This seems like a good time to talk about trains

As we wrangle with airport security this holiday season, let's all take a moment to give thanks for trains. Here's a map of the US showing recent investments in rail, and the long-term plans for what our train system could someday become. Some of this will be true high-speed travel. Other corridors are simply spots where small (and relatively cheap) upgrades in infrastructure—not to mention increased enforcement of passenger train right of way—can fix a broken system and make trains a viable competitor to increasingly onerous air travel.

Granted, I'm not sure I buy the argument that train travel is somehow immune to the creeping specter of excessive security. But, for now at least, it's got the potential to be a pleasant alternative.

Maggie Koerth-Baker is the science editor at BoingBoing.net. She writes a monthly column for The New York Times Magazine and is the author of Before the Lights Go Out, a book about electricity, infrastructure, and the future of energy. You can find Maggie on Twitter and Facebook.

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jwb

In practice train travel throughout Europe is free from TSA-style stupidity, but I fully expect the USA to screw it up and make train travel just as bad as air travel.
Anonymous

I got all indignant when I saw the map graphic depicting a train from Chicago to Iowa City, then saw it was a proposed route, which made me even more indignant. My folks live in Chicago and I went to college in Iowa City…a 3 to 3.5 hour drive in a straight line through corn. Making that drive once or twice a month (give or take) was miserable. It made so much sense to me to have a train route between those two cities, given the number of Iowa students who hail from the suburbs of Chicago.

Furthermore, last spring I took a vacation out to San Francisco on the train. I started in Naperville, IL, and ended in Emeryville, CA, 2 days and 6 delicious meals later. I can’t say enough about the trip. My boyfriend and I had a roomette – two large, moderately comfy facing seats with pull out table between us, all of which converted into bunkbeds at night. Meals were included in the price of the ticket and roomette, and they were suprisingly tasty…I had salmon and asparagus one night for dinner, and bison meatloaf the next. We wandered the train, had lots of leg room, practiced our German on a couple we met at breakfast one morning, and generally had a fantastic time.
It was the same price to get there on the train as it was to fly back to Chicago 4 days later on our red-eye flight,where we were crammed in to tiny seats, deprived of sleep by a very cranky baby one row up, and subjected to a very cranky man swearing profusely at the attendants. Lovely.
curiousrobot

The new Governor of Ohio has gleefully proclaimed our rail system dead in no uncertain terms and vowed to return the federal funds. So there’s that.
- Anonymous
  
  We’ve got the same problem here in Wisconsin on the proposed Milwaukee to Madison route. The newly elected Republican Governor has vowed to send the money back after being told he can’t use it for roads instead.. He has begun to capitulate after outcries for the loss of jobs the $800+ million would provide, so there is still a glimmer of hope here.
- dculberson
  
  Actually, even more amusingly, he wants to kill the rail program but also wants to keep the federal money, all $400mm of it. Kasich wants to spend it on “roads or freight rail.” Given that Ohio hasn’t received the money yet, it’s unlikely that they will if Kasich does kill the passenger rail project. It would be a spirited fight, at least.
  
  http://www.dispatchpolitics.com/live/content/local_news/stories/2010/11/09/copy/kasich-wants-rail-funds-used-other-ways.html?sid=101
- Anonymous
  
  I suspect that Ohio is not alone in having proposed train schedules that are less than convenient (for day trips at least, not to mention commuting). Additionally, few Ohio cities have easy or quick public transportation once you arrive. Given the state budget and proposed cut backs in many social services, it is hard for me to justify spending money on trains that very few people will use given the proposed schedules and existing public transit.
  
  I love the idea of taking a train to see a concert, sporting event, or just go out for an evening but that is impossible with the current plan.
  
  http://www.dispatchpolitics.com/wwwexportcontent/sites/dispatch/local_news/stories/2010/01/30/train_large.jpg
- JD
  
  I found Kasich’s total maniacal vehemence against this project very strange. It’s like a personal vendetta for him to have it killed. Oh, and I loved the idea that he thought he could kill the rail project and keep the money to use for something else. I believe Washington disavowed him of that pretty quick. A train must have killed his puppy when he was little or something. It’s just bizarre. (Not his killing the project, just how personal he made it in all seem.)
- hershmire
  
  All it takes is one jerk terrorist with a terrible plan to get these backscatter things in every major rail station. Or worse, on every train. Either that, or a major attack will convince the Feds to stop subsidizing train travel and then you’ll be forced to fly.
  
  Additionally, flying is so damn fast. Business travelers, the airlines’ bread and butter, will never switch to trains. You can’t postpone a meeting for 6 days just so your CFO can take a train from LA to NYC. Those execs and salesmen are going to put up with backscatters because they have to; and they pay the big bucks.
  
