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	<title>Comments on: Will 3D plans for bongs become illegal,&#160;too?</title>
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	<description>Brain candy for Happy Mutants</description>
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		<title>By: querent</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2010/05/15/will-3d-plans-for-bo.html#comment-788993</link>
		<dc:creator>querent</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-788993</guid>
		<description>I am in agreement with you, but the law is not so logical.  Witness p2p vs cd burning.  they&#039;re not trying to outlaw burners, but p2p makes it so _easy_ that they&#039;re going after it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am in agreement with you, but the law is not so logical.  Witness p2p vs cd burning.  they&#8217;re not trying to outlaw burners, but p2p makes it so _easy_ that they&#8217;re going after it.</p>
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		<title>By: nixiebunny</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2010/05/15/will-3d-plans-for-bo.html#comment-788998</link>
		<dc:creator>nixiebunny</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-788998</guid>
		<description>If 3D printers don&#039;t just make stuff that looks like stuff that works, then make me an automobile engine with a 3D printer. 
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If 3D printers don&#8217;t just make stuff that looks like stuff that works, then make me an automobile engine with a 3D printer. </p>
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		<title>By: syncrotic</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2010/05/15/will-3d-plans-for-bo.html#comment-789007</link>
		<dc:creator>syncrotic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-789007</guid>
		<description>Philosophically, it&#039;s an interesting question: if the only step between design and object and is clicking a button, is there any real difference? Well yes, there is. The law can be (and frequently is) arbitrary like that.

But it&#039;ll never really be an issue: there&#039;s no denying that things made out of plastic goop aren&#039;t really useful for much. I think the 3D printer &#039;revolution&#039; is greatly exaggerated. The real revolution will come from small B2B links with China: email them a design for an aluminum part and, three weeks later, get back a box full of them. It&#039;ll never quite be doable at the hobbyist scale, but there might be enough competition to make it a cost-plus-small-profit sort of business.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Philosophically, it&#8217;s an interesting question: if the only step between design and object and is clicking a button, is there any real difference? Well yes, there is. The law can be (and frequently is) arbitrary like that.</p>
<p>But it&#8217;ll never really be an issue: there&#8217;s no denying that things made out of plastic goop aren&#8217;t really useful for much. I think the 3D printer &#8216;revolution&#8217; is greatly exaggerated. The real revolution will come from small B2B links with China: email them a design for an aluminum part and, three weeks later, get back a box full of them. It&#8217;ll never quite be doable at the hobbyist scale, but there might be enough competition to make it a cost-plus-small-profit sort of business.</p>
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		<title>By: LX</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2010/05/15/will-3d-plans-for-bo.html#comment-789271</link>
		<dc:creator>LX</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-789271</guid>
		<description>The main question is: can knowledge be illegal? And how would you know it was if it could be?

Knowing how to kill a man does not make you a homicidal maniac. The only two crime I know of which does not incorporate implicit action, but only knowledge are treason - and even that requires transmission of knowledge vitally important to the country - and instigation of a crime, which requires criminal intention.

So knowledge itself cannot be illegal, only its transmission if it contains secrets of vital importance to a country or is meant to instigate a crime. I fail to see vital importance for any country in plans for a bong nor the intention of instigation to use it for a crime, so it could hardly be illegal, at least in a sane country (I am not 100% sure which countries are sane ATM, so bear with me until we find out).

Greetings, LX</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The main question is: can knowledge be illegal? And how would you know it was if it could be?</p>
<p>Knowing how to kill a man does not make you a homicidal maniac. The only two crime I know of which does not incorporate implicit action, but only knowledge are treason &#8211; and even that requires transmission of knowledge vitally important to the country &#8211; and instigation of a crime, which requires criminal intention.</p>
<p>So knowledge itself cannot be illegal, only its transmission if it contains secrets of vital importance to a country or is meant to instigate a crime. I fail to see vital importance for any country in plans for a bong nor the intention of instigation to use it for a crime, so it could hardly be illegal, at least in a sane country (I am not 100% sure which countries are sane ATM, so bear with me until we find out).</p>
<p>Greetings, LX</p>
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		<title>By: greengestalt</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2010/05/15/will-3d-plans-for-bo.html#comment-789016</link>
		<dc:creator>greengestalt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-789016</guid>
		<description>Well, almost anything remotely controversial can be considered illegal by petty slimy &#039;officials&#039; who like any excuse to pretend they are doing anything other than taking bribes and ignoring any real problems till they become critical.


