Comments on: Distance to celestial objects chart http://boingboing.net/2009/04/07/distance-to-celestia.html Brain candy for Happy Mutants Thu, 23 May 2013 05:54:00 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.4.1 By: Azrael Brown http://boingboing.net/2009/04/07/distance-to-celestia.html#comment-459522 Azrael Brown Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-459522 <a href="http://www.infomercantile.com/blog/2009/03/steam-powered-space-ships-1918.html" target="_blank">The scan ModCult posted originally came from my website</a> (but as Jessy said, it's not an unusual image; at least ModCult had the courtesy to link back to me) -- it is from the encyclopedia <i>Our Wonder World</i>, printed around 1918, of which I have a copy and scanned nicely, including removing the seam in the middle. Our Wonder World is a "children's encyclopedia" style multivolume set; the image above comes from a section about outer space, which on one hand was surprisingly accurate given how we see the early 20th century, and although being written with children in mind. The scan ModCult posted originally came from my website (but as Jessy said, it’s not an unusual image; at least ModCult had the courtesy to link back to me) — it is from the encyclopedia Our Wonder World, printed around 1918, of which I have a copy and scanned nicely, including removing the seam in the middle. Our Wonder World is a “children’s encyclopedia” style multivolume set; the image above comes from a section about outer space, which on one hand was surprisingly accurate given how we see the early 20th century, and although being written with children in mind.

]]> By: tastewar http://boingboing.net/2009/04/07/distance-to-celestia.html#comment-459014 tastewar Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-459014 I find it amusing that the concern with airplane travel in space is that "not in airplanes which would fall to pieces with age" rather than the lack of air for the propeller to push. Also cute is the space dirigible. And the space station also with a propeller. Tee hee hee. I find it amusing that the concern with airplane travel in space is that “not in airplanes which would fall to pieces with age” rather than the lack of air for the propeller to push. Also cute is the space dirigible. And the space station also with a propeller. Tee hee hee.

]]> By: SamSam http://boingboing.net/2009/04/07/distance-to-celestia.html#comment-459021 SamSam Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-459021 @shadowfirebird: I love Google's conversion system (though it won't teach you how to do it): <a href="http://www.google.com/search?q=384%2C403+km+per+83+days+in+mph&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a">384,403 km per 83 days in mph</a>: <b>(384 403 km) per (83 days) = 119.908108 mph</b> @shadowfirebird: I love Google’s conversion system (though it won’t teach you how to do it):

384,403 km per 83 days in mph:

(384 403 km) per (83 days) = 119.908108 mph

]]> By: reel aesthete http://boingboing.net/2009/04/07/distance-to-celestia.html#comment-460813 reel aesthete Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-460813 And the way the flag is moving makes no sense. . . wouldn't it burn up anyway. . . or float. . . I suppose this is why they paint them into metal these days. And now I'm remembering a friend who (re)staged the moon landing (via carl rove's plan) and them trying to get the flag "right." Hummmm. And the way the flag is moving makes no sense. . . wouldn’t it burn up anyway. . . or float. . . I suppose this is why they paint them into metal these days. And now I’m remembering a friend who (re)staged the moon landing (via carl rove’s plan) and them trying to get the flag “right.” Hummmm.

]]> By: memoi2001 http://boingboing.net/2009/04/07/distance-to-celestia.html#comment-459024 memoi2001 Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-459024 hehe, "terrific speed" ;) maybe if you make a ramp for a tvg train (450 odd KM/h) we could beat them to saturn ;) bizzare as it may be, I too want this as a poster hehe, “terrific speed” ;)

maybe if you make a ramp for a tvg train (450 odd KM/h) we could beat them to saturn ;)

bizzare as it may be, I too want this as a poster

]]> By: kimnbri http://boingboing.net/2009/04/07/distance-to-celestia.html#comment-459032 kimnbri Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-459032 A race to the sun... "Mission control (STOP), this is solar one (STOP), after 88.5 years we are now landing on the surface of the ...POOF!" "Solar one?" "We've lost the telegraph signal..." A race to the sun…

“Mission control (STOP), this is solar one (STOP), after 88.5 years we are now landing on the surface of the …POOF!”

“Solar one?”

