How TSA screeners feel about junk-touching

liamuk

http://tsa.afge.org/index.cfm
https://voices.washingtonpost.com/federal-eye/2010/11/tsa_employees_can_vote_on_unio.html
TSA is unionized afaik

Wormman

Liamuk – good find there, although I note that both articles seem to back up what I’m trying to say. The union representing the TSOs is trying to get the TSA to do something about this ridiculous state of affairs, however their ability to do anything more than releasing a pamphlett is extremely limited by the low level of union membership (which is something they’re trying to reverse by increasing coverage) and US industrial laws which are biased heavily in favour of the employer over the employee.

Anonymous

oh my,theres way to many federal employees and private citizens clustered close together in those airport security areas!

what will they do when some terrorist doesn’t wait to get on the airplane?

Super Nate

Then do the right thing, refuse to partake in this ridiculous illegal policy that makes no-one safer. Don’t quit either, take your employer to court. If I woke up one day and my employer said “grope the customers junk if you want to keep your job” how long before I called a lawyer?
Hint: just as long as it takes to go through the cycle; you’re joking, you’re not, to hell with you.

WorkingDead

I’d rather be homeless or even a prostitute than work for the TSA. At least I would still have my self respect.

regeya

So low wages and a crappy job market entitle TSA workers to act like complete a-holes? Having a better job means I cannot comment on lower-wage people being on a power trip?

Really, Boing Boing?

lectroid

Once again, Nueremberg. Let’s be clear here. Concentration camp workers were signing death warrants. They were committing murder on an industrial scale. They were constructing mass graves.

Just as Obama and Bush are not Hitler, the guy who wasn’t skilled enough, or recieved such a poor education that he couldn’t become an accountant, who isn’t physically disposed to do construction, found a job which, in the beginning at least, seemed to a perfectly reasonable position out of the weather with at least a coating of respectability. It might not be the best job, but hey, it was providing a roof over a families’ heads and food in the fridge.

Now, suddenly, he’s been asked to do something he finds offensive. But odds are, he’s not a lawyer, he’s not a constitutional scholar, he’s had no real law enforcement training. He’s been taught to do a procedure. Step 1. Step 2. Step 3. If someone interrupts you, get the supervisor.

Given this economy, asking them all to walk off the job is smug, entitled, and horrifically classist. Especially given that roughly half of the congress that created the agency made it EXPLICITLY ILLEGAL for these workers to argue with management with any sort of collective voice. Those demanding they quit are asking each and every individual to take a stand for YOUR rights/comfort/convenience while simultaneously depriving them of any formal system that creates a collective buffer that would make such an action possible without risking their own economic devastation.

Once again, I’ll state: Americans are demanding skilled job performance from people being compensated at unskilled labor salaries, and then telling those same people they have no right to demand the training required to do the job.

We get the service we pay for.

Antinous / Moderator

lectroid,

Germans didn’t go to bed in Pleasantville and wake up in the Third Reich. It happened over a period of decades. Desensitizing regular people until they’re able to grope children and harass amputees is a big step down that road toward creating a population that behaves like sociopaths.
Neon Tooth

Given this economy, asking them all to walk off the job is smug, entitled, and horrifically classist. Especially given that roughly half of the congress that created the agency made it EXPLICITLY ILLEGAL for these workers to argue with management with any sort of collective voice. Those demanding they quit are asking each and every individual to take a stand for YOUR rights/comfort/convenience while simultaneously depriving them of any formal system that creates a collective buffer that would make such an action possible without risking their own economic devastation.

Once again, I’ll state: Americans are demanding skilled job performance from people being compensated at unskilled labor salaries, and then telling those same people they have no right to demand the training required to do the job.

We get the service we pay for.

AMEN! Well said.

Anonymous

TSA agents will get a horrific disease in a few years given what we know about continual low dose radiation. They are part of a human experiment only THEY are the rats. TSA agents were TOLD it’s safe but the reality is that RADIATION PROTECTION is ultimately a political process which depends SOLELY on the CONSENT of the STAKEHOLDERS (and they ain’t the TSA agents.) Once again, money is being made on the hapless. Same story, different day. Furthermore, to the TSA agent that thinks he’s serving his ‘country’ – try serving the people that are IN that country…otherwise, you’re going to be real sick real soon. Choose light over darkness my friends.

kathyell

Boo frickin’ hoo.

I keep hearing, “Don’t fly if you aren’t willing to submit to the ‘security’ measures.” So to these poor, put-upon TSA agents, I say, “Quit if you find your job reprehensible.”

Oh, you need a paycheck to pay your bills and you wish it wasn’t necessary to do the pat downs to get one? Yeah, I want to fly without being photographed naked or groped. Neither one of us is getting what we want, are we?

Mitch

The difference is that you will spend a few minutes going through a security procedure that you don’t like, and they will spend 40 hours a week being treated abusively by passengers who are angry about a policy that the screeners did not decide themselves.

Dealing with an obnoxious customer for just a few minutes on the phone is stressful for me. I can’t imagine what it would be like to treated badly in person by people all for a full week.

People seem to think that it’s perfectly acceptable to be impolite to people who are paid to deal with them.
- sapere_aude
  
  “The difference is that you will spend a few minutes going through a security procedure that violates your most fundamental civil liberties, invades your privacy, and subjects you to public humiliation, and they will spend 40 hours a week violating other people’s most fundamental civil liberties, invading their privacy, and subjecting them to public humiliation.”
  
  FTFY

Andrew W

Guys who do mountain top removal need their jobs. The guys who ginned up the astroturf campaign in favour of Walmart needed their jobs. The Enron guys? Needed their jobs. Jerks who created credit default swaps, rent-a-cops who hassle photographers, Xe/Blackwater thugs, being Sarah Palin … those jobs put food on someone’s table.

You name a disgusting, society/planet/dignity destroying job, and somebody is doing it to feed their kids. I fail to see how this is an argument for anything.

Anonymous

Those that do not learn from history are destined to repeat it. Go back to Nazi Germany, it was a slow encroachment with citizens giving up rights for security and at the end of the day, suddenly, they were left with neither rights nor security. Those on the front lines of Nazi Germany were simply apologists for their bosses and politicians policies … right up to the gas chambers. Some one needs to take a stand today, the local TSA agency needs to stand up and say no! Unfortunately they are government employees and they put idiots and clones in place to simply enforce the unconstitutional procedures and then just shrug. TSA has stopped nothing – absolutely nothing – and these new procedures which have been touted as reactions to the underwear bomber would not have caught that guy either! So why is this being rammed down our throats … or up our @#$@#$? One must ask.

Israel and Las Vegas have the best security in the world – those are the models we need to use … and they are both using profiling. Most people think of racial profiling and let out a liberal cry – that’s not the case, we are talking behavior profiling. It can and will work in the US if security is truly our goal, however, the overall goal is, like Nazi Germany, to totally erode our rights and the eventual toppling of our government and way of life. Do not be deceived, it’s been grass roots for year.