My issue with this thing is a bong can be made with almost anything and frankly most &quot;Old-school/naturalist&quot; approaches are the best.  First, glass is the best medium, simply because it&#039;s chemically inert for most operations.  Second, while buying a fancy pipe is luxury, just a &#039;glass/masonry&#039; drill bit and any bottle can be converted into one.  Third, even an apple can be made into a bong/pipe.


I wouldn&#039;t necessarily want to make a bong with a &#039;maker&#039; right now, inhaling all that plastic stuff.  Of course they could be used as &quot;Molds&quot; to make other things, such as a modular one that you then melt glass and pour stuff into to make something that&#039;d be too complex for old school glass making as long as you don&#039;t mind welded seams.


Also, as pointed out above, the best &#039;dodge&#039; is &quot;These are pipes ONLY for &#039;Fine Tobacco&#039; or other &#039;Legal Herbs&#039;&quot;...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, almost anything remotely controversial can be considered illegal by petty slimy &#8216;officials&#8217; who like any excuse to pretend they are doing anything other than taking bribes and ignoring any real problems till they become critical.</p>
<p>My issue with this thing is a bong can be made with almost anything and frankly most &#8220;Old-school/naturalist&#8221; approaches are the best.  First, glass is the best medium, simply because it&#8217;s chemically inert for most operations.  Second, while buying a fancy pipe is luxury, just a &#8216;glass/masonry&#8217; drill bit and any bottle can be converted into one.  Third, even an apple can be made into a bong/pipe.</p>
<p>I wouldn&#8217;t necessarily want to make a bong with a &#8216;maker&#8217; right now, inhaling all that plastic stuff.  Of course they could be used as &#8220;Molds&#8221; to make other things, such as a modular one that you then melt glass and pour stuff into to make something that&#8217;d be too complex for old school glass making as long as you don&#8217;t mind welded seams.</p>
<p>Also, as pointed out above, the best &#8216;dodge&#8217; is &#8220;These are pipes ONLY for &#8216;Fine Tobacco&#8217; or other &#8216;Legal Herbs&#8217;&#8221;&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Bartgroks</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2010/05/15/will-3d-plans-for-bo.html#comment-789033</link>
		<dc:creator>Bartgroks</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-789033</guid>
		<description>The funny thing about some of the bong laws is they only target the word &quot;bong&quot; itself. In both Texas and Georgia &quot;bongs can be sold but they have to be sold as &quot;water pipes&quot; Someone asking for a bong will be refused service or asked to leave the store. You see signs saying things like &quot;If it rhymes with wrong then don&#039;t say it&quot; or &quot;Repeat after me &quot;I want to buy a water pipe&quot;

So would it make any difference to such silly statutes if they plans were labeled &quot;Water Pipe&quot;?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The funny thing about some of the bong laws is they only target the word &#8220;bong&#8221; itself. In both Texas and Georgia &#8220;bongs can be sold but they have to be sold as &#8220;water pipes&#8221; Someone asking for a bong will be refused service or asked to leave the store. You see signs saying things like &#8220;If it rhymes with wrong then don&#8217;t say it&#8221; or &#8220;Repeat after me &#8220;I want to buy a water pipe&#8221;</p>
<p>So would it make any difference to such silly statutes if they plans were labeled &#8220;Water Pipe&#8221;?</p>
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		<title>By: AllisonWunderland</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2010/05/15/will-3d-plans-for-bo.html#comment-789034</link>
		<dc:creator>AllisonWunderland</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-789034</guid>
		<description>&quot;What about a design for a working gun on Thingiverse? What if a person with a gun license makes one?&quot;

Most jurisdictions don&#039;t require a &quot;gun license.&quot; Read your Second Amendment. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;What about a design for a working gun on Thingiverse? What if a person with a gun license makes one?&#8221;</p>
<p>Most jurisdictions don&#8217;t require a &#8220;gun license.&#8221; Read your Second Amendment. </p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2010/05/15/will-3d-plans-for-bo.html#comment-791341</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-791341</guid>
		<description>Luckily we still have freedom of speech in the U.S., or at least for now? I can&#039;t see why using the designs would be illegal?

