Paypal bans Wikileaks just before midnight Friday

Discuss

102 Responses to “Paypal bans Wikileaks just before midnight Friday”

  1. Bodhiz says:

    So by donating to WL how does “our payment encourage, promote, facilitate or instruct others to engage in illegal activity”?

    Are they not obliged to wait until WL has been convicted for something first? Seems to me like they are saying that WL is doing something illigal, so what law are they breaking that they still have not been convicted for breaking?

    Or are they saying that since WL is promoting and facilitating, presumably in some cases, individuals that engage in illegal activity in order to leak information? That’s a REALLY broad spectre and obviously arbitrarily enforced.

    I would have thought that the above policy was in place to block access to PP sevices by entities which have been proven to commit, and convicted of, fraud. Is WL even making money directly of the documents they host?

  2. Anonymous says:

    Remember, Paypal is part of eBay. So NO MORE EBAY either!

  3. Anonymous says:

    Logged into PayPal, withdrew the remainder of my balance, and plan on closing my account after the transfer goes through.

    Sorry, but I will not support a company that bows to political pressure in this manner.

  4. Bill Albertson says:

    The irony is that while Wikileaks hasn’t even been accused of breaking the law yet. No charges have been filed. Eric Holder announced an investigation, but no charges have been clearly laid out. So Paypal is banning a client for something they haven’t done yet. Lovely.

  5. Anonymous says:

    Paypal and Amazon just lost a customer, and gained an enemy.

  6. purple-stater says:

    PayPal says they won’t work with anyone that “encourage, promote, facilitate or instruct others to engage in illegal activity”???

    Greenpeace comes to mind rather rapidly, plus there are several animals rights groups in the USA.

  7. artstreet says:

    Can an organization like care2 or move on or
    working assets or credo or ? pull it together
    fast enough to be an alternative to paypal?

    they probably have the capacity and the
    reputation to pull it off…and now would
    be the right time.

  8. travtastic says:

    To be completely honest, my girlfriend and I make a pretty fair amount of money as Amazon sellers. So I really feel like I need to know what threats were made before I do anything. I’m comfortable, personally, with not using my account until then.

    But yeah, there are people who actually keep a balance in their Paypal account? For what?

  9. Anonymous says:

    what about pornography?? Paypal allows this type of accounts.

  10. Agies says:

    Wikileaks certainly hasn’t broken any laws but it’s hard to argue that they didn’t willfully facilitate law breaking by accepting the leaks.

    • EH says:

      Actually it’s quite easy: they sit back and wait for things to arrive. I don’t know how much *less* facilitating they could be.

  11. Blue says:

    I liked what the ACLU had to say:

    The courts have made clear that the First Amendment protects independent third parties who publish classified information.

    source

    Kinda cuts a swathe through all of Amazon’s/Paypal’s bullshit.

  12. Anonymous says:

    “I will not be using PayPal since Paypal does not support Free Speach——i.e. WikiLeaks”. Just sent this email to PayPal customer service. Let’s all send them an email OK?

  13. Anonymous says:

    I donated to Wikileaks on Friday and my credit card was immediately frozen for suspected fraudulent activity. A quick call cleared it up, but I found it very suspicious!

  14. peterpaul says:

    Just remember it is the blue head of our imperial dragon that is pushing on Wikileaks from all sides. Does anyone have any doubt that Obama did not agree to pressure companies that contribute to Wikileaks? (Not that the red side would have been any better).

  15. Anonymous says:

    The Supreme Court recently ruled money is speech, so does that mean PayPal is censoring Wikileaks?

  16. travtastic says:

    If we’re all going to be gung-ho about canceling accounts and asking others to do so too, it would be nice to have a thread or post for reasonable and efficient alternatives to their services.

    Is BoingBoing willing to do something like that? I know Cory Doctorow has sung Amazon’s praises in the past; and as I said before, I’m partially financially invested in them, through my seller account.

    But if we’re going to be serious about this, people need to know what they can use to fill the gap. We hear about the importance of open information all the time here, and that’s good; if you guys feel as strongly about free speech and ending info suppression as much as I think you do, then let’s hear it. Gloves off.

    • double_tilly says:

      Good idea, Travtastic. Why don’t you find some alternatives and share them with us? I would really appreciate that.

  17. Deidzoeb says:

    Does anybody find it weird or conspicuous that the reaction to Wikileaks is much stronger after the release of diplomatic bs than it was over secrets of the Iraq and Afghanistan wars? I more or less support what they’re doing, but it seems like the stronger case could be made that people might have been endangered by the releases about the wars. Yet it seems like they’re getting a bigger reaction (and these piddling “terms of service” pedantic technical excuses to undermine them) because some ambassador opined that the Prince of Fungo is douchey. WTF?