  Rail works really well in Europe because huge population centers are close to each other and fewer people have cars. That’s why the East Coast train corridor is so (relatively) efficient. Closer cities mean more passengers mean more money to fund the infrastructure. When commercial flying first became viable, the Great Western Railways that once bound the nation together shriveled. It just takes too damn long compared to flying to go where it’s worth going.
  - Anonymous
    
    Trains don’t need to be an alternative to all air travel–I agree that they’re very unlikely to be a substitute for getting from, say, LA to NY. But take a look at a mid-range scale. There’s lots of major cities just a few hundred miles from each other–far enough that a car trip is (on the personal scale) a bit of a hassle and (on a large scale) really inefficient, fuel-wise. This is especially true for people traveling by themselves, who can’t get any work done while driving, and who might spend two hours on each end of a 1-hour flight dealing with getting to the airport + security (plus weather delays).
    
    There’s lots of other regional areas that could use a rail corridor. People keep mentioning LA-SF, which makes a lot of sense. Portland/Seattle, Houston/Dallas, all seem like decent candidates for routes.
  - Symbiote
    
    “Rail works really well in Europe because huge population centers are close to each other and fewer people have cars”
    
    That’s the wrong way round: fewer people have cars in Europe because trains work really well. Loads of car owners use trains — my parents own two cars, but they only drive the 100-mile journey to visit me if they’re moving lots of stuff, otherwise they take the train.
    
    @rhinoman: Pry out a rail and the signals will all turn red. Assuming your big rock weighs about as much as a car, you’ll be unlucky if the passengers on the train don’t walk away from the derailment (if the train derails).
    You may as well say you’ll police the whole road system in case someone pours oil over the road or puts a rock on it.
AnthonyC

I don’t think trains are “immune” from security theater, but I do think they’re relatively resistant.
For one, trains can’t be hijacked- they’re restricted to tracks. They can be blown up, but so can any other public place. Only difference is that train passengers are unable to leave if it turns out someone is trying to blow up the train.
msl87

I guess you missed all the news about the GOP trying to kill rail investment.

http://www.businessinsider.com/republicans-rush-to-kill-high-speed-trains-2010-11
MB

The TSA occasionally shows up at DC’s Union Station to make nuisances of themselves for Philly and NYC-bound travelers. I’d expect more of this.
Anonymous

When I was in the US earlier this year I took the train from Denver to San Francisco. 36 hours through truly stunning scenery in a large comfortable seat with acres of leg room; I will never forget the experience. I was so glad I didn’t fly TSA or no.
halkun

Wisconsin too. The incoming Governor is killing the rail project.
grimc

I’m pretty sure a while back BB linked a story about an Amtrak security chief (may have been TSA itself) that liked to hold unannounced security drills ‘just to put the fear of god’ into people. That’s pretty much a direct quote, IIRC.

So I think the assholes are in place at Amtrak, they’re just waiting for funding.
Anonymous

I fly 3-9 times a year, but took my first train trip this past September to get to the Penny Arcade Expo.

It was quite discombobulating that, after my ticket was stamped, I was simply waved through an open door with my luggage in hand.

I think I’ll be traveling north more frequently now that I know how easy it is (and cheaper than renting a car).
MikeKStar

Train donâ€™t run out of Wichitaâ€¦unlessinâ€™ youâ€™re a hog or a cattle. People train runs out of Stubbville.
- Anonymous
  
  guess we can only make our travel to areas that the train is headin’ outdoorpeople
therilesyouknow

’cause no one EVER tried to hijack a train! right?
- merreborn
  
  ’cause no one EVER tried to hijack a train! right?
  
  I’m not sure hijacking a train is as practical today as it is in a western film.
  
  Trains are on rails, so there aren’t many places you can take them. And now there are many forms of transportation that are faster, and law enforcement has a pretty solid presence nationwide.
  
  In contrast, in your average western, the train is probably the fastest form of transportation around, and there may not be a single lawman within hundreds of miles to stop you.
  
  Some quick google research only turns up a handful of train highjackings in the last few decades worldwide. When was the last time someone hijacked a passenger train in the US?
discount sushi

I’m glad that the Chicago to Omaha line is finally fixing the fact that Amtrack currently is a hour to two hour drive from any population centers in Iowa.