I have the &quot;recipie&quot; to make heroin. But simply having the knowledge of how to do it, doesn&#039;t make it illegal, if I do so, in thus breaking the law, then I&#039;m in trouble.

However, some information, such as information about people in the witness protection programs, or advanced designs for say a nuclear bomb that would enable an ordinary person to create and detonate them, I could understand why mearly the information, would be illegal. In this case there is nothing more than &quot;information&quot; on making a bong. There are designs that show how to make a bong out of household objects, I don&#039;t see why this would be any difference.

Although it&#039;s a thought provoking question, it&#039;s only being raised because it&#039;s technology, and relatively new, and there are not previous legal precedents.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Luckily we still have freedom of speech in the U.S., or at least for now? I can&#8217;t see why using the designs would be illegal?</p>
<p>I have the &#8220;recipie&#8221; to make heroin. But simply having the knowledge of how to do it, doesn&#8217;t make it illegal, if I do so, in thus breaking the law, then I&#8217;m in trouble.</p>
<p>However, some information, such as information about people in the witness protection programs, or advanced designs for say a nuclear bomb that would enable an ordinary person to create and detonate them, I could understand why mearly the information, would be illegal. In this case there is nothing more than &#8220;information&#8221; on making a bong. There are designs that show how to make a bong out of household objects, I don&#8217;t see why this would be any difference.</p>
<p>Although it&#8217;s a thought provoking question, it&#8217;s only being raised because it&#8217;s technology, and relatively new, and there are not previous legal precedents.</p>
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		<title>By: technogeek</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2010/05/15/will-3d-plans-for-bo.html#comment-789040</link>
		<dc:creator>technogeek</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-789040</guid>
		<description>Sure I&#039;ll print you an engine, if you&#039;ll put up the money for the materials and tooling and so on. CNC machining *is* a form of &quot;3d printing&quot;, though by subtraction rather than addition.

For other things: Depends on the 3D printer and what you want. Toy printers typically use low-temp, low-strength materials because they&#039;re cheaper to work with. But for many applications that&#039;s all you need, and there are 3D printers which use more durable materials. In particular, I&#039;m pretty sure there are ones which print a ceramic or related substance which would work for this purpose (maybe after being fired), and in any case even weak plastic would work fine as long as the firebowl is made from something else.

In any case, a water pipe is a pretty trivial device. I&#039;m sure I could throw one together out of off-the-shelf lab glassware in a few minutes, if I had any interest in doing so. Hardly worth &quot;designing&quot;, except for aesthetics.