“We’ve lost the telegraph signal…”

]]> By: SamSam http://boingboing.net/2009/04/07/distance-to-celestia.html#comment-459547 SamSam Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-459547 @takeshi: Yup, there are several ways of getting to space, and several propulsion systems available once you're in space. Getting to space you have balloons (BB just had a <a href="http://www.boingboing.net/2009/03/17/teens-send-balloon-i.html">post</a> on kids doing this), <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laser_propulsion>Laser propulsion</a> (I seem to remember NASA sending little spinning cones up pretty high using lasers, but I can't find it now), and probably things like rail guns, as you mentioned. Once you're in space, you have <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_sails">solar sails</a>, the aforementioned lasers, and probably other arcane systems. Thera's a wikipedia category <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Spacecraft_propulsion">here</a> which seems to have about a zillion options, but I haven't looked through it. @takeshi: Yup, there are several ways of getting to space, and several propulsion systems available once you’re in space.

Getting to space you have balloons (BB just had a post on kids doing this), solar sails, the aforementioned lasers, and probably other arcane systems. Thera’s a wikipedia category here which seems to have about a zillion options, but I haven’t looked through it.

]]> By: shadowfirebird http://boingboing.net/2009/04/07/distance-to-celestia.html#comment-459037 shadowfirebird Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-459037 Sorry, maybe I should have been more specific. I'm after the math for a continuous-acceleration journey in actual, newtonian space. Although I'm not bothered with any complications from relativity (and it would probably take too long to explain why). Sorry, maybe I should have been more specific.

I’m after the math for a continuous-acceleration journey in actual, newtonian space.

Although I’m not bothered with any complications from relativity (and it would probably take too long to explain why).

]]> By: Anonymous http://boingboing.net/2009/04/07/distance-to-celestia.html#comment-629021 Anonymous Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-629021 how does this help? how does this help?

]]> By: Anonymous http://boingboing.net/2009/04/07/distance-to-celestia.html#comment-463650 Anonymous Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-463650 The chart seems to assume a straight line of travel, using the minimum possible distance from Earth, without taking into account relative motion. At 120 mph, as others have already pointed out. The chart seems to assume a straight line of travel, using the minimum possible distance from Earth, without taking into account relative motion. At 120 mph, as others have already pointed out.

]]> By: Takuan http://boingboing.net/2009/04/07/distance-to-celestia.html#comment-459571 Takuan Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-459571 “But,” I added, “how can I be sure unless I go there?” “And why not?” I answered myself immediately. “Prometheus once went to heaven to steal fire.” These feverish remarks were followed by the hope of succeeding in such a fine voyage. To accomplish it, I established myself in a fairly remote country house and entertained my imagination with various means of transport. Here is how I betook myself to heaven. I attached to myself a number of bottles of dew, and the heat of the sun, which attracted it, drew me so high that I finally emerged above the highest clouds. But the sun’s attraction of the dew drew me upwards so rapidly that instead of approaching the Moon, as I intended, I seemed to be farther from it than when I started. I broke open some of the bottles and felt my weight overcome the attraction and bring me back towards the earth." “But,” I added, “how can I be sure unless I go there?”

“And why not?” I answered myself immediately. “Prometheus once went to heaven to steal fire.”

These feverish remarks were followed by the hope of succeeding in such a fine voyage. To accomplish it, I established myself in a fairly remote country house and entertained my imagination with various means of transport. Here is how I betook myself to heaven.

I attached to myself a number of bottles of dew, and the heat of the sun, which attracted it, drew me so high that I finally emerged above the highest clouds. But the sun’s attraction of the dew drew me upwards so rapidly that instead of approaching the Moon, as I intended, I seemed to be farther from it than when I started. I broke open some of the bottles and felt my weight overcome the attraction and bring me back towards the earth.”

]]> By: slain by an elf http://boingboing.net/2009/04/07/distance-to-celestia.html#comment-459597 slain by an elf Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-459597 That's neat! Where's my USS Crossbow? That’s neat! Where’s my USS Crossbow?

]]> By: shadowfirebird http://boingboing.net/2009/04/07/distance-to-celestia.html#comment-459111 shadowfirebird Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-459111 sorry, I didn't make myself clear. I'm interested in the math for a continuous-acceleration journey to the planets (and for reasons that are probably too complex to explain here, I don't care about relativity). sorry, I didn’t make myself clear. I’m interested in the math for a continuous-acceleration journey to the planets (and for reasons that are probably too complex to explain here, I don’t care about relativity).

]]> By: shadowfirebird http://boingboing.net/2009/04/07/distance-to-celestia.html#comment-459112 shadowfirebird Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-459112 <p>Sorry, I didn't make myself clear. I'm interested in the math for a continuous-acceleration journey to the planets (and for reasons that are probably too complex to explain here, I don't care about relativity).</p> Sorry, I didn’t make myself clear. I’m interested in the math for a continuous-acceleration journey to the planets (and for reasons that are probably too complex to explain here, I don’t care about relativity).

