@31
That is how you make the reasons. Nobody is going to say they will never remove the Telecom immunity. They will say they are unlikely too. Make it a big deal and say to the parties that you will do something about it and then they will listen.

The whole point of democratic nations is that the people are given some power. Around here when you yell and throw a fit loud enough with enough people you get a change. In dictatorships you yell and throw a fit and you disappear.

@38
It’s only a matter of time until we can organize a community that meets online and enacts change. Right now we’re agitating and annoying. If enough educated people can organize then we can actually have power as well. Don’t think that we don’t need to do this either. Just look at all the corporations. Telecom’s get immunity because somebody asked for it. Corps get what they want with money, we the people get it for our vote and our voice.

“Around here when you yell and throw a fit loud enough with enough people you get a change.”

The trouble is, I can’t help but keep thinking that educated people in positions of power might one day do the right thing without having to be forced into it by public outcry. Never happens, of course, but bless-the-non-existent-lord I wish it would.

You have to be picky I guess in what one should define educated as being. Educated as to how to make change? Or educated as to what change needs to be made, and on what basis?
What we need are people educated as to why the removal of liberties is a bad thing.

The simple solution to that is something I would hope is most inherit but possibly tricky to put in practice. It’s the difference of positive and negative freedoms. Positive being that you are free to do the right thing. Negative being you are restricted from doing the wrong thing. And anyone who has studied child psychology will recognize that argument as being the same as an authoritative vs. authoritarian parenting. Authoritative being seen as a positive freedom. Also authoritative is far more beneficial to the child/citizen. They grow up with a respect of authority and are forced to think about their actions. Something that everyone needs to do a lot more often.

I am decidedly FOR immunity if the telco’s own up to exactly what they did, and carry on with appropriate oversight.

It’s inauguration day – i doubt it will be decided today.

Ray of hope?

Meh, the cynic in me expected this…

The antidote to Hope and Change is reality. And maybe anger. And then action. Demand that the EFF and the ACLU and IJ and all the other civil rights organizations press Obama hard and not give him a honeymoon.

Troops out of Iraq, close the Guantanamo Bay prison camp, stop the spying, prosecute the criminals. Demand it early, demand it often.

Well, the term is yet young. There’s still plenty of time to take in whatever happens.

Well, actually, his record kinda sucks in that arena.

I do have high hopes for what might be a new step forward in equality that he may represent, but none for him in particular. In some ways, I wish McCain had won- the people for whom personal freedom, humane behavior, and responsibility would have been a lot more motivated to truly fix things because then they would have been pissed off and frustrated. Now I feel that they will instead have the wind taken out of their sails, and merely accept whatever is handed on down the line.

but seriously, xeni, why today this post. you trying to killjoy history?

you could’ve waited a couple of days . . .