Anonymous

There is no evidence that the TSA has ever stopped a terrorist attack. The few incidents since 9/11/2001 have all been stopped by the passengers. The primary changes to air traffic safety that needed to be made were securing the cockpit doors and telling the passengers to resist rather than being submissive to hijackers. The rest is theater of the absurd.

The most dangerous part of an airport is the security checkpoint. That’s where a terrorist would blow himself up and take out hundreds of bottlenecked passengers, resulting in the shutting down of airports all across the country. Terrorists don’t need to get on board planes. There are plenty of malls, sports stadiums, movie theaters, trains, opera houses, cruise ships…

tessuraea

No one seems to have pointed out what I see as one of the more distressing things about this… that they find the bodies of the people they have to touch disgusting.

I’m not sure if I’d rather have a stranger who groped me be disgusted or aroused, but either one is pretty distressing.

And… yeah, I can’t feel too much sympathy, even in this economy. People who need to fly for work are being told not to if they don’t like the new policies – that they can just change their jobs.

I have a tiny amount of sympathy for underpaid, undertrained people without a collective voice, but put against the fact that they’re intimately fondling rape survivors and children… well. It’s kind of losing.

apatheticus

The next time I have to opt out, I’m telling the TSA, “I’ll take the hand job, please.” If these people want to grope me, I’m going to make them feel as uncomfortable about it as possible.

travtastic

Superior Orders

Nuremberg Defense

Yes, unemployment is high, and you can’t snag a job immediately upon leaving your current one. Is this to imply that I would be offered any amount of understanding if I started holding people up at gunpoint to pay my bills?

If the choice is between sexually assaulting people and paying my rent, I’m just going to have to go with the homeless shelter, thanks.

Anonymous

It’s really troubling and pretty creepy that these quotes imply that the TSA workers would be totally cool with touching the genitals of unwilling strangers that they ARE attracted to. Like, if the policy was “only invasive searches for hotties,” most of their objections disappear. Kinda beside the point TSA peeps!

Ned613

Let’s face it, the terroists have won when 40 year old man in business attire threatens to scream.

Neon Tooth

Well, well, well, look at the *very special* boing boing readers looking down on low wage workers trying to make a living. Why am I not surprised? I’m reminded of the self entitled people who come in our bar and don’t think they should have to show an i.d. They treat you like you’re on some kind of power trip and actually enjoy having to deal with some yuppie tard and his i.d., rather than really following the city’s laws, trying to avoid a sting bust, and by extension the shutting down of your livelihood. People are trying to pay their bills however they can. The real villians are the corporate/government bigwigs and politicians looking to make some money or cover their asses. The real villians are the ones that you repeatedly vote into office that insist on bombing poor people all over the world and creating ‘terrorists’ that sometimes inconvenience you.

But don’t you worry, there’s a silver lining: This affects the middle class on up to the extremely wealthy so something just may be done about it. You guys matter you see, that’s why the media’s actually paying attention.

Anyway, I’m glad to finally see something written from the workers perspective.

mugabo

Other jobs that may require a set of professional workplace ethics that conflict with and a worker’s personal ethics:
Defense attorney
Medical professional
Law enforcement
Journalist
Educator
…

mn_camera

To quote the late Nancy Marchand in her role as Livia Soprano: “Oh, poor you!”

Anonymous

You don’t like touching penises all day for a living? Sucks to be you. The only person responsible for the position you’re in for your career is you.

simonbarsinister

Don’t worry, this is just a temporary uncomfortable transitional stage until the “right” people find jobs at the TSA. People who DO like touching strangers penises.

Neon Tooth

I’ve got a solution. Officially make the TSA part of the police or the military and we can all rabidly defend their actions. After all those branches of government are seen as honorable no matter what, furthermore they aren’t looked down on for being low income, minorities or ‘goons’. Now all incidents of wrong doing will be treated with utter skepticism and charges of being un-American.

Guysmiley

Poor, poor rent-a-cops. It must be awful leeching a paycheck from taxpayers to perform security theater for the benefit of politicians.

Zac

Hey, the TSA agents get sympathy from me. I don’t get why there is so much anger directed against them in the comments here. Sure, some of them are jerks, but most of them are just doing their job. It is not their fault that these draconian policies are in place, invading our privacy and wasting our tax dollars.

phisrow

Poor babies, they are just following orders and look how hard their lives are…

Incidentally, anybody up for a line of adorable plush Pedobears, in adorable little TSA uniforms, to be sold in airport giftshops?

chawke

Don’t know how to embed images here so here you go:

http://www.thevolunteer.ca/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/pedobear1-300×300.jpg

http://linnnk.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/tsa-pedobear.png

http://media.photobucket.com/image/pedobear%20in%20tsa%20uniform/Lestat444/myfirstcavitysearch.jpg

http://files.sharenator.com/pedobear_drool_AGES_RESULTS-s350x282-56449-580.jpg

Kerov

“Calling it your job don’t make it right”

- Luke

Anonymous

I’m actually glad to hear it from the other side. While it sucks, and its inconvenient and yeah it’s invasive. If we remember that there are people doing their job. Don’t get mad at the individuals doing their job, get mad at the high level people who don’t have to deal with this BS.

And to those who say to find a better job, or find something better. Get off your ivory tower for a second and realize that may be the best job they can get at the time. It’s a government-ish job and it pays reasonably well. You go and tell these people’s kids that they can’t eat this week because their father/mother doesn’t agree with the policies at his/her job.

murrayhenson

Personally, I hope everyone does everything possible to make EVERYONE in the TSA utterly loathe themselves and their jobs. They should – collectively, they are doing more to ruin the US than any terrorist or terrorist act.
- Neon Tooth
  
  I shouldn’t have used ‘trash’ in my comment but his statement is utterly vicious and childish. Let’s harass workers and make their lives hell. Well done Murray.
  - Antinous / Moderator
    
    Do the workers at WalMart grab your crotch? Do they grab your children’s crotches? Your grandmother’s? Do they make you pull off your prosthetics? Do they dump your ostomy bag all over you?
    
    No? Then what are you on about?
    - Neon Tooth
      
      You’re supporting treating *everyone* in the TSA like hell until they ‘loathe themselves and their jobs’. You’re blaming workers for policies imposed on them by the wealthy. I personally think that our soldiers are committing mass murder around the world in unjust wars that only benefit wealthy oligarchs, but even so I won’t berate them when I see them in the airport. Maybe they should all just quit too? I think the TSA policies are invasive and onerous but I don’t blame the workers for that. I also think there’s an incredible amount of media hype behind these stories, simply because middle class (and up) people are being inconvenienced. I wonder how many of these people will actually file official complaints, or organize for class action suits?

Jeremiah Cornelius

Sympathy for the f*cking Devil.. Boo Hoo Hoo..

