Prentice.

    Of course during the next cabinet shuffle he’ll probably get moved to a post that he’ll screw up even more – like Defence Minister or something.

    And people wonder why we have no faith in the system.

    Charie Angus for Prime Minister!

  32. morkuma says:

    my local mp stopped replying to my emails when i started bringing up specific examples of ways this will completely screw the consumer.
    or he ran out of form letters. one of the two

  33. David Newland says:

    Prentice doesn’t exactly come out smelling like a rose, here, but if he said ten minutes and gave ten minutes you can’t fault him for that.

    It is clear, however, that whatever the merits of this bill (are there any? this space has devoted time mostly to its drawbacks), the government is doing a pretty bad sales job on the thing.

  34. themindfantastic says:

    He mentioned the fact that the average consumer (the Grandfather buying a set of music for the third time was the scenario) wouldn’t be worth the time to go after, so is he saying ‘Its okay to break the law, as long as your not a real baddie?’

  35. Peter says:

    14: I think when they stop replying, that’s when you suggest that if they’re not willing to address your issues, it’s time to start another correspondence… with their opponents. Perhaps they need volunteers.

  36. morkuma says:

    #17: i was thinking of doing so, or seeing if he had time to have a “sit down” or phone call with me about the subject. see how quick he is on his feet.

  37. Brad says:

    Is it possible to check to see if he actually had a cabinet meeting to attend 4 minutes after he hung up? And if he attended?

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