I don’t know much about the other lines, but I hope the outcome and goal is to make train travel a more viable option that is also easier for more people to access.
- Anonymous
  
  that route runs through my city. we used to take the train to chicago until the early 70`s. today it`s coal and container trains 24/7.
  
  i hope they do put the passenger trains back on this line
piminnowcheez

God, the best transportation experience of *any kind* I’ve ever had is the Shinkansen in Japan. You just show up with your suitcase, with or without a reserved seat, walk on the train, sit down in a nice comfy seat plenty big enough for a mid-sized American butt (and downright spacious for your typical scarcely-there Japanese butt), let the refreshment lady bring you snacks and beers, and zip along to your destination. If we had something like it here, I’d never fly again.

Snif. I miss you, refreshment lady. Arigato gozaimasu for the memories…
- VICTOR JIMENEZ
  
  I had exactly the same experience with the Shinkansen: I said “Who needs planes when you can just do this?”
  
  No waiting time, no wastefull security checks, no delays for bad weather, wide seats, no nausea, no air bumps…
Ugly Canuck

Oh, I’ll just let Harry Nilsson sing out, what I’ve got to say:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=84DauEmPRAk

…and I’ll only add, that I think that it’s a crying shame, too.
Ninjahippie

You must have missed the last election.
C.B.

I recently rode the AMTRAK California Zephyr Line from Chicago to Galesburg (I was going to visit family in Iowa) and WOAH, what an experience!

Everyone who worked on the train was incredibly nice and my goodness, there was a lot of room. There had to be at least a 2.5 foot gap between the seats in Coach plus the seat doubled as a recliner. There was a sightseeing car that had panoramic windows and big comfy chairs facing towards the window. Below the scenic floor of the car was the “cafe” (I can’t really remember what they called it) where one could buy anything ranging from snack-type foods to fully cooked meals and booze.

I don’t know what I’m going to do if they install those porno-scanners at Union Station… maybe just take the MegaBus to Iowa City but that’s not nearly as much fun as the Zephyr was.
Anonymous

But trains are profoundly un’murkin.

Sigh, getting around Germany on the DB was fast, efficient and largely hassle free.
Dawn deMom

I wouldn’t mind taking a train but there is nothing from Central Montana to Phoenix Arizona. If I were willing to take a few days to get to my destination, it might be do-able. You can check out an Amtrack Route Map here: http://www.mapmash.in/amtrak.html

Making reservations is not too easy. If we want to take Amtrack we need to drive nearly 2 hours north, then the train leaves once a day. If I leave on Saturday afternoon from Havre, Montana, I would arrive nearly 4 days later in Maricopa, Arizona station. That’s assuming I could get all my connections without problems. The time I’d get to Arizona is just after 11:00pm local time. It took me 30 minutes to figure this out from my computer. They don’t calculate the connections for you (at least not that I’ve found – if there is a website that does, PLEASE let us know!)

I’ve driven from Montana to Arizona in two days. I prefer to do it in three, staying two nights along the way. It’s a nice drive if you don’t have to GET THERE NOW. And I don’t have to be irradiated or molested to get into my car!
murrayhenson

I recently took a train from Krakow to Warsaw and back.

By car it would be, roughly, a 300 kilometer drive lasting 4 hours and 20 minutes (each direction). It would cost roughly $48 USD in fuel (and that’s with a car that gets 45 MPG) alone for that journey (fuel in Poland is about $5.75/gallon (and that’s CHEAP)), not to mention the cost of parking in the city center ($12-$25/day) and wear-and-tear costs.

The trip, by train, takes about 3 hours, 15 minutes and costs 140 PLN or about $45 USD. The train station in each city is centrally located and, since I was visiting Warsaw, I stayed in the Holiday Inn about a third of a mile from the train station – so, no costs associated with taxi, rental car or any of that. The trains were more or less on time. Admittedly, this is one of Poland’s better train journeys but …this is Poland we’re talking about! Travel 400 kilometers to the west and everything gets a whole lot faster, cleaner and even more efficient and on-time.

Compare this with Amtrak: almost guaranteed to be more expensive than driving, slower and far less convenient.

This is not to denigrate Americans/the US – merely to point out that any journey long enough to make one think about taking a journey via plane in the US is, realistically, too long to make one think about alternatively taking the train unless you aren’t in a hurry and don’t mind the expense and inconvenience.

America, on the other hand, has an excellent network of roads, highways and interstates on which you can usually do 65-75 MPH running on (admittedly artificially) inexpensive fuel with food and lodging almost always near by and also relatively inexpensive. With a bit of caffeine and will-power one can *easily* do 12 hours a day (~700 miles). The upside is that once you get where you actually want to be you won’t have to rent a car or find a taxi, nor will you have to worry about a schedule that Amtrak has no intention (or ability) to adhere to, nor any random security measures they may feel like flinging at you.