Get a job with some dignity, or make more money charging for the same services by hustling on Main St.

Anonymous

The Nuremberg Defence is no excuse.

Anonymous

That’s cool!

“If something doesnâ€™t change in the next two weeks I donâ€™t know how much longer I can withstand this taunting. I go home and I cry. I am serving my country, I should not have to go home and cry after a day of honorably serving my country.” I’m glad this TSA agent goes home and cries, because I’m sure some of his victims also go home and cry. I wish he would go home and write a letter of resignation. Just because he claims he’s serving his country, doesn’t make it so. He’s actually serving Al Queda. If you read the latest issue of Inspire: http://info.publicintelligence.net/InspireFall2010.pdf you can see that Al Queda has a very clear understanding of their path to victory. They will kill us by death with a thousand cuts, bleeding us dry economically, because we spend 1,000 or 1,000,000 dollars on defense for every dollar they spend on offense. And that TSA agent is fitting right in with that, so he may think he’s serving his country, but he’s actually serving Al Queda.

“morale is decreasing for front line TSOs, due in part to an increase in verbal abuse. Each of the 17 TSOs who responded to me detailed a new level of verbal abuse they are experiencing at work.” Good! Americans should not accept this situation. Verbal abuse is a very moderate reaction compared to the physical abuse we are receiving.

“I served a tour in Afghanistan followed by a tour in Iraq. I have been hardened by war and in the past week I am slowly being broken by the constant diatribe of hateful comments being lobbed at me. While many just see a uniform with gloves feeling them for concealed items I am a person, I am a person who has feelings.” Good! Then act on those feelings and quit. It is not normal to touch people like that. That’s why we have those feelings. That’s what people are expressing when they call these TSA agents perverts. It’s not normal or correct to grope strangers, or to look at naked children.

turn_self_off

That’s what people are expressing when they call these TSA agents perverts. It’s not normal or correct to grope strangers, or to look at naked children.

not sure what the deal is in USA, but honestly i would have no issue with the officers looking at naked children as part of the job. That is, as long as they do not get a boner doing so.

Sometimes i wonder if not we have been so underexposed that we no longer know when something is done non-sexually. At least let us assume that unless expressly told, there is nothing overtly sexual going on. Right now it seems that much of the problems with rape and such is that one is supposed to invite sexual activity without saying so to ones desired partner. As such, we end up creating a whole lot of confusion about the signals being real or not.

So i guess one could borrow a term from the TI world, specifically related to firewall configuration, “default deny”. Assume something is denied, unless it is specifically allowed.

Anonymous

The term “professional” is about the farthest thing from describing the thousands of TSA agents I’ve interacted with over the years.

Mall cop is much closer, but at least I have respect for some mall cops.

If airport security is so important why is it done at such a low wage? My not have fully trained police or FBI agents do it?

Anonymous

The use of the term “profession” for any and all occupations did not start with TSA screeners. Office drones are professionals like doctors either; most of us call ourselves that.

Lagged2Death

I am a professional doing my job, whether I agree with this current policy or not, I am doing my job. I do not want to be here all day touching penises.

I’m sure it’s true that most of the TSA screeners feel this way, but this attitude of conformity and compliance – “I cannot offer any resistance to my employer, I can only do exactly as I’m told without complaint” – is part of the reason we have this problem, part of the reason it’s turning out to be difficult to change the system. Why aren’t the screeners themselves offering any hint of resistance to the unreasonable orders they’ve been given?

When did America become the land of the sheep, where the whiff of non-conformity, the slightest hint of independence or rebellion, is considered the ultimate taboo?

Wormman

“When did America become the land of the sheep, where the whiff of non-conformity, the slightest hint of independence or rebellion, is considered the ultimate taboo?”

I guess about the same time you all decided that labor unions who actually defended the right for people to make a stand like this were agents of the devil. My guess is that if the TSOs were unionised and working people had any ability to have a say in their conditions, you might actually have some allies in this fight you’re having. But no, it’s easier to just demonise the poor schmucks who are forced through economic circumstance to carry out their masters’ commands.
- Rindan
  
  Awesome. Just what we need. Unions. That way, we can’t fire the assholes if they do something more wrong than what they are doing AND we get to shell out more tax money to pay their inflated wages. Sign me up. Just like the police unions I am sure they will fight for the rights of citizenry. Oh wait…
  
  Fuck those guys. I am pissed enough ass it is how much of my tax money is going to pay for the jobs of these assholes. The thought of shelling out another tax payer dime for this worthless security theater makes me sick. Wasting billions and billions of dollars on security theater against absurdly small threats is stupid. We don’t need to compound stupid.
  
  If you are an American, you are going to die of something boring. Your heart is going to give out because of the crap you eat or cancer is going to kill because you lived too damn long. The most exciting way you are going to die is maybe in a car or bike accident. Fucking terrorist are not going to kill you. Get this through your thick skulls. TERRORIST WILL NOT KILL YOU. YOU WILL DIE A BORING, COMMON, AND MUNDANE DEATH. STOP WASTING MONEY ON STUPID SHIT THAT ISN’T GOING TO KILL YOU!
  
  So no. Screw these guys. No unions, shitty pay, and less training. It isn’t like these jerks are doing anything useful anyways other than pissing away tax payer money to defend against one of the most absurdly rare ways to die. Investing in lightening rods would be more productive than the radioactive porno scanners and hiring jerks to do a thorough crotch grope. The only good reason to have these jerk unionized is maybe because they might go on strike and we could have the double bonus of not paying them and not having them come to work.
  - Wormman
    
    And that attitude is exactly why you’re not going to see the situation change. In the US, the population (even the supposedly progressive element) has been so poisoned against the union movement that they see them as part of the problem rather than the best way to stand up to corporate tyranny. Do you really think that corporate America is looking out for your best interest ? Do you really think that workers on their own have a chance of standing up to their corporate masters ? Try having a look at parts of the world where unions have been more powerful and you’ll see they they are the agents of change that progressives are always crying out for.
    
    So – you have a problem with government workers getting paid decent wages (because it comes out of your taxes) but have no problem with paying for private corporations charging what they like so they can line the wallets of their executives ? Why ? Are the corporates more accountable ? Do they behave better ?
    
    You’d be better off complaining that your tax dollars are going to corporations which give nothing back, but no, it’s easier to pick on a minimum wage earner who’s been rendered powerless to respond to their employer. Go on – why don’t you go out and spit on a McDonalds employee while you’re at it.
    - Rindan
      
      Where in the hell did you see the word ‘corporation’ any-freaking-where in my post? This isn’t a question of corporations vs unions. There is no corporation involved in this. There is just a government taking money from citizens and paying it out to idiots to screw said citizens.
      
      I don’t want over paid government TSA assholes putting on a tax payer funded security show any more than I want private corporations to do the same. I don’t want TSA assholes paid with my money for the same reason why I don’t want professional rock kissers paid… because they are useless and serve no good to the public at large.
      