Drug paraphernalia laws are the equivalent of burglarous implement laws. They let the police confiscate things in the proximity of a crime without having to prove beforehand that these items are evidence of that particular crime. Sloppy solution at best.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sure I&#8217;ll print you an engine, if you&#8217;ll put up the money for the materials and tooling and so on. CNC machining *is* a form of &#8220;3d printing&#8221;, though by subtraction rather than addition.</p>
<p>For other things: Depends on the 3D printer and what you want. Toy printers typically use low-temp, low-strength materials because they&#8217;re cheaper to work with. But for many applications that&#8217;s all you need, and there are 3D printers which use more durable materials. In particular, I&#8217;m pretty sure there are ones which print a ceramic or related substance which would work for this purpose (maybe after being fired), and in any case even weak plastic would work fine as long as the firebowl is made from something else.</p>
<p>In any case, a water pipe is a pretty trivial device. I&#8217;m sure I could throw one together out of off-the-shelf lab glassware in a few minutes, if I had any interest in doing so. Hardly worth &#8220;designing&#8221;, except for aesthetics.</p>
<p>Drug paraphernalia laws are the equivalent of burglarous implement laws. They let the police confiscate things in the proximity of a crime without having to prove beforehand that these items are evidence of that particular crime. Sloppy solution at best.</p>
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		<title>By: fnc</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2010/05/15/will-3d-plans-for-bo.html#comment-789047</link>
		<dc:creator>fnc</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-789047</guid>
		<description>&quot;Dude, those plans belong to my cousin.  He just asked me to let him store them on my server for a while.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Dude, those plans belong to my cousin.  He just asked me to let him store them on my server for a while.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: nutbastard</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2010/05/15/will-3d-plans-for-bo.html#comment-789817</link>
		<dc:creator>nutbastard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-789817</guid>
		<description>  &#124;  &#124; ---TUBE
  &#124;  &#124;
  &#124;  &#124;       ~
  &#124;  &#124;    ~
  &#124;  &#124;  ~
 /    \//
&#124;water// ---smaller tube goes through hole
 \____/ 



there now we&#039;re all criminals</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>  |  | &#8212;TUBE<br />
  |  |<br />
  |  |       ~<br />
  |  |    ~<br />
  |  |  ~<br />
 /    \//<br />
|water// &#8212;smaller tube goes through hole<br />
 \____/ </p>
<p>there now we&#8217;re all criminals</p>
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		<title>By: Zadaz</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2010/05/15/will-3d-plans-for-bo.html#comment-789061</link>
		<dc:creator>Zadaz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-789061</guid>
		<description>Seeing how many kids I know who are willing and able to make bongs out of just about any fruit or vegetable, I&#039;m surprised farmers markets are allowed to happen.  (And this is in a city were both bongs and pot are legal.)

Love all the &quot;Americans are such twits&quot; comments up thread.  Thanks for lumping us all together, I know how much you love it when do it to you wacky foreigners.  Quite a few places in the US bongs and pot are entirely legal.  In other places not so much. And I&#039;m sure some misguided idiot somewhere is writing legislation to ban plans for bongs.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Seeing how many kids I know who are willing and able to make bongs out of just about any fruit or vegetable, I&#8217;m surprised farmers markets are allowed to happen.  (And this is in a city were both bongs and pot are legal.)</p>
<p>Love all the &#8220;Americans are such twits&#8221; comments up thread.  Thanks for lumping us all together, I know how much you love it when do it to you wacky foreigners.  Quite a few places in the US bongs and pot are entirely legal.  In other places not so much. And I&#8217;m sure some misguided idiot somewhere is writing legislation to ban plans for bongs.</p>
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		<title>By: Simon Bradshaw</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2010/05/15/will-3d-plans-for-bo.html#comment-789064</link>
		<dc:creator>Simon Bradshaw</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-789064</guid>
		<description>A couple of people have mentioned the IP aspects of 3D printers; my paper - co-authored with RepRap inventor Adrian Bowyer and one of his students - looking at this from a UK/European perspective is in Edinburgh University&#039;s &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.law.ed.ac.uk/ahrc/script-ed/issue7-1.asp&quot;&gt;&lt;i&gt;SCRIPTed&lt;/i&gt; 7.1&lt;/a&gt;:

&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.law.ed.ac.uk/ahrc/script-ed/vol7-1/bradshaw.asp&quot;&gt;&quot;The Intellectual Property Implications of Low-Cost 3D Printing&quot;&lt;/a&gt;