  18. happyez says:

    Hi all

    A few thoughts on all of this:

    - I’m curious about the amount of people cancelling Paypal and Amazon accounts/ the effect it has on the company/ the amount of business they are losing VS. the political pressure on them/ their moral fibre/ the accounts and clients who deal the big money. My guess – our effect has very little.

    - how much pressure could we handle if we got the real word from any government about not pushing things. How many people have gotten this treatment? How many organisations are are threat to EVERY government and big business in the world? I see one of the movie plots coming to life, but mostly doing things I approve of…

    - as with revealing secrets, the biggest criticism I have heard of WL, which has some traction for me, is “well, what if they revealed the nuclear codes” or “what if they leaked the movements of allied forces against the enemies in WW2. We’d be up schisserbach”. Two perspectives – since WL is political and likely to support the fight against the Axis, I doubt that revealing present uptodate troop movements is their bag. From what I see, the Afgan war logs are not of what happened yesterday, but a compendium – but if I am wrong, I stand corrected.

    Secondly, if they were to do this, it’s not linear or one sided. Everyone gets the same treatment. I would imagine the US, Isreal, Kazakhstan, India etc would all get all their codes released simultaneously, if they were to do this and based upon sources. The Cablegate thing shows this clearly. They don’t leak in a vacuum.

    Also, why havent we had a nuclear war (other than 1945)? Why haven’t nations just launched their missiles – coz they could? I feel it’s a collective sanity that we still hold. How many stories have we heard of nutjobs in high places in the US Govt saying “lets nuke x”, and it doesn’t happen. Because someone goes “erp. don’t think so”. Why wasn’t Paris wrecked by the Nazis in 1944? Someone had a better idea. Yeah, shit has happened to places, but I can think of many other instances where destruction DIDN’T happen.

    You are also assuming they have the codes. What if noone has leaked them to WL? They can only go on what they get.

    They have also concentrated in most of their history, on ALL corrupt governments. That is why it seems Russian hackers hate WL as much as the US Government. They ALL hate WL.

    That’s why this is WL against the World. THE WORLD.

    /longish post

    • double_tilly says:

      There is an interview online where Assange addresses the WWII question. (Sorry, don’t remember link).

      He says if they had the plans for the D-Day invasion, he would wait until after the fact to release them.

      Please note that as of today, only 600+ of the 250,000 cables have been released to the public. They have a redacting process where the most sensitive info is still secret. In the most sensitive instances, names and locations have been completely XXXed out.

      The major newspapers helped with the redaction process for several months now, partly because WL is not large enough to do all that work itself.

      The state department has known for months all the cables that were going to be released. And has been preparing.

      This journalism is not a thoughtless dump of info, despite what some commentators would have us believe.

      The opponents of WL will try to present it as a careless release of info. My guess is that as the bank release approaches, the big banks will smear WL by claiming WL is planning on releasing personal finance info of millions of customers.

  19. Anonymous says:

    Just sent a comment to paypayl to let them know that unless wikileaks account is restored I’ll be cancelling my account, along with my ebay account.

  20. Anonymous says:

    Time to take all your money out of paypal and stop using ebay.

  21. Itchy Bites says:

    Sadly, PayPal loves collecting money and then restricting accounts, it happens with so many.
    Is there any good alternative to Paypal?

  22. MrJM says:

    “When you strike at a king, you must kill him.” — Ralph Waldo Emerson

    “Oops…” — Julian Assange

  23. Zederbaum says:

    As a heavy user of Amazon I’ve been reluctant to close my account. As a supporter of free speech I’m reluctant to support their craven subservience to the US state.

    I use Amazon as a one stop shop for buying second hand books as it effectively centralises the search function and groups related books together quite effecitvely. For the sake of convenience I have used Amazon to complete those purchases.

    I won’t be closing my Amazon account, but in the future I will conduct the search on Amazon and then contact the buyer separately in order to complete the transaction, thereby shutting Amazon out of the deal.

  24. Cowicide says:

    Welp, I’m boycotting PayPal and I’m switching all my clients off of them ASAP.

  25. ideotek says:

    Nothing illegal about publishing secrets.
    PayPal clearly consents to, promotes and facilitates, US state censorship.

  26. SeattlePete says:

    I am also unable to load the paypal blog site. Maybe they just took it down to wait for the heat to cool off?

  27. Anonymous says:

    At this rate I won’t have anybody online left to do business with.