      Is a TSA union going to boldly stand up and declare that security theater against one of the most obscure ways to die is stupid and that the lot of them need to be fired and the entire security apparatus needs to stripped down to an old lady with a metal detector? Hell no! They are going to fight to add more workers and pay those idiots more to put on their cute little security show. I would frankly rather burn the money. At least then it would be doing something constructive like making a pretty fire.
      
      Unions are not magical unicorns that solve the worlds ills. They are not altruistic public servants. They are a self interested groups looking out for their members and will happily screw the public at large if it is in the interest in their members. If a union could get tax payers to shell out a million dollars to members to sleep eight hours a day, they would happily do it.
      
      My problem with the TSA is that they spend hundreds of BILLIONS of dollars to defend against one of the least likely ways for an American to die. The last thing we need in the TSA is a union fighting to add more workers at higher wages to see if they can slap a few more billion onto the price tag of this stupid theater. I don’t want those jerks to have a union not because I love corporations, but because I don’t think those security theater idiots should have a job in the first place.
      
      I can think of a lot better places to blow a few hundred billion dollars than defending against a form of death that ranks below choking on your own fucking food. Yes, more Americans die to choking on food they shoved into their own face than die in terrorist caused plane accidents. Hell, more Americans die choking on their own food than that die to plane accidents, period. The whole thing is stupid. The only thing a union is going to do is see if they can slap a few more percentage points to the price Americans are going to shell out for this stupid theater.
    - Wormman
      
      That’s a fair point Rindan and I apologise. I guess that I’m just so used to seeing US posters here define “sticking it to the man” as complaining about government and not private enterprise. Still, unfair of me to paint you with the same brush.
      
      And you’re right – unions aren’t a magical antidote to all society’s ills, particularly in a place like the US where their power has been so diluted by corporate controlled government and a compliant populace willing to believe their lies. However I have been personally involved in union campaigns which have done more social good (and not just for their members) than any number of blog commenters stamping their feet and complaining how unfair it all is.
      
      I still think that if they tried this stupidity out here, the best allies people opposed to it would have would be the workers refusing to comply, and the only way you can have that is with the protection of a union behind you. The fact that a republican senator was so scared of union involvement because it could hold up implementation of more stringent security measures speaks volumes for this. You’re not going to get this overturned without the support of the TSOs. If you think you’re going to get their support by treating them like dirt and blaming them for the decisions of management, well, good luck with that.
- Anonymous
  
  The TSO ARE unionized. That was an Obama campaign promise, and he made good on that promise. He said that they need to be unionized for job security. They are unionized. They can’t be fired for bringing a gun through the checkpoint (see: http://www.kdvr.com/kdvr-tsaworkerbringsguntowork-6389294,0,2040975.story ). Surely if their jobs are that secure, they also can’t be fired for declining to strip search children?
  - Anonymous
    
    NOWHERE in that article says they have a union, and in fact, they DON’T.
    
    The Republican senator DeMint made sure of that: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/01/04/AR2010010403091.html
    
    So you know who to thank their inability to strike over this.
- Super Nate
  
  Because police unions have proven to be fighters for the rights of the citizenry?
  - Wormman
    
    Just because they call themselves a union . . .
    
    Being a true union involves more than just looking after your own members. It also includes the concept of solidarity – supporting other workers in their struggle as well as fighting against oppression in general. Police unions all over the world have been used as strike breakers in the most brutal sense. I’ll be happy to be corrected if someone can provide me an example of where a police union is regarded as being part of the wider union movement.
Crn

I was going to say the same thing.
It’s as if one’s morals and principles are on mute during work hours and then only appear when work is over.

This screening is achieving less than nothing and it’s annoying that “the terrorists have won” is such a tiring clichÃ© when it seems truer every time a story like this is published.

endotoxin

â€œYo TSA. Iâ€™m really happy for you. Iâ€™ma let you finish but Judith Griggs had one of the best woe-is-me stories of all time. OF ALL TIME!â€

amanicdroid

“..whether I agree with this current policy or not, I am doing my job. I do not want to be here all day touching penises.”

You can quit at any time asshole.

DoctressJulia

THIS. XD
Cowicide

You can quit at any time asshole.

Exactly. Quit, assholes.
- Antinous / Moderator
  
  Quit, assholes.
  
  You’ll have to pry my…oh, never mind.
  - Cowicide
    
    I think we have some weird TSA-ESP going on here. I swear to gawd I thought there might be some kind of quip there right after I typed it. But I got distracted by meaningless things like work and left the post there all puckered up and waiting to be quipped.

Ichabod

How long until the TSOs start suing for work place stress/harmful work environment?

Noodlehead

Maybe these fondlers should be asked how many legitimate terrorists they’ve caught as a result of their assaults.

Really, America. Now that we have locked and reinforced cockpit doors, can you please go back the the day when, if you were afraid of blowing up or crashing in an airplane, then you didn’t fly? This nonsense doesn’t do anything to make anyone any safer, and it never will. The “pat downs” are designed to humiliate people into using the backscatter devices to pad Chertoff’s bank account and nothing more.

Anonymous

“I’m (just) doing my job” – worst rationale for abuse ever.

Anonymous

The “I was only following orders” defense is the cowards way out. If you comply you consent to the order. You may as well issue it. If you aren’t willing to defend the dignity of our citizens then what are you defending using the security procedures? Other people?

Avram / Moderator

Everyone talking about how easy it would be for these guys to quit their jobs: Have you looked at the unemployment statistics recently?

I share your disgust at the TSA’s policies, and with the I’m-just-obeying-orders attitude that perpetuates this ongoing Milgram Experiment at our airports. But it’s not like these guys can just walk off the job and snap up a new one in five minutes.

Ultan

“Everyone talking about how easy it would be for these guys to quit their jobs: Have you looked at the unemployment statistics recently?”

These are the same people telling us that flying is a privilege. Well, so is having a job. So is sleeping indoors. On the other hand not committing sexual assault, not conducting unreasonable and warrantless searches and not violating your fellow Americans’ rights is a DUTY. I don’t mind one bit that their following of illegal orders makes them uncomfortable. It should.
Anonymous

“Everyone talking about how easy it would be for these guys to quit their jobs”

No, everyone is talking about how personal consequences aren’t a good enough reason for TSA workers to continue abusing others’ 4th amendment rights for their own financial gain.

Everyone has bills to pay – last time I checked, that wasn’t justification for suspending the constitution, and totally giving up on the idea of personal responsibility.
amanicdroid

(note, you brought up Nurmeberg)
Do you know what the unemployment rates were like in early Twentieth century Germany? It’ not like the soldiers could leave duty and if they could, they wouldn’t have found a job.