Criminal law issues were beyond the scope of this paper, although they will certainly arise - as will liability. What happens if I make available a 3D mesh for a car spare and it turns out, either through design flaw or inadequate materials, to fail catastrophically. Who is to blame - me for making available a bad design, or you for using it without making sure it is suitable for the task?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A couple of people have mentioned the IP aspects of 3D printers; my paper &#8211; co-authored with RepRap inventor Adrian Bowyer and one of his students &#8211; looking at this from a UK/European perspective is in Edinburgh University&#8217;s <a href="http://www.law.ed.ac.uk/ahrc/script-ed/issue7-1.asp"><i>SCRIPTed</i> 7.1</a>:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.law.ed.ac.uk/ahrc/script-ed/vol7-1/bradshaw.asp">&#8220;The Intellectual Property Implications of Low-Cost 3D Printing&#8221;</a></p>
<p>Criminal law issues were beyond the scope of this paper, although they will certainly arise &#8211; as will liability. What happens if I make available a 3D mesh for a car spare and it turns out, either through design flaw or inadequate materials, to fail catastrophically. Who is to blame &#8211; me for making available a bad design, or you for using it without making sure it is suitable for the task?</p>
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		<title>By: Fabbaloo</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2010/05/15/will-3d-plans-for-bo.html#comment-789087</link>
		<dc:creator>Fabbaloo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-789087</guid>
		<description>Correction: The source blog is &lt;a href=&quot;http://fabbaloo.com/&quot;&gt;Fabbaloo&lt;/a&gt;, not &lt;a href=&quot;http://futurismic.com/&quot;&gt;Futurismic&lt;/a&gt;. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Correction: The source blog is <a href="http://fabbaloo.com/">Fabbaloo</a>, not <a href="http://futurismic.com/">Futurismic</a>. </p>
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		<title>By: Ugly Canuck</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2010/05/15/will-3d-plans-for-bo.html#comment-789114</link>
		<dc:creator>Ugly Canuck</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-789114</guid>
		<description>What is that?
Is that a suspect device?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBYoNYuUVk0

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What is that?<br />
Is that a suspect device?</p>
<p><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBYoNYuUVk0" rel="nofollow">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBYoNYuUVk0</a></p>
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		<title>By: Ugly Canuck</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2010/05/15/will-3d-plans-for-bo.html#comment-789374</link>
		<dc:creator>Ugly Canuck</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-789374</guid>
		<description>(Gasps in realization)
My God! With a bong like that...I could - dare I say it? - Rule the world!!
I must protect these plans at all costs!!

Seriously, though, it ain&#039;t the knowledge, it is its existence in a externally concretized form (and thus accessible to others) the possession of which may be punished, which the Authorities are aiming at. Like outlawing bibles, or korans, or torahs, or pagan verses....
or in fact the laws outlawing the possession of all or any form of written pornography, for eg., would all be examples of the outlawing of the mere possession of concretized external &quot;knowledge&quot;, that is, information.
I&#039;m sure some would punish others for their mere thoughts, if they could figure out some way to do so.
People have tried quite often to &quot;outlaw&quot; types of thought, or thinking, with which they do not agree, and with which they do not wish to argue. That not having worked very well, they then go after the books and plans, or whatever or whomever else they can literally get their hands on. That can work tolerably well to suppress inconvenient thinking by others, and for quite some time too.
IIRC there was a time when the mere knowledge and awareness of religions other than the local variant of Christianity was, in itself and with nothing more, a good reason to investigate or prosecute on charges of suspicion of witchcraft, not hesitating to use the full spectra of physical torture to elicit &quot;co-operation&quot; in their &quot;investigations&quot;.
The &quot;good old days&quot;.
Have we changed all that much?
I sincerely hope so!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>(Gasps in realization)<br />
My God! With a bong like that&#8230;I could &#8211; dare I say it? &#8211; Rule the world!!<br />
I must protect these plans at all costs!!</p>
<p>Seriously, though, it ain&#8217;t the knowledge, it is its existence in a externally concretized form (and thus accessible to others) the possession of which may be punished, which the Authorities are aiming at. Like outlawing bibles, or korans, or torahs, or pagan verses&#8230;.<br />
or in fact the laws outlawing the possession of all or any form of written pornography, for eg., would all be examples of the outlawing of the mere possession of concretized external &#8220;knowledge&#8221;, that is, information.<br />
I&#8217;m sure some would punish others for their mere thoughts, if they could figure out some way to do so.<br />
People have tried quite often to &#8220;outlaw&#8221; types of thought, or thinking, with which they do not agree, and with which they do not wish to argue. That not having worked very well, they then go after the books and plans, or whatever or whomever else they can literally get their hands on. That can work tolerably well to suppress inconvenient thinking by others, and for quite some time too.<br />
IIRC there was a time when the mere knowledge and awareness of religions other than the local variant of Christianity was, in itself and with nothing more, a good reason to investigate or prosecute on charges of suspicion of witchcraft, not hesitating to use the full spectra of physical torture to elicit &#8220;co-operation&#8221; in their &#8220;investigations&#8221;.<br />
The &#8220;good old days&#8221;.<br />
Have we changed all that much?<br />
I sincerely hope so!</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Ugly Canuck</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2010/05/15/will-3d-plans-for-bo.html#comment-789120</link>
		<dc:creator>Ugly Canuck</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-789120</guid>
		<description>They ought to ban bad plans for bongs.
But not bad-ass ones.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>They ought to ban bad plans for bongs.<br />
But not bad-ass ones.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Felix Mitchell</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2010/05/15/will-3d-plans-for-bo.html#comment-788869</link>
		<dc:creator>Felix Mitchell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-788869</guid>
		<description>Er... nope. Plans for bongs have been around for ages, why would them being 3D plans make a difference in law?