Take control – take a road trip. Get a few cans of Red Bull, pack your bags as heavy as you damn well please and get in your car! You’ll be glad you did.
lemonlime

We’ll see how long this lasts. Janet Napolitano wants to expand scanners to Amtrak. http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/130549-next-step-for-body-scanners-could-be-trains-boats-and-the-metro-
- Mark Frauenfelder
  
  As long as she doesn’t have to endure them, Janet Napolitano will require scanners on every form of transportation imaginable.
Walt Guyll

Cross country high speed rail is a pipe dream; every state along the route will demand the train to stop within it’s borders, slowing the trip considerably.
AirPillo

Well, you can’t fly a train into a building, and you can’t force strict security onto every form of transit that keeps lots of people close together. Eventually you’d simply need so many screeners that you’re going to start hiring criminals or people who are literally just mentally incapable of comprehending the required training.

The TSA’s standards are already pretty lax, imagine how bad it would get if we screened all mass transit and the qualifications for an agent with the power to detain and search citizen were set as low as the qualifications of a Wal-Mart janitor.
Donald Petersen

About 12 years ago I wanted to visit a girlfriend in Salt Lake City, but the 11+ hour drive from Los Angeles wasn’t sounding all that interesting. So I thought I might Go Amtrak, figuring there must be a rail line paralleling I-15 or something. Even if it wasn’t high-speed, I figured I could snooze, maybe catch up on some reading and writing. Went onto Amtrak.com to see what they could do.

Wow. The Southwest isn’t the web of rails that the cowboy movies of my youth led me to believe. Back then, the route Amtrak planned for me took over two days and involved a couple of buses and a side journey to Texas. Even today, the best Amtrak will do for that trip on a representative Saturday involves a 3-hour bus trip from downtown LA’s rather large Union Station to Bakersfield (cyanide pills extra), a four-hour train ride from Bakersfield to Stockton, another hour by bus to Sacramento, and then, finally, a fifteen-hour train chug to SLC. You leave downtown LA at 1:45 AM Friday and arrive in Salt Lake at 3:05 AM on Saturday. And pay $174 for the whole one-way misadventure, frakyouverymuch. For an additional $26 I could fly Southwest and get there in under two hours.

Tellya what, Boingers… next time I feel the need to visit the Salt Palace or shop at ZCMI, I’ll bring passengers, charge ‘em $25 a head, and plan my itinerary thus: from my house, 210 freeway west to San Berdoo. Left on I-15. Pedal to the metal for ten hours. Disembark.

I feel kinda bad that mass transit fails to such a huge degree for longish trips out here. But there it is: long live the road trip!
Anonymous

I am an Australian and never been to America, but from what I read in the comments, you are not really a fan of America’s train system. Australia is considering a high speed rail system up our east coast, but I would be surprised if that gets up. Australian governments seem to fear big investment projects.

I am a firm believer in peak oil, I truly believe that even with developments in technology there will be nothing to replace cars, trucks or planes with in the next 20 years. The price of fuel will continue to go up, making train travel more viable. They can travel up to 250 miles an hour and could be a quality replacement for planes if you got a good network. So trains are the future.

A lot of people might say, that to run all that track would be too expensive for America who is in a bad economic position at the moment. I think it would honestly be a great investment right now, because it will kick start local manufacturing for all the projects, creating tens of thousands of jobs.
- mn_camera
  
  A lot of people might say, that to run all that track would be too expensive for America who is in a bad economic position at the moment. I think it would honestly be a great investment right now, because it will kick start local manufacturing for all the projects, creating tens of thousands of jobs.
  
  Yes, it would, and that’s one of the reasons – the other being the word “public” in the term public transportation – that motivates those inclined to kill passenger rail here in the US, in all their self-righteous, predatory, freeper-ish frenzy of libertarian sociopathy.
alexb

My family and I flew to the US this summer and travelled from New York to Washington and then Washington to Chicago, flew Chicago to Portland and took the train from Portland to Seattle.

Without exception the trains were clean, efficient and the views out of the window fascinating and beautiful.

The flights however – OMG!
Every single flight was delayed. Every single one of our connections was only made by running full tilt from one end of the airport to another and then hurriedly stripping shoes, belts, coats etc. to make it through security. The TSA were fine, polite and efficient, this was before the new scanners, but what a mess.

Amtrak by contrast was wonderful. Great staff on the trains. Comfortable seat, the kids had a brilliant time.

I use Eurostar to travel in Europe quite a lot and that too is great. About 2.5 hours to get to Paris and apart from a metal detector and X-raying your bags, security takes about 1 minute.