    • headfoo says:

      There’s tons of offshore companies to deal with. Any company who buckles so easily under an oppressive government doesn’t deserve your business. They simply do not value their customer’s and client’s best interest’s. They only value their own spineless butts.

  28. Anonymous says:

    Well, I have never liked Paypal anyway.

  29. Sagodjur says:

    The timing seems rather suspicious, just like the Amazon decision.

    Why is PayPal suddenly deciding to restrict the account now when WikiLeaks hasn’t changed it’s method of operation? If it is indeed guilty of such an Acceptable Use Policy, it was guilty of the violation in April when it released the video of journalists and Iraqi civilians getting gunned down and again in October when it released the Iraqi war logs.

  30. Anonymous says:

    Of course no illegal activity has ever been “facilitated” by Ebay.

    • redesigned says:

      Of course no illegal activity has ever been “facilitated” by Ebay.

      awesome comment.

      I think while all these attacks on wikileaks suck, they are a good sign that we all need to wake up and support organizations like wikileaks. the truth belongs to us all. so much for f’n freedom.

    • Cowicide says:

      Of course no illegal activity has ever been “facilitated” by Ebay.

      Great point…

      Come to think of it, maybe Paypal should ban itself while it’s at it?

  31. Anonymous says:

    Hope the donation to Wikileaks I made last Wednesday goes through.

  32. Anonymous says:

    “PayPal violates its own Acceptable Use Policy: By blocking Wikileaks, PayPal facilitates the covering up of, and so continuation of, US war crimes, crimes against humanity and plain old murders.”

    What s/he said.
    Amazon, too have thrown there cards on the table as supporters of war criminals.

  33. donflan says:

    Boing-boing has a long and glorious history of making fun of the absurd and over-reaching Terms of Service agreements forced on users by companies that want their business. Both Amazon’s and Paypal’s attempts to squirm out of admitting they have simply knuckled under to external government pressure by waving their Terms of Service agreements in front of the media are good examples of why big companies put everything and the kitchen sink into their never-read, legalese disclaimers. The brilliant comment to the effect that “of course eBay has never facilitated criminal activity” pulls the rug out from under Paypal’s feet. These silly and restrictive TOS “agreements” are all about selective enforcement and application.

    • kaini says:

      ‘Boing-boing has a long and glorious history of making fun of the absurd and over-reaching Terms of Service agreements forced on users by companies that want their business.’

      I can’t help but think that this is the first time where highlighting this will actually MATTER on a real, global scale. All over the internet these last few days I see people claiming to cancel PayPal and Amazon accounts, AWS hosting, removing links to Amazon from their sites, etc.

      I wish there were proper data available on the impact recent events have had on the DNS providers, web-hosting, or transaction-processing services implicit in this censorship.

      I’m also curious as to what sort of boost this will provide to Google Editions when it properly arrives as a serious (DRM-free!) alternative to Kindle et al. (yeah i know i’m comparing a webservice to a piece of hardware here, but the line is being blurred more and more). C’mon Google, here’s your chance to show that “don’t be evil” is more than just a buzz-phrase – and you could clean up in the process.

      We live in very interesting times.

  34. Anonymous says:

    @Cowicide – had been ready to leave them anyway but this is incentive to just do it, (done!). Will be recommending our clients do the same. Arbitrarily enforcing or not enforcing ToS is completely unprofessional.

  35. MustWarnOthers says:

    “Yes, we have leaks on the Anti-Counterfeiting Trade Agreement, a trojan horse trade agreement designed from the very beginning to satisfy big players in the US copyright and patent industries. In fact, it was WikiLeaks that first drew ACTA to the public’s attention – with a leak.”

    WANT.

    Oh, and any shit on Bank of America/large banks in general.

    WANT.

  36. Anonymous says:

    Closed Amazon account as well.

  37. mdh says:

    Amazing what happens when you go for the real levers of power.

    And I do mean the banks, and the next set of leaks.