I guess the TSA personnel could do the other decent thing and refuse to do patdowns and request a different position. Unfortunately, if that worked for one the rest would demand it and all extra positions would fill quickly.

If they don’t quit, they enjoy touching random peoples junk or don’t dislike it enough to find a real job.
arikol

We all understand the difficulties of finding a new job. But anything is better than willfully throwing away your integrity and honour.
Our countries are built on certain principles, including human rights clauses. If one’s job violates those then I would rather eat out of dumpsters than lose all my morals for a paycheck.
And I have a family, children and need to pay bills. That just doesn’t cut it as an excuse.

morcheeba

What’s up with that last quote? Yeah, I wouldn’t expect a 40 year old to scream, but, he doesn’t expect to get touched in his privates, either. He explained in no uncertain terms what is impermissible behavior and the consequences – that sounds pretty business-like to me. Seriously, what alternative does the TSA give him?

dainel

If it’s so bad. Strike!

michael.belcher

The third quote raises an interesting question for me. Why are screeners largely complacent with this process? I’ve heard of some asking to not be on pat-down duty, but nothing widespread.

Also, why are we, the travelers, making it easier for them to be complacent? Why are travelers not filing complaints with the TSA about the screeners who sexually assault them?
Yes, I understand that the TSA will probably overlook the complaint for a little bit since they were “just doing their jobs,” but further down the line that complaint, or complaints if everyone files one, may keep a screener from getting a promotion. That is a threat the anti-patdown movement can leverage against the frontline TSA staff that hasn’t been raised before. If the staff feel threatened in their pocketbooks then they may be more hesitant to feel people up.

jonw

“Go through my x-ray machine or I’m going to fondle your junk”

Is that how a 55 year old man in a rent a cop outfit acts? Oh yeah, it’s not me, it’s my boss the government.

gotchamedia

SNL’s TSA parody commercial was amazing last night:
http://bit.ly/bgTqPu

carljohnson

A “professional” is someone who is degreed and licensed to practice a certain profession. There is nothing in the TSA ranks that even approaches professional, except perhaps their lawyers. Someone who is not degreed and licensed to practice a certain profession is a junk-toucher.

amanicdroid

Professional means that you make money doing it. Prostitutes are professionals and sluts are amateurs.

Hope this clarifies your understanding of the term.
- Anonymous
  
  You’re using the word in a very modern, typically American sense. The older (and still primary) sense is carljohnson’s.
  
  See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Professional
  - Anonymous
    
    “You’re using the word in a very modern, typically American sense. The older (and still primary) sense is carljohnson’s.”
    
    I’m not *entirely* certain that 1576 counts as ‘very modern’. Or ‘typically American’ for that matter.
    
    (Ref: The OED has extensive etymological notes.)
    
    (PS: The captcha system here, frankly, sucks balls through a straw)
  - amanicdroid
    
    You’re on American servers in the present(modern). Primarily my use is the primary use. Welcome to flexibility of language, back to the 19th century with ye.

IamInnocent

I’d really hate to stop washing my junk for a few days before flying but, hey, we all have to make sacrifices for the country don’t we.

Anonymous

In civilized countries there’s something called “strike”, which is used when the employees feel they’re rights are being violated. That right makes sure that, while they’re not paid for the day, they can’t get fired for striking either.

Can those employees do that in the US?

Mitch

If you think it’s ok subject TSA employees to abuse because of the policies they are required to carry out as part of their job then f_ck you too!

It’s so liberal and anti-authoritarian to condone or defend the abuse of the working class people responsible for the unpleasant task of screening airplane passengers. Right.

The intent is not to violate people. The intent is to make sure that a handful of men armed with box cutters do not kill thousands of innocent people by taking over airplanes and flying them into buildings. Again.

I do not like the current TSA screening procedures more than anybody else and I would honestly be tempted to act out by saying something mean to a screener, but I am also capable of processing information further, having empathy for my fellow human beings, and understanding that the lower level employees are not the ones responsible for the policies that I find objectionable and are not doing their jobs with malicious intent, especially after learning about what the experience is like from the screener’s perspective.

Saying that you don’t like TSA policy is appropriate. Voicing your objections to it by writing to your congresswoman might actually have some positive effect. Dealing with it by calling an employee a molester, a creep, or a pervert is just a way of abusing another human being. They shouldn’t have to deal with that to earn a living.

The last thing we needs is an us vs. them climate in our airports. A more reasonable thing to say to a screener would be “I’m sorry that your employer is putting you in the position of having to do that.”

I appreciate that Anonymous in comment number 63 seems to understand this. It seems to be pretty popular to want to make scapegoats of lower level TSA employees or make callous statements like “quit your job if you don’t like it.”

Anonymous

“Why are screeners largely complacent with this process?” Because even the guys who drove the trains in Poland in 1943 needed jobs right? Quisling had to live somewhere, why not the Prime Minister’s residence?

Seriously, these clowns *should* be made to feel bad about what they’re doing. After a few suicides and armed rampages by TSA agents and maybe more than just civil rights freaks will be paying attention.

Mikeywin

@#25

Godwin’s law comes into effect so early, already?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law

In all seriousness, I think the TSA and DHS are reacting to yesterdays threats, they don’t seem to be saying “Hmmm…what would they try next, they know the underwear bomb didn’t work, so what might they think of next?” Instead DHS and TSA seem to be saying “Well they tried the underwear bomb last, so now that’s what they’ll always try…” Someone either in this thread or another BB thread did bring up a good point, where do the security measures end? when terrorists start blowing up in the security checkpoints, are they going to move security out to the entrance to the airport, or how about the roads leading in?

It just frustrates me to no end that we can launch a robot into space, send it on it’s own 250 million miles away to mars, have said robot safely enter the mars atmosphere, safely make landfall and then remotely control it, yet we can’t seem to comeup with a better solution to security, other than a pretty invasive pat down and a questionable imaging procedure.

P.S. what ever happened to the air puffers? if anyone has any links about why we don’t use them, please post!

~Mikey

Ito Kagehisa

Better not criticize the TSA, they can’t afford to lose their jobs, Christmas is around the corner, and if they don’t have the money to buy the kids a G.I. Joe with the kung-fu grip their wives won’t want to make love to them!

And you know, you better not buy the dolphin-safe tuna, the dolphin killers are just hard working joes trying to get by. They don’t have the money the big guys have to spend on dolphin exclusion technology.

In fact, you’d better not buy a fuel-efficient, less polluting car, the oil workers are just regular guys who don’t deserve to be put out of work. Grandma’s asthma isn’t going to kill her, is it? Maybe we can get her an oxygen bottle.

Hey, I think we’d better not criticize the Chinese companies that murdered babies by putting melamine in the infant formula, those chinese workers were just doing what they were told, too bad about your baby btw.

Woops, I think I slipped somewhere on that slope.

Antinous / Moderator

I do think that some of this is a variation on infantilizing TSA workers.