]]> By: shadowfirebird http://boingboing.net/2009/04/07/distance-to-celestia.html#comment-459115 shadowfirebird Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-459115 Sorry, didn't make myself clear. I'm interested in the math involved in a continuous-acceleration journey to the planets. (For reasons that are too complex to explain here, relativity doesn't matter to me.) Sorry, didn’t make myself clear.

I’m interested in the math involved in a continuous-acceleration journey to the planets.

(For reasons that are too complex to explain here, relativity doesn’t matter to me.)

]]> By: Anonymous http://boingboing.net/2009/04/07/distance-to-celestia.html#comment-459630 Anonymous Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-459630 Man a lot of ppl busted out with real math. 60 is a mile a minute, so 120mph. But, The record for the fastest speed by an unmanned space craft was set by the NASA/German Helios 1 and 2 space probes, which reached 252,800 kph during their orbits of the Sun. Of course, gravity helped. Man a lot of ppl busted out with real math. 60 is a mile a minute, so 120mph.

But, The record for the fastest speed by an unmanned space craft was set by the NASA/German Helios 1 and 2 space probes, which reached 252,800 kph during their orbits of the Sun. Of course, gravity helped.

]]> By: spazzm http://boingboing.net/2009/04/07/distance-to-celestia.html#comment-459637 spazzm Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-459637 <i>Note: IF the journey involves arriving at the destination's surface with zero velocity, THEN you can just calculate the time to travel half the distance, and double that. (With continuous accel., once you're halfway you need to start decelerating.) Of course you'll need to ignore gravity of the sun and planets in this calculation, or it becomes *much* harder.</i> You'll also have to ignore the relative motion of the origin and destination. Note:
IF the journey involves arriving at the destination’s surface with zero velocity, THEN you can just calculate the time to travel half the distance, and double that. (With continuous accel., once you’re halfway you need to start decelerating.)
Of course you’ll need to ignore gravity of the sun and planets in this calculation, or it becomes *much* harder.

You’ll also have to ignore the relative motion of the origin and destination.

]]> By: Jessy Randall http://boingboing.net/2009/04/07/distance-to-celestia.html#comment-459383 Jessy Randall Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-459383 I am the Curator of Special Collections at Colorado College. I found this illustration in a set of books slated for withdrawal from my library. I decided to transfer the set to Special Collections. They are no longer useful as encyclopedias, but are tremendously useful and interesting as a snapshot of the way people thought about the world (and the future) in 1918. I scanned the two-page spread and put it on my Flickr site on January 16, 2009: http://www.flickr.com/photos/jessyrandall/3201185231/. The image linked from BoingBoing shows only half of the two-page spread. I cannot be certain it is my scan, but it seems likely. I am the Curator of Special Collections at Colorado College. I found this illustration in a set of books slated for withdrawal from my library. I decided to transfer the set to Special Collections. They are no longer useful as encyclopedias, but are tremendously useful and interesting as a snapshot of the way people thought about the world (and the future) in 1918. I scanned the two-page spread and put it on my Flickr site on January 16, 2009: http://www.flickr.com/photos/jessyrandall/3201185231/. The image linked from BoingBoing shows only half of the two-page spread. I cannot be certain it is my scan, but it seems likely.

]]> By: Philbert http://boingboing.net/2009/04/07/distance-to-celestia.html#comment-459129 Philbert Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-459129 The propulsion system is visible in the picture: good old fashioned propellors. Proven technology. Why would you use anything else? The propulsion system is visible in the picture: good old fashioned propellors. Proven technology. Why would you use anything else?

]]> By: Philbert http://boingboing.net/2009/04/07/distance-to-celestia.html#comment-459132 Philbert Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-459132 The propulsion system is visible in the picture. Good old fashioned propellors! Proven technology. Why use anything else? Oh, and of course Pluto wasn't listed because they only mention planets. The propulsion system is visible in the picture. Good old fashioned propellors! Proven technology. Why use anything else?

Oh, and of course Pluto wasn’t listed because they only mention planets.