  38. Cowicide says:

    BTW, still all these other ways to donate ( http://213.251.145.96/support.html )

    1. Julian Assange Defence Fund
    Please donate directly to the Julian Assange and other WikiLeaks Staff Defence Fund. These funds will be used exclusively for defence costs

    To donate please do an electronic bank transfer (EFT) to:

    PostFinance
    SWISS POST
    Account number: 91-765019-6
    IBAN:CH55 0900 0000 9176 5019 6
    BIC:POFICHBEXXX
    Account name:Assange Julian Paul, Geneve
    Address::Swiss Post
    PostFinance
    Engehaldenstrasse, 37
    3030
    Bern, Switzerland

    2. Online Transfer via Credit Card
    Using our friendly credit card processing partner Datacell Switzerland.

    3. Bank Transfer – Option 1: via Sunshine Press Productions ehf:
    Klapparhlid 30, 270 Mosfellsbaer, Iceland
    Landsbanki Islands Account number 0111-26-611010
    BANK/SWIFT:NBIIISREXXX
    ACCOUNT/IBAN:IS97 0111 2661 1010 6110 1002 80

    4. Bank Transfer – Option 2: via the not-for-profit Wau Holland Stiftung Foundation:
    This support is tax deductible in Germany
    Bank Account: 2772812-04
    IBAN: DE46 5204 0021 0277 2812 04
    BIC Code: COBADEFFXXX
    Bank: Commerzbank Kassel
    German BLZ: 52040021
    Subject: WIKILEAKS / WHS Projekt 04

    5. Via Postal Mail
    You can post a donation via good old fashion postal mail to:

    WikiLeaks
    (or any suitable name likely to avoid interception in your country)
    BOX 4080
    Australia Post Office – University of Melbourne Branch
    Victoria 3052
    Australia

  39. lutzray says:

    just closed my Paypal account… Reviewing the logs before closing, I noticed I donated Wikileaks USD50 not once but twice 8-) Will the men knock to my door? Will they put me on their no-fly list? Triste époque.

  40. Anonymous says:

    the vermin is flailing.hissing,teeth gnashing.
    slowly decent voices emerge and combine.
    a better way found.

  41. Anonymous says:

    Wow, talk about timing. I was just getting ready to send wikileaks a donation this morning.

    I fired off an email to paypal with notes from the ACLU and boingboing this morning about canceling my account.

    Thanks to BoingBoing for bringing this issue to my attention and thanks to all the comments for putting together the relevant info.

    Long live wikileaks.

  42. hettie says:

    so I had no difficulty in closing my paypal account, but I’m wondering how people are going about closing their amazon accounts? I filled out a form online requesting that my account be closed and I was sent an email explaining all the reasons it’s great to have an amazon.com account, but if I really want to close my account I can click on the included link. so I clicked on the link, filled out the same form and then received another email explaining all the reasons it’s great to have an amazon.com account, but if I really want…..so I’m apparently stuck in some sort of account canceling feedback loop that I can’t get out of. has anyone else had to deal with this? should I just call them and *cringe* speak with an actual person? how did it work for you? any advice is much appreciated.

  43. happyez says:

    There is an interview online where Assange addresses the WWII question. (Sorry, don’t remember link).

    He says if they had the plans for the D-Day invasion, he would wait until after the fact to release them.

    Hi, Double Tilly, yeah, that makes sense. My guess is that to not do that does actually put lives at risk, and they aren’t on about that.

    The opponents of WL will try to present it as a careless release of info. My guess is that as the bank release approaches, the big banks will smear WL by claiming WL is planning on releasing personal finance info of millions of customers.

    Yes, I imagine so. In that Forbes article, JA put it that the bank info was only about bringing down a bank or 2. The War files were about a complete war. The latter affects more people directly. Maybe that is the reason we get the bank stuff later than the war/ diplomatic stuff. Is there a hierarchy of releases? (I believe they have released Swiss bank info before – which makes me think how protected they will be in Switzerland really… oh well)

  44. Anonymous says:

    Paypal has disabled comments on their announcement post. At least Tableau kept comments open.

  45. Antinous / Moderator says:

    When you get verified by PayPal, don’t they put 27¢ or summat in your bank account? That could really add up if a lot of people opened PP accounts and did bank verification.

  46. ackpht says:

    The obvious question is “Why didn’t Paypal (Amazon) withdraw its service to Wikileaks before this? How is what they’re doing now any more or less legal than what it was doing before?”

    I can only think of one credible answer.

  47. Anonymous says:

    Just closed my Paypal account. Here’s the reason I gave to them.

    “Wikileaks has not been tried or found guilty in any criminal court, therefore I beleive that Paypal’s decision to close the account was in capitulation to political pressure, rather than for a breach of PPs User Agreement as stated.

    By closing Wikileaks’ account you are complicit in covering up crimes perpetrated by the United States Government including but not limited to;

    Crimes Against Peace,
    War Crimes,
    Crimes Against Humanity,
    Other Criminal Acts and High Crimes,
    in Violation of the Charter of the United Nations, International Law, the Constitution of the United States and Laws made in Pursuance Thereof.

    In accordance with my organisations Ethical