I also don’t get the classism thing (and I’m a Communist.) The TSA workers and the people getting on the planes are almost always in the same class. If you factor in their benefits and consider hours worked, the majority of TSA workers make more than I do per hour.
- Ito Kagehisa
  
  It took me a minute to figure out what you meant by that!
  
  As for classism, hmmm, I dunno. In the few airports I’ve visited, here on the mid-Atlantic coast, the rank and file TSA employees are primarily African-American or, oddly enough, Middle Eastern looking (not that I’m any sort of authority on semitic peoples, so take that last with a grain of salt). Judging by their accents, they are mostly city folk, so even if they are as well paid as I am, they will have much higher expenses than I have out by the edges of the suburbs. The TSA staff I’ve met don’t seem to be financially in the class of people who travel by air for vacation or pleasure.
  - Antinous / Moderator
    
    http://www.tsa.gov/join/careers/pay_scales.shtm
    
    http://www.tsa.gov/join/benefits/career_benefits.shtm
    
    Now consider that someone like me pays 12.5% FICA, doesn’t get weeks of vacation/sick leave/paid holidays, has no employer retirement plan and is paying $6K annually for insurance. That’s 50% added value.
    
    Who do you think is filling up the seats on the airplanes? The Howells? TSA employees are middle class Americans, just like the people whose crotches they’re poking.
    - travtastic
      
      You know, there will probably be some TSA job openings soon.

Anonymous

Perhaps some of the church clergy should apply for TSA work. They’d feel right at home!

mugabo

Therefore, all members in military service are fine with killing a few civilians once in a while.
All doctors are clamouring to provide life-extending treatments to prisoners sentenced to life.
And every single lawyer or attorney follows this “moral code” that you imagine, which is why guilty accusants can never find a laywer.

sapere_aude

Being familiar with the Milgram experiment and the Stanford prison experiment, I must admit that I can sympathize, to a very limited extent, with the TSA agents. These experiments demonstrate that ordinary, decent people can be turned into monsters under the right circumstances. Make people believe that they have a duty to follow orders, and that the people giving the orders have the legitimate authority to do so and will take full responsibility for what happens, and you can get these people to commit abusive acts against their fellow human beings (Milgram). Or, put people in uniform and give them authority over others with whom they have an antagonistic relationship, without proper supervision, and they will likewise become abusive (Stanford). Combine the two â€“ Milgram’s obedience to authority and Stanford’s unsupervised authority over others â€“ and you’ve created the perfect situation for turning decent people into abusive thugs. This is essentially what the TSA has done to its security screeners; so the behavior of TSA screeners, abhorrent as it may be, is understandable under the circumstances.

However, this does not excuse their behavior. Being able to explain the psychology of why someone commits a wrongful act does not justify that wrongful act or excuse the individual who commits it. Individuals must be held accountable for their actions even if they were “just following orders”. The fact that they believed that they were acting under legitimate authority cannot excuse the mistreatment of their fellow human beings. We have to hold people to a higher moral, ethical, and legal standard than simply following the rules that have been given to them by their superiors. Individuals have a moral, ethical, and even legal duty to disobey rules that are unconscionable, even if those rules come from a legitimate authority.

There is a higher law that trumps any federal regulation, any act of Congress, any Supreme Court ruling â€“ even the Constitution itself. This law is not found in any statute book or judicial precedent; it is not written on parchment or carved in stone. It is found, instead, woven into the very fabric of the human psyche â€“ imprinted upon the conscience of everyone who has a conscience at all. Whether you call it the “Golden Rule” or the “Categorical Imperative”, “empathy” or “compassion”, “respect” or “human decency”, “Î±Î³Î¬Ï€Î·” or “love” â€“ whatever you choose to call it, it is the supreme law, the “natural law”, trumping all manmade laws. It’s the law that tells you that it’s wrong to treat other people in ways that you would find objectionable if someone treated you, or your mother, or your father, or your children, or your elderly grandparents, or your physically disabled friends and relatives, in the same way. It’s the law that tells you that it’s wrong to publicly humiliate an innocent person who has committed no crime except for wanting to board an airplane while wearing a prosthetic leg, or an insulin pump, or an ostomy bag, or an adult diaper. It’s the law that tells you that it’s wrong for a complete stranger to coercively grope the breasts, buttocks, and external genitalia of rape victims, or small children, or the elderly, or people who object on religious grounds, or anyone else, for that matter. It’s the law that tells you that it’s wrong to force people to submit to a virtual strip search by having nude photos taken of them by a machine that can see through their clothes. It’s the law that tells you that it’s wrong to treat innocent people like criminals.

The TSA agents who are implementing this intrusive inspection regime are violating this supreme law; and they ought to be held accountable for it. Yes, they are “just following orders” â€“ but that is no excuse. Yes, I’m sure that they need their job and can’t really afford to quit â€“ but, still, that is no excuse. If they had a conscience, they would recognize that what they were doing was wrong. If they had a heart, they would refuse to do anything that would violate or humiliate the innocent people who they have been entrusted to protect and serve. If they had a soul, they’d protest the TSA’s overly intrusive screening policies, and refuse to carry them out â€“ they’d picket, and they’d strike, and they’d sue if that’s what it took to get these policies changed. And, if that didn’t work, they’d quit their jobs rather than scanning, or groping, or humiliating even one more innocent airline passenger.

So, personally, I’m glad that these folks feel bad about what they’re doing. They should feel bad. But until they feel bad enough about what they’re doing to actually STOP DOING IT, they deserve very little sympathy.

unclemike

Well, looks like I’ll be buying my first kilt soon. Hey, we all have to do our part, eh?

Anonymous

If they brought in something like this here in Australia, I’d ring up the LHMU (I presume they cover airport security, since they’re the prison guard and security personnel union) and find out what the hell they’re doing about this before being rude to the workers. If I knew the airport staff were actually fighting this rather than just complaining about it that would make it us little people vs management rather than the the public vs the whole TSA.
I wouldn’t go out of my way to be rude and insulting to the TSA staff, but rather be politely disobediant.

jackie31337

To echo all the people who say you can choose not to fly if you don’t like the security procedures, you TSA employees can choose not to work for the TSA if you don’t like having to grope people as part of your job.

Mitch

Right. Sorry, kids, Christmas is going to be little meager this year. Daddy doesn’t like what he has to do at work anymore. No unemployment compensation because he quit. If he doesn’t find another job right away we’ll find a way to get by. Maybe we’ll eat cheaper food or maybe we’ll sell the house and find a nice apartment to rent.
- Anonymous
  
  Right. Sorry, kids, Christmas is going to be little meager this year. Daddy doesn’t like what he has to do at work anymore. No unemployment compensation because he quit. If he doesn’t find another job right away we’ll find a way to get by. Maybe we’ll eat cheaper food or maybe we’ll sell the house and find a nice apartment to rent.
  
  You must not be American.
  