Paraphenalia laws target items whose primary use is for taking drugs. You can&#039;t smoke a bud through a digital file of a bong. Not until I finish the holodeck anyway.

An image of a bong (which 3D plans are a type of) could never be illegal under mere prohibition of paraphernalia because it would quite obviously violate the right to free speech.

Obviously in the future there could be a specific law made to target plans for bongs in the same way plans for bomb making are illegal.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Er&#8230; nope. Plans for bongs have been around for ages, why would them being 3D plans make a difference in law?</p>
<p>Paraphenalia laws target items whose primary use is for taking drugs. You can&#8217;t smoke a bud through a digital file of a bong. Not until I finish the holodeck anyway.</p>
<p>An image of a bong (which 3D plans are a type of) could never be illegal under mere prohibition of paraphernalia because it would quite obviously violate the right to free speech.</p>
<p>Obviously in the future there could be a specific law made to target plans for bongs in the same way plans for bomb making are illegal.</p>
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	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Ugly Canuck</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2010/05/15/will-3d-plans-for-bo.html#comment-789126</link>
		<dc:creator>Ugly Canuck</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-789126</guid>
		<description>The person who failed to adequately festoon the design with bright large red letters, with hands pointing to the words, spelling out &quot;Use at your own risk - designer assumes no liability whatsoever, nor give any warranty , for any use to which this design is put, etc, etc&quot;. 
perhaps the Legislature could helpfully remove or reduce any such liability by statute, just as they impose liabilities and fines by statute for copyright infringement.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The person who failed to adequately festoon the design with bright large red letters, with hands pointing to the words, spelling out &#8220;Use at your own risk &#8211; designer assumes no liability whatsoever, nor give any warranty , for any use to which this design is put, etc, etc&#8221;.<br />
perhaps the Legislature could helpfully remove or reduce any such liability by statute, just as they impose liabilities and fines by statute for copyright infringement.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: BeingBob</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2010/05/15/will-3d-plans-for-bo.html#comment-788871</link>
		<dc:creator>BeingBob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-788871</guid>
		<description>The genie will be out of the bottle (literally).
Then, some dark rainy night, someone will discover plans online for a Castle-Bravo class device.
What rough beast, it&#039;s hour come &#039;round at last...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The genie will be out of the bottle (literally).<br />
Then, some dark rainy night, someone will discover plans online for a Castle-Bravo class device.<br />
What rough beast, it&#8217;s hour come &#8217;round at last&#8230;</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Pantograph</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2010/05/15/will-3d-plans-for-bo.html#comment-788872</link>
		<dc:creator>Pantograph</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-788872</guid>
		<description>Just wait until you can download programs to make your matter compiler spew out ecstasy pills and preloaded heroin syringes.
The future will be weird and wild.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just wait until you can download programs to make your matter compiler spew out ecstasy pills and preloaded heroin syringes.<br />
The future will be weird and wild.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Felix Mitchell</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2010/05/15/will-3d-plans-for-bo.html#comment-788877</link>
		<dc:creator>Felix Mitchell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-788877</guid>
		<description>Citation for what I wrote above:

21 USC Sec. 863
http://www.justice.gov/dea/pubs/csa/863.htm

&quot;d) &#039;&#039;Drug paraphernalia&#039;&#039; defined:

The term &#039;&#039;drug paraphernalia&#039;&#039; means any equipment, product, or material of any kind which is primarily intended or designed for use in ... ingesting, inhaling, or otherwise introducing into the human body a controlled substance, possession of which is unlawful under this subchapter.&quot;

i.e. it has to be a material object.

Later it says that instructions on the use of an object can be used to determine whether its primary purpose is drug taking. So if you fabricate a bong and they find a Thingiverse web page in your browsing history which says &quot;how to fab a bong for smoking weed&quot; then you might be fucked.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Citation for what I wrote above:</p>
<p>21 USC Sec. 863<br />
<a href="http://www.justice.gov/dea/pubs/csa/863.htm" rel="nofollow">http://www.justice.gov/dea/pubs/csa/863.htm</a></p>
<p>&#8220;d) &#8221;Drug paraphernalia&#8221; defined:</p>
<p>The term &#8221;drug paraphernalia&#8221; means any equipment, product, or material of any kind which is primarily intended or designed for use in &#8230; ingesting, inhaling, or otherwise introducing into the human body a controlled substance, possession of which is unlawful under this subchapter.&#8221;</p>
<p>i.e. it has to be a material object.</p>
<p>Later it says that instructions on the use of an object can be used to determine whether its primary purpose is drug taking. So if you fabricate a bong and they find a Thingiverse web page in your browsing history which says &#8220;how to fab a bong for smoking weed&#8221; then you might be fucked.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: jimh</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2010/05/15/will-3d-plans-for-bo.html#comment-789133</link>
		<dc:creator>jimh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-789133</guid>
		<description>win!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>win!</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: arborman</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2010/05/15/will-3d-plans-for-bo.html#comment-788886</link>
		<dc:creator>arborman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-788886</guid>
		<description>Americans are so funny.   Owning a bong (!) is a bad illegal thing, even if you don&#039;t use it.  Owning a gun is just fine, as long as you don&#039;t use it.

What about a design for a working gun on Thingiverse?  What if a person with a gun license makes one?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Americans are so funny.   Owning a bong (!) is a bad illegal thing, even if you don&#8217;t use it.  Owning a gun is just fine, as long as you don&#8217;t use it.</p>
<p>What about a design for a working gun on Thingiverse?  What if a person with a gun license makes one?</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: hassan-i-sabbah</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2010/05/15/will-3d-plans-for-bo.html#comment-788887</link>
		<dc:creator>hassan-i-sabbah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-788887</guid>
		<description>Are the materials used in fabrication suitable for bong construction? I don&#039;t mind breaking laws(kinda like it,in a way) but who wants to smoke thru a device made of suger or some weird ass polmer? Charras and Bud in a Chillum for me.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Are the materials used in fabrication suitable for bong construction? I don&#8217;t mind breaking laws(kinda like it,in a way) but who wants to smoke thru a device made of suger or some weird ass polmer? Charras and Bud in a Chillum for me.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: OrcOnTheEndOfMyFork</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2010/05/15/will-3d-plans-for-bo.html#comment-788888</link>
		<dc:creator>OrcOnTheEndOfMyFork</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-788888</guid>
		<description>Just by tricking me into downloading an image of these plans, I&#039;ve got one strike out of my three allowed infringements before I&#039;m cut off the internet. Thanks for nothing, dood.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just by tricking me into downloading an image of these plans, I&#8217;ve got one strike out of my three allowed infringements before I&#8217;m cut off the internet. Thanks for nothing, dood.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: The Thompson Five</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2010/05/15/will-3d-plans-for-bo.html#comment-788889</link>
		<dc:creator>The Thompson Five</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-788889</guid>
		<description>Once the man catches on I&#039;m pretty sure the answer to all these questions will be &quot;Yes&quot;.  But of course by the time that happens it will be far, far too late, as usual.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Once the man catches on I&#8217;m pretty sure the answer to all these questions will be &#8220;Yes&#8221;.  But of course by the time that happens it will be far, far too late, as usual.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: AnthonyC</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2010/05/15/will-3d-plans-for-bo.html#comment-789405</link>
		<dc:creator>AnthonyC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-789405</guid>
		<description>I have read the second amendment a number of times, and I still have no idea what it means. The version ratified by the states, &quot;A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed,&quot; seems to mean something quite different than the version Congress passed, &quot;A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.&quot;