Oh and US customs could really take a leaf out of UK customs and actually be polite to people!
Anonymous

I’m pretty tired of the TSA. At this point, unless my life depended on it, I’ll be traveling by train.
nuschu

$24 Chicago to St Louis, no one bothers me, just show my ID and ticket, sit down, plug my laptop into the outlet, watch movies and jump off at my destination.

Yes there can be delays, but honestly, I’d rather spend time sitting on a train rather than getting to/from the airport and sitting in a terminal somewhere.

The thing to keep in mind about Amtrak is that the ticket prices escalate based on how many tickets have been sold, same goes for room or business class add-ons. The earlier your buy your ticket the cheaper it is.
jwb

Los Angeles to SLC is too far for rail to make sense. Chicago to St. Louis makes perfect sense.

I once saw some British guy complaining that there was no reasonable rail route from New York to Los Angeles, and I pointed out that there’s also no reasonable rail route from London to Tehran, which is the same distance.
- AlexG55
  
  LA to SLC is 625 miles. That’s less than Paris to Madrid, say, where there’s a regular train service (overnight, admittedly).
Ugly Canuck

n American song, from the days when Americans found trains inspiring:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmBKHSZ1pcU

…all the way from Cali-for-ny-ay…
- AirPillo
  
  Classy link is classy. Good choice!
Anonymous

I’ll ride Amtrack again … when .. Hell freezes over, then add a decade.

I thought train travel would be “romantic” , peaceful calm slow, elegant. I took a trip from South Bend (IN) to Boston a few years ago, and it was literally “Hell On Wheels”. Amtrac is running cars that havent been updated or cleaned in decades. The bathroom door was broken and just in front of us “wafting” smell all night. The heater didnt work and a passenger behind us searched out paper bags to sleep in on the floor because the night before the cabin was about 40 degrees going over the rockies. Passenger trains have to give priority to freight (because amtrack no longer owns the lines). Train showed up late about 5 hours and was 5 more hours late into Boston. A 12 hour trip turned into 22 hours …

All in a “day car” because they didnt have any more night cars (with liftable feet) that looked and smelled like they were throw-aways from the 60s.

And the passengers were as bad. Constantly pestered by near-homeless trying to tell me their pathetic life stories. A total drunk woman stressing a new Nunn to the brink of ex-communicaiton. A dinner car which only catered to the sleeper (first class) people.

On the trip back I complained and got an “upgrade” to sleeper which was *slightly* better, except the toilet didnt work, the shower was intermittant. The double-deck bunks were terrifying as the train heaved and howed back and forth I was afraid I’d fall off. The TV didnt work (steward says it hadn’t worked in 20 years). All for about 3x the cost of a plane trip.

I dont care if they add more track … if they cant improve the rolling stock and service whats the point. Its *literally* cattle-class … and thats being nice to the cattle.

-David lee
- Anonymous
  
  Over the years I’ve spent over a month on Amtrak and I’ve never had a single trip as bad as the one you describe.
  
  I think, at least in the last five years, that those sorts of trips are isolated examples rather than the rule.
  
  On the other hand, I realize we’re all in a hurry sometimes — outside of the Northeast Corridor, that probably means flying.
hab

I miss the convenience and pleasure of rail travel in Europe, but it unfortunately does not translate well to the U.S., with the exception of the northeastern corridor. The reality is that it would require huge subsidies and having every citizen pay for a service that relatively few would use will not sell politically anytime soon.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-bloggers/2558950/posts
- piminnowcheez
  
  it would require huge subsidies and having every citizen pay for a service that relatively few would use will not sell politically anytime soon
  
  It’s a good thing the national highway system isn’t subsidized or anything.
  
  Okay, less snarkily, the post you linked to was interesting, but not (to me) convincing. The high-speed rail plans for the US are primarily meant to do the same thing that they do in China: connect metropolitan areas at intra-regional distances where train travel makes the most sense. Given the ongoing trend toward urbanization, and the ongoing trend of suckification of flying, It’s hard for me to believe that ridership is going to be a serious problem for well-planned high speed rail lines.
  
  Further, the author’s back-of-envelope estimate of per-mile cost is only as good as a wild guess. It’s true that labor costs are lower in China, but extrapolating the cost of an entire US rail network from one recent project in the UK is methodologically suspect.
  
  Finally, when making a cost comparison between road and rail, it’s important to note that the cost of travelling by auto is only going to increase, both in direct costs to the consumer (gas prices), and uncaptured externalities (pollution, time lost to traffic congestion). If you figure in both the initial infrastructure investment and the projected costs of maintenance going forward, I think rail would compare very well to continued investment in road.
  - Antinous / Moderator
    
    If you put in high speed rail from LA to SF, there’d be a six month wait to buy tickets.
    - piminnowcheez
      
      If you put in high speed rail from LA to SF, there’d be a six month wait to buy tickets.
      