  Here in the USA, you don’t quit because you don’t like groping people, you just stop groping people. Then you get fired, then you sue, then you get a settlement and your status changed to “laid off” so you can get unemployment benefits. If you have a buddy with web skills, you also set up a paypal donations page for satisfying your primitive desert religion’s yearly potlatch.
  
  Seriously, are you advocating wage slavery here? It sure sounds like it. You’re saying you think morality has a price, and that price is written on a check every payday. Americans don’t like that sort of idea, or at least Milgram’s ethical 35% don’t like it.
  
  And by the way, I personally have two kids, and I have quit two jobs for moral reasons in the past. We’re also going to have a rather anemic solstice celebration this year, because my kid ran afoul of a school’s “zero tolerance” policy so I had to spend all the holiday money on lawyers. Cry me a goddamn river, Mitch.
  - Anonymous
    
    Awww, would you like a tissue?

Broggly

What keeps mankind alive? The fact that millions
Are daily tortured, stifled, punished, silenced, oppressed.
Mankind can keep alive thanks to its brilliance
In keeping its humanity repressed.
For once you must try not to shirk the facts:
Mankind is kept alive by bestial acts.

I’m not American, but I just wish there was some way to get the TSA workers and flyers struggling side by side against the management and government who make these asinine policies. It’s just such a hard issue, as all the horrible jobs like slaughterhouse workers, prison guards, soldiers and torturers will go to the poor since anyone else isn’t desperate enough to take the job. It’s like the Burakumin and Outcastes being the leatherworkers and gravediggers in old times.

Anonymous

I searched Google for the text of your first paragraph (since it looked pretty plagiarized to me) and when I clicked on the first link returned I got attacked by about ten browser exploits!

If I’d been running IE on Windows I’d be owned now… damn.

semiotix

Of course the policy is terrible, and so is the application of the policy, and when I inevitably run afoul of it I’m sure I’m going to be plenty pissed off at the specific guy who ends up grabbing my nuts. Human nature.

But man oh MAN do I not mind a little pushback from the workers, if only because it cracks the veneer on the Marie Antoinette-style civil libertarianism of some of the people squawking the loudest about this. “What’s this? People still more elite than me are issuing degrees I find objectionable? I shall see to it that the peasants make enormous principled sacrifices on my behalf until this is put right, or I forget it bothers me!”

You people who are calling on people to quit their jobs (during an era of 10% unemployment)–I assume you’ve also given up flying?

GeekMan

Wow, I’ve never seen Godwin’s Law invoked so quickly.

Show a little Goddamn sympathy, people. If you want to be angry at someone, why not WRITE A LETTER to the people in your democratically-elected government who are enabling the TSA to implement these policies, and continue to badger them until they have to choice but to listen. That’s a part how democracy works. So pull your head out of your ass, quit your bitching, and get involved in the process of good civics.

Sure, there are probably some insensitive idiots working at the TSA too, but you can’t paint thousands of workers with the same brush just because they’re employed by someone you don’t like. Being mad at the people who have as little power as you do is completely ineffective, and shows how narrow-minded you are.

Idiots.

Antinous / Moderator

If you want to be angry at someone, why not WRITE A LETTER to the people in your democratically-elected government who are enabling the TSA to implement these policies

Because your letter goes right into the trash can. Unless you have enough money to influence your representative, you don’t have a voice.
- Mitch
  
  Antinous knows. He worked in a senator’s office and he saw where the mail went!
  
  Be a real freedom fighter – talk trash to the working class people who screen you!
  - Antinous / Moderator
    
    Mitch,
    
    Do you really believe that your Senator is going to read the letter that you send? Because that’s high-larious.
    
    I also find it fascinating that you blow a nutty every time San Francisco bans bottled water or toys in Happy Meals, but are adamant that we must be submissive while being manhandled by government goons.
    - GeekMan
      
      I have to say I’m pretty disappointed by your attitude on this subject.
      
      In fact, elected officials do pay attention to feedback from constituents, because senators and congressmen who don’t might find themselves out of a job come next midterm election.
      
      So you don’t think that trying to get involved in democratic civics is the solution? Indeed then, what would you suggest? Blogging about these problems (as boingboing does very effectively) is a great way to raise awareness and get people talking, but it’s just the first step.
      
      Taking such a defeatist stance essentially says that you don’t think democracy works. Perhaps you’d prefer to have all decisions made for you? You can bet that in such a scenario random TSA patdown would be the least invasive violations of your privacy.
      
      If you don’t feel that democracy isn’t working in your country, the key is to get MORE involved, not less. Talk more, talk louder, and DO engage your elected officials. The citizens of a democracy are the bosses, not elected authorities.
    - Antinous / Moderator
      
      Not all citizens are equal, comrade. Money buys votes and politicians almost always obey money. It’s not defeatist to admit that truth. Writing your representative is just one of the weakest options for fomenting change. If even a tiny percentage of people who feel violated actually filed lawsuits against the TSA, that would have a much bigger effect. If you got together with three friends and formed the Concerned Parents to End Airport Child-Groping, you might end up pleading your case on Oprah.
    - GeekMan
      
      Don’t participate in democracy. File a lawsuit. Really?
      
      I give up. There really is no hope for your country.
    - Mitch
      
      “blow a nutty”? You have a diplomatic way of putting things. Christ, what an asshole!
      
      My senator and congresswoman, Russ Feingold and Tammy Baldwin, are both very responsive to their constituents. I’m sorry if things are different where you live.
      
      I never said to be submissive. I don’t even like the TSA’s policies or procedures. I said that after reading about what the screening process is like from the perspective of the workers I’m more inclined to have empathy for them and resist the temptation to act out by saying something abusive to them. Treating the screeners badly isn’t going to have any positive effect. It isn’t going to change policy. It’s just going to make me feel that I’m being all rebellious and standing up to authority at the expense of making another human being have a horrible day at work, and I’m capable of doing better than that.
      
      I don’t like the idea of being frisked to get on an airplane but when I’m in that position I want to be good enough to say “I don’t like this and I’m sorry that they are putting you in the position of having to do it.”
      
      I got into some trouble when I was younger and I’ve managed to bring contraband into jail by slipping it into my crotch when I saw the cop coming, because I knew he wouldn’t want to touch me there. It is a very good place to hide things.
      
      I’ve been groped, by a nice but horny, frustrated, and persistent gay Israeli in Jerusalem, and I’ve also been frisked.
      The feeling is completely different. Unless the person frisking you is doing it incorrectly it does not feel at all like a sexual touch. I was frisked by guards every day in work release when I came back from work. The male guards were pretty uncomfortable touching another man’s groin area and they didn’t, but the female guard was thorough enough to search there. It didn’t feel like a violation. It felt like being touched in a detached and professional way by a guard who was doing her job the way she was supposed to and trying to stop prisoners from bringing drugs or weapons into the jail. I knew that she didn’t get off on it and she wasn’t doing it out of malice. (I mentioned this in an anonymous comment yesterday but someone must have used their power as moderator to supress it.)
      