Frankly, if I had written either of those sentences when I was in school, any teacher would have told me they were ambiguous. This is probably not an accident; most of the constitution was left ambiguous for future generations to work out the details. But which is the one that is part of the constitution? The one with the extra commas, or without? 

Gun rights, and questions about their extent, are important, but it is usually a mistake to think the answer lies in the second amendment itself.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have read the second amendment a number of times, and I still have no idea what it means. The version ratified by the states, &#8220;A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed,&#8221; seems to mean something quite different than the version Congress passed, &#8220;A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.&#8221;</p>
<p>Frankly, if I had written either of those sentences when I was in school, any teacher would have told me they were ambiguous. This is probably not an accident; most of the constitution was left ambiguous for future generations to work out the details. But which is the one that is part of the constitution? The one with the extra commas, or without? </p>
<p>Gun rights, and questions about their extent, are important, but it is usually a mistake to think the answer lies in the second amendment itself.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2010/05/15/will-3d-plans-for-bo.html#comment-788896</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-788896</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t think this is an issue.

The gunsmithing / gun making crowd is a good case to look at, because in that scenario, the difference between law abiding and federal prison is a very simple, stamped piece of sheet metal the size of a quarter[1] that even a simple home machine shop can produce.  No 3-D plans necessary - probably only a paper cut-out required.

And these plans, for full auto rifles, or sound suppressors, etc., are available.  Again, in most cases, you could probably build it from a spoken instruction, especially in the case of a sound suppressor.

Mix in the seriousness of the BATFE and the general headline grabbing LEAs about sexy firearm busts and I think you can conclude:  If plans for illegal objects were going to be unlawful, they would have been a long time in the case of firearms.

[1] drop in auto-sear for an AR-15, for instance</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t think this is an issue.</p>
<p>The gunsmithing / gun making crowd is a good case to look at, because in that scenario, the difference between law abiding and federal prison is a very simple, stamped piece of sheet metal the size of a quarter[1] that even a simple home machine shop can produce.  No 3-D plans necessary &#8211; probably only a paper cut-out required.</p>
<p>And these plans, for full auto rifles, or sound suppressors, etc., are available.  Again, in most cases, you could probably build it from a spoken instruction, especially in the case of a sound suppressor.</p>
<p>Mix in the seriousness of the BATFE and the general headline grabbing LEAs about sexy firearm busts and I think you can conclude:  If plans for illegal objects were going to be unlawful, they would have been a long time in the case of firearms.</p>
<p>[1] drop in auto-sear for an AR-15, for instance</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: lasttide</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2010/05/15/will-3d-plans-for-bo.html#comment-788905</link>
		<dc:creator>lasttide</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">#comment-788905</guid>
		<description>As any head shop employee will tell you: It&#039;s not a bong. It&#039;s a water pipe, and it&#039;s for smoking tobacco and other legal herbs.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As any head shop employee will tell you: It&#8217;s not a bong. It&#8217;s a water pipe, and it&#8217;s for smoking tobacco and other legal herbs.</p>
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