      Agreed — in fact, it’s one of the best candidates for a fast rail line I can think of — although I think this is an outlier in terms of distance relative to the rest of the country. Miami to Tampa or Orlando is another similar example I can think of.
      
      Man, can you imagine a high-speed rail connecting LA – SF – Portland – Seattle? It’s a hell of a lot of distance, but what a boon to the West Coast it would be. Shit, I’m actually drooling.
    - SKR
      
      “If you put in high speed rail from LA to SF, there’d be a six month wait to buy tickets.”
      
      You’re high.
Anxst

I for one do not welcome Wisconsin’s new, rail-project-killing Governor-Overlord. It was one of the things I made sure all my friends knew about…and half of them still voted for him, without citing a real reason they did so. They just “felt it was time for a change, and the Democrats weren’t changing anything.” Thanks for researching candidates and voting based on issues, America. *sigh*
Wendy Blackheart

I’ve got to say, train travel ain’t that bad – I take regional rails quite a bit. I live in NYC, and my family lives on Long Island, where I grew up, so I take the LIRR there. My fiance lives in Philly, and I sometimes take regional rail there as well – NJT to Trenton, where you can get SEPTA. Its not a bad ride, and both SEPTA and NJT have ‘quiet’ cars if you want them, which is nice. (I really hope the LIRR does that. There is NOTHING worse than an obnoxious, drunk, Long Islander. I spent 20 years there, I know this to be true)

The only problem I have with Amtrac is that for my trips (to Philly) it tends to be pricier than all the other options. Its about 50-99$, last I checked, for a ride that is 90min to 2 hrs. Regional Rail can take 2 1/2 to 3hrs, and costs about 24$ (The one upside to the LIRR is the peak/off peak tickets. NJT is always the same price)

I’m finding buses quite a good way to go these days. For the past year, I’ve taken the Megabus and BoltBus between Philly and NYC at least 4 times a month or more, and when the service is good, its great. Cheaper than all the other options, and no stops, like Grayhound, makes for a pretty good trip.

Plus, no one fondles me before I get on the bus or train, and that is quite nice.
TEKNA2007

I’m sure someone out there in Al-Qaidaland is thinking of a checklist that goes like this:

1 – Planes? DONE
2 – Trains? Next!
3 – Automobiles – soon!

Bomb Bomb Bomb, die Auto-Bomb.
Anonymous

no one mentioned Megabus or Boltbus?

Just took Boltbus from Philly to NYC, and Megabus from NYC to Albany. Both were a third of the price of Amtrak and had better and more frequent scheduling. I booked the boltbus at the last minute on my phone when I saw a bus drive by (I had not heard of them before) — free wifi and power outlets too.

Rail is dead.
Gnatcatcher

I’m surprised there hasn’t been anyone on here from the northeast corridor commenting about what a great alternative to planes they are here on the east coast.

Getting to my in-law’s in DC from my apartment in Boston by plane, it takes an hour to get to the airport by T, 1/2 hour by cab; got to allow an hour to board, plus maybe an hour for security; a direct flight takes an hour or so; then another hour or so to get from BWI by car, or 45 by public transportation from National, so call it five hours.

Same trip by train, I walk five minutes, get on the T to Back Bay in another ten minutes, catch a train to Union station (which takes roughly six hours on Acela, eight hours on a regular train), where I can change to the Metro, fifteen minute ride and walk down the hill to their place, so call it 7-10 hours.

Neither one of those is at all appealing with a toddler and a preschooler, so we usually end up driving (which, with lots of pit stops and horrible traffic usually takes us at least twelve hours) when I go with the whole family, but when my wife goes down there for a few weeks in the summer, I usually go and visit them by taking the train back and forth. Totally worth a couple extra hours to avoid the hassle of dealing with airports, security, needing someone to drive and pick me up at BWI, etc.

The last time I was on that route, I was sitting next to a guy who was heading up to Boston from Providence for dinner, taking the train round trip. It seemed very civilized.

I’ve also traveled a lot on Amtrak in the rest of the country (mostly on a month-long all you can ride pass) and it’s basically a nightmare unless you’re focused on the amazing, bizarre scenery and your frequently amazing, bizarre traveling companions.
adamnvillani

I’m a huge booster for trains (I ride the subway in L.A. every day) but do note that if you’re going to expand and improve the passenger rail system in the U.S., you can’t do it by kicking freight trains to the curb and think you’re doing the environment any favors. The amount of energy saved by transporting freight by rail instead of by trucks is huge.

Any comprehensive passenger rail system needs to be built on new tracks separated from freight. New routings are necessary in many cases anyway to get the smooth curves necessary to achieve and maintain high speeds.