      The body scans and pat down searches are unpleasant, but can you think of a better way to find a weapon stashed in someone’s crotch? I honestly can’t.
      
      Ben Gurion airport in Tel Aviv had a very effective screening process that consisted of a hand search of all baggage and an interview by a very professional soldier who spoke impeccable English, but I doubt their procedures would scale up well to a large, busy American airport.
      
      I don’t advocate submitting to anything, but it isn’t right to act out by abusing low level workers because you object to the policies they are required to follow.
- Anonymous
  
  Geekman thrust: “If you want to be angry at someone, why not WRITE A LETTER to the people in your democratically-elected government who are enabling the TSA to implement these policies”
  
  and Antinous riposte: “Because your letter goes right into the trash can. Unless you have enough money to influence your representative, you don’t have a voice.”
  
  You are both wrong, and both right.
  
  First of all, most places in the USA have corrupt electoral processes that prevent anything that can be accurately described as “democracy”. We have a plutocracy in about two-thirds of the states, and certainly at the federal level we’re a plutocratic Republic; there are no poor men with access to power, and the more money you have, the more likely you are to get on the federal ballot.
  
  Secondly, your letter will not be read by your representative (unless one of his staffers thinks it’s exceptionally funny or reveals some hitherto ignored key issue that can be used in an upcoming election cycle) but it will most certainly be read. The representative will be alerted as to how many constituents wrote in on either side of any issue that provokes multiple letters. S/He will get a weekly or daily briefing that will include “100 constituents wrote in protesting the dog-shearing tax, and 250 wrote in supporting it. We also have a ten grand campaign contribution from the dog shearing union.”
  
  If you are not a registered voter, and you do not send cash, you’ll be ignored. If you are not a constituent, and you do not send cash, you will be ignored. If you are not one of many voices crying out, and you do not send cash, you will be ignored.
  
  But letters don’t go right to the trash can. And if enough people write letters, it does count for something.

billstewart

In early October I was flying through an airport in the Midwest, and commented to the TSA agent running the baggage XRay that “oh, you’ve got the new naked scanners here too?” and she said “We wish people wouldn’t call them that” – not doing the TSA bullying version of that, but clearly unhappy that she was not only doing something embarrassing at work but that people were telling her they knew.

On the other hand, given the number of TSA people over the years who’ve lied to me that whatever random orders they’ve given me have “always been the policy”, even though I’ve been flying since the pre-Cuba-hijacking days when you were allowed to take guns on the plane, I don’t expect the people doing groping not to be bullies and liars.

Anonymous

Lot’s o’ meanness for the workers here.
TSA officer isn’t really a career you choose, it’s something you end up as to put bread on the table. Futhermore, these guys were working there before pat downs.

Many, if not most, of these people hate their jobs. But~ They also need to eat too.

Anonymous

They don’t want to touch my junk. I don’t want them to touch my junk. I think we can come to some sort of arrangement here.

Anonymous

I find it interesting that pilots are now able to opt out of these searches and invasions of privacy…maybe we should all become pilots? or maybe this is not the way to enforce the will of terrorists?

legotech

For everyone saying these guys are just doing their job because it pays relatively well….starting pay according to USAJOBS.GOV is LESS than THIRTY THOUSAND DOLLARS a year…yes…they are making all of $14 an hour to do this….I make more as a part time security guard for a private company.

There are any number of entry level, no skills required jobs that pay this or more so, while I understand that the job market sucks…get your resume out there and TRY to get another job….hell, apply for every single promotional position within the TSA that doesn’t involve being a screener…you are ALREADY a government employee, you qualify for a helluva lot of jobs on USAJOBS that don’t involve punishing people for refusing to obey.

Hell, join the service if you want to protect freedom, some of the stuff our military does actually does serve this purpose unlike ANYTHING done by the TSA

Reg
(Disabled USN Vet who qualifies for a ton of extra points on a TSA application)

Mitch

They should be making more of an effort to find different jobs to get away from verbal abuse?

Shouldn’t people be making more of an effort to treat them like human beings instead of being verbally abusive to them for doing their jobs?
- legotech
  
  Not what I said Mitch, what I was responding to was the posting here in this particular thread (It’s up at the top of the page there) and their complaints about how they don’t want to do the job as it currently stands where they are “forced” to fondle people. IF they don’t want to do the job, they need to find a different one, not just say “I’m only following orders”
  - Mitch
    
    They ARE following orders. If they refuse to “fondle” people they will be fired. Their job became much more difficult and unpleasant with these new procedures, and people ought to have more empathy for them and treat them like human beings instead of making their job more difficult by treating them badly.
Mikeywin

What jobs are you talking about that are “entry level, no skills required jobs that pay this [$14] or more so”? I live in Syracuse NY, Upstate/Central NY, where arguably the job market is still pretty okay. I searched for an an entire YEAR after graduating a private college in 2006 (back before all this crazy unemployment really started) with a 4 year degree, want to know the only job I could get? Making $9 an hour working for DHL, working 3rd shift 1PM to 10PM. Oh and did I mention I was in the reserves during college? So I even had some Military experience. I have to disagree with your point on the whole relatively well paying jobs for no education/little education. Also, that $14 and greater mark, can either go along way or not go at all depending on where you live.

Anonymous

I’ve been unemployed for the last few years, largely because I’ve had to help care for my autisitc brother after a family break-up. So all the trolls saying I’m some middle class elitist ponce when I say these people should quit this job can stuff it. I’m the lowliest working class unemployed scum living out of my mum’s spare room, wasting my life away as a leech on society’s arse and I look down on these people. At least I’m not molesting strangers’ kids.

Neon Tooth, I happen to live in a civilised country, so I’ve never been carded trying to buy alcohol. Then again, I haven’t looked younger than 16 since I was 12. And yes, if you choose to sell alcohol and follow laws that enforce blanket carding of everyone in violation of their right to privacy and to not be accused of a crime without evidence, get a different job is the right advice.

EH

If the TSOs were smart they would take the pat downs too far and cause more complaints to be generated.

This whole thing is going to need a real firestorm to eliminate, there is too much money and too many egos involved for it just to slink back into whatever hole it came from. “Chris Wallace is going to have to be convinced,” is the level of firestorm that I’m talking about, and I don’t believe Chris Wallace is speaking against this yet.

Today we have Mr. TSA saying the procedures are not going to be modified. That tells me the head of the entire TSA is pretty much staking his job on people cowing to this. He does not appear to be anticipating imminent unemployment, is still on TV, and nothing else is happening outside of bloviators like myself spewing bile on blog comments instead of calling my chain of political command. The TSA is worthless to complain to about this, ignore them. Politics is the only way anything will change here.

How TSA screeners feel about junk-touching

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