]]> By: Anonymous http://boingboing.net/2009/04/07/distance-to-celestia.html#comment-458883 Anonymous Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-458883 <i>Does anyone know what that system was</i> Considering thet the speed is specified as two miles a minute, and the chart is covered with illustrations of fanciful airplanes, I'm going to guess 'aeroplane'. Does anyone know what that system was

Considering thet the speed is specified as two miles a minute, and the chart is covered with illustrations of fanciful airplanes, I’m going to guess ‘aeroplane’.

]]> By: Anonymous http://boingboing.net/2009/04/07/distance-to-celestia.html#comment-458884 Anonymous Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-458884 Clearly they are rated by the speeds of those awesome Allied airships! Clearly they are rated by the speeds of those awesome Allied airships!

]]> By: Takuan http://boingboing.net/2009/04/07/distance-to-celestia.html#comment-459396 Takuan Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-459396 1918! thanks Jessy! 1918! thanks Jessy!

]]> By: SinisterExaggerator http://boingboing.net/2009/04/07/distance-to-celestia.html#comment-458894 SinisterExaggerator Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-458894 My quick pencil sketch math shows an average speed of 124.163mph to Saturn, 112.007mph to Jupiter at distance / stated travel time in years / 365 days / 24 hours. Roughly in the ball park of the top speed of an old Thunderbird (I'd like to think). My quick pencil sketch math shows an average speed of 124.163mph to Saturn, 112.007mph to Jupiter at distance / stated travel time in years / 365 days / 24 hours. Roughly in the ball park of the top speed of an old Thunderbird (I’d like to think).

]]> By: Anonymous http://boingboing.net/2009/04/07/distance-to-celestia.html#comment-459663 Anonymous Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-459663 Confirmed: Our Wonder World. Have had this hanging in my bathroom for a while, in my collection for years. - Trevor Blake Confirmed: Our Wonder World. Have had this hanging in my bathroom for a while, in my collection for years.

- Trevor Blake

]]> By: Spikeles http://boingboing.net/2009/04/07/distance-to-celestia.html#comment-458897 Spikeles Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-458897 Little more info <a href="http://www.wsfa.org/journal/j04/a/index.htm">here</a> Apparently the image is Copyright, 1914, 1918, by Geo. L. Shuman & Co. Probably from their book series "Our Wonder World" or "New Wonder World". Little more info here

Apparently the image is Copyright, 1914, 1918, by Geo. L. Shuman & Co.

Probably from their book series “Our Wonder World” or “New Wonder World”.

]]> By: spazzm http://boingboing.net/2009/04/07/distance-to-celestia.html#comment-458899 spazzm Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-458899 Two miles per minute = 53.6 m/s, or about 193 km/h, in modern units. Or in other words, about twice the legal speed limit in most places. Two miles per minute = 53.6 m/s, or about 193 km/h, in modern units.

Or in other words, about twice the legal speed limit in most places.

]]> By: SinisterExaggerator http://boingboing.net/2009/04/07/distance-to-celestia.html#comment-458902 SinisterExaggerator Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-458902 If, as stated, you'd get to the sun in 88.5 years, in the year 2000, you'd place yourself in the vantage point of mid-1911. Good call, Spikeles... If, as stated, you’d get to the sun in 88.5 years, in the year 2000, you’d place yourself in the vantage point of mid-1911. Good call, Spikeles…

]]> By: takeshi http://boingboing.net/2009/04/07/distance-to-celestia.html#comment-459416 takeshi Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-459416 This reminds me of a <i>National Geographic</i> article from the 1980s. At the time, NASA was saying we'd be making the voyage to Mars in the early '90s. I think it was supposed to take 6 years, round trip. I wish I knew more about this subject, because I was discussing this with someone just yesterday. Can anyone tell me whether anything besides fuel can carry someone into space? With all these kids sending balloons into space, I'm wondering if we can't use a similar method for takeoff, conserving precious fuel. Or perhaps some kind of rail gun technology. That'd be stellar. This reminds me of a National Geographic article from the 1980s. At the time, NASA was saying we’d be making the voyage to Mars in the early ’90s. I think it was supposed to take 6 years, round trip.

I wish I knew more about this subject, because I was discussing this with someone just yesterday. Can anyone tell me whether anything besides fuel can carry someone into space? With all these kids sending balloons into space, I’m wondering if we can’t use a similar method for takeoff, conserving precious fuel. Or perhaps some kind of rail gun technology. That’d be stellar.

]]> By: Jessy Randall http://boingboing.net/2009/04/07/distance-to-celestia.html#comment-459424 Jessy Randall Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-459424 I take it back, that can't be my scan; mine is much poorer quality. I take it back, that can’t be my scan; mine is much poorer quality.

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