Oh, and those talking about high-speed rail in California, you do know that they’re working on it, right? They’ve got enough funding to start and are planning the final routing.
http://www.cahighspeedrail.ca.gov/
rhinoman

Making a train crash is pretty easy. The problem is that you know exactly where it’s going to go.

You put a bomb on the rails. Or pry out a section of rail. Or take the support out from under the rail. Or put a big rock on the rail.

To make a train truly secure, you would have to police the entire length of the rail system. Which isn’t going to happen.
Anonymous

i’ve been traveling by train preferentially for years. i guess it depends on what kind of schedule you’re on, but it’s way more comfortable and you can bring whatever you want with you because there’s no security. hurray for cheap liquor.
Anonymous

The governor elect for Ohio, John Kasich has just asked gov. Strickland to shut down the Cleveland-Cinnci rail line. The fed had tossed in $400 mil of stimulus to help get it going and Kasich wants to use it for some as of yet unnamed plan. You can read all of the details in the Columbus Dispatch. Are there any Ohioans out there still willing to stand up for good things and begin a protest or petition to save this project?
inness

In my mid-40s, it’s been a joke for years between my wife and I that when I am elected president my first official act would be to restore and modernize America’s rail system.
Had the U.S. Interstate system not given the leg up to petroleum interests we would still have a useful framework to upgrade. Unfortunately I live in a town in Eastern Kentucky which, like many around me, have ‘refurbished’ former passenger train depots, now used as arts centers, etc. The trains still run multiple times a day, but thanks to the monied interests, they haul car after car of coal. They serve industry and commerce, not the public.
To travel by train anywhere in this state would require driving nearly to Missouri or to Ohio; just not practical. A shame, because some of my best trips have been by train, one memorable 3-day trip being from L.A. via the Coast Starlight, across the northern border via the Empire Builder to Chicago, and down to New Orleans on, of course, The City of New Orleans. Incredible travel, now nearly impossible, and in less than a two decades.
Thanks, Corporate America. Here’s another one of my dollars!
Hanglyman

I took a train instead of a plane from Denver to Pittsburgh this summer, specifically because I was sick of all this TSA nonsense. There was no security hassle, but also LESS legroom than on a plane (though you could get up and stretch or visit the observation car, at least), and the delays were insane… 7 hours late on the way there, 3 or 4 on the way back. It cost slightly more than air travel and took about 8 times longer, not including the delays.

There’s no way I’m traveling by train again unless they dramatically lower their prices, to the point where it costs the same for a room on a sleeper car as it does for a plane ticket. As it is, the very cheapest train tickets are still more expensive than flying, and skipping TSA crap is less of a triumph when the result is an uncomfortable experience that takes literally days to get you to your destination.
Haakon IV

“If you put in high speed rail from LA to SF, there’d be a six month wait to buy tickets.”

You’re high.

But that’s the beauty of it: so are most Californians!
- AirPillo
  
  Not enough of us. We didn’t legalize it (but almost did)
Beefmalone

The problem we have right now is that we’re doing it our usual half-ass way. We give Amtrak enough money to keep moseying along, but not enough to expand to where rail is a viable option for those outside the northeast. For it to really work, rail has to be truly nationwide. Instead we have one hub in Chicago and trains dedicated to going to the West Coast with a few stopovers in between. What we need is a real network of trains running daily AND we need the damn freights to start getting fined for not giving Amtrak priority. The problem right now is that as soon as an Amtrak train gets behind schedule over 30min or so then it loses its priority for the rest of the trip. That makes no sense whatsoever. You end up with train trips like I had that ran 13 hours late getting from STL to DFW. It’s time to go all-in with rail.
inness

@MurrayHenson. I don’t know where you get your information, but depending on the route, Amtrak is incredibly cheap and in no way close to the cost of driving from, say, New Orleans to Atlanta. Mind the comparisons: 1-way Amtrak, approx. $100. Driving in a mid-size American sedan: approx. $300, depending upon whether we’re getting the ‘refinery down/storm a’comin’/Bill showed up late at the oil rig’-type excuses for the rollercoaster pricing based on a small group of billionaire’s whims.
spill

I took my first cross-country train trip this year and was astounded by how marvelous the experience was. So roomy. The observation car was cool. It’d be nice if Amtrak could figure out some sort of WiFi scheme. I liked being able to buy a carbon offset when purchasing the ticket online (all of 2 dollars).

I’ll take a train every chance I get now.
Miss Jess

Hubz and I took the Empire Builder from Chicago to Seattle for our honeymoon last year. Was totally awesome – we had a roomette from Chicago to Glacier Park, stayed at Glacier a few days, hopped back on the train and headed for Seattle in a full bedroom. Good food, fun people, BEAUTIFUL scenery – it’s really the best way to see America – real America. It was a bit pricey, but was an awesome vacation and a great way to spend quality time together. What DID blow my mind was the fact that our flight back from Seattle to Chicago lasted all of 3 hours and covered the same amount of country it took us 3 days to cover by train. People who fly all the time never even know what they’re missing on the ground, all the weird little towns and interesting stuff – craziness!
Anonymous

The benefit of train is eventually it can be free! The truth is we spend billions on roads, so if rail transport is free, then it lightens the load on the roads and therefore less money is required to upkeep the roads. This has been in used in Belgium for 10 years now.

Here are some more benefits.

a barrier-free transportation option to every member of the community (no more worries about exact change, expiring transfers, or embarrassment about how to pay)
eliminating a “toll” from a mode of transportation that we as a society want to be used (transit is often the only way of getting around that charges a toll)
reducing the inequity between the subsidies given to private motorized vehicle users and public transport users
reducing, and in some cases eliminating, the need for private motorized vehicle parking
reducing greenhouse gas emissions, other air pollutants, noise pollution (especially with electric trolleys), and run-off of toxic chemicals into fresh water supplies and ocean environments
reducing overall consumption of oil and gasoline
eliminating the perceived need to spend billions on roads and highways (now up to $7 billion for the proposed Gateway Project in Vancouver)
eliminating the perceived need to spend billions on bigger car-carrying ferries ($2.5 billion for BC Ferries’ new super-sized boats and ramps)
contributing significantly to the local economy by keeping our money in our communities
reducing litter (in Vancouver, the newer transfers/receipts have overtaken fast food packaging for most common garbage found on our streets)
saving trees by eliminating the need to print transfers and tickets
allowing all bus doors to be used to load passengers, making service faster and more efficient
allowing operators (drivers) to focus on driving safely
giving operators more time to answer questions
providing operators a safer work environment since fare disputes are eliminated
eliminating fare evasion and the criminalization of transit-using citizens
fostering more public pride in shared, community resources

http://thetyee.ca/Views/2007/07/05/NoFares1/
takeshi

For now, at least, you can’t take Amtrak from Colorado to Texas directly. You have to go to Chicago first, which costs about twice as much as New York to San Francisco.

Thanks, Union Pacific!
- Nonentity
  
  I feel your pain. Traveling between most southeast states (for instance, Georgia to Florida) on Amtrak apparently takes you up through Washington, DC.. and several days of travel. Talk about scenic routes!
  
  Greyhound seems to be a decent option for bypassing that sort of thing, if you can stand the frequent stops and long hours sitting in a bus.
Anonymous

I am one of those folks in the Northeast Corridor where we have excellent train support. I commute by train every day from central NJ to NYC about 75 miles (each way), and have done so since everyone wanted a piece of an internet IPO. I find the daily ride of about 1 hour each day pretty relaxing. I get some time for recreational reading, video games or TV, others sleep, do work and Rangers Fans can be exceptionally creative in finding ways to entertain themselves.

The trains aren’t pefect, check the obvious hashtags on twitter #F***NJTransit and you will see that stuff happens. What long commute is immune to any kind of delay, every day, in all weather. I can’t think of a nicer way to travel, it sure beats driving. Me and my fellow commuters all hate our commute, but I can’t imagine how awful it would be without the train service even with its flaws.

I would support a national high speed passenger rail service, but I doubt that it will catch on in America. America is too big, too spread out and everyone is in too much of a hurry. People want to fly from NYC to LA in 6 hours not 3+ days. Even high speed rail would be hard pressed to meet those expectations much less the number of connections people want and reliability over all that track.

There are too many strategic issues with installing the infrastructure (property right of ways, switching control and monitoring and maintenance). Even if you get it installed, people have to ride it and make it profitable. Despite its efficiency, rail travel is not a profitable business.

Like healthcare, rail travel is a great idea that won’t catch on in America.
Anonymous

I considered taking the Acela or Northeast Regional from Boston to D.C. for the Rally to Restore Sanity. Two tickets were more than twice the price of flying, and five times the price of driving. We drove.
Wally Ballou

“What we need is a real network of trains running daily”

Exactly. I need to do the same roundtrip 4-5 times a year. I would absolutely take the train if:

(1) there was a train every day. Wednesdays and Saturdays just don’t do it when your meeting runs Monday at 9 to Wednesday at 6.

(2) the equipment was not left over from the 1950′s

(3) passenger trains had priority over freight.

All this could be done without spending $0.01 on building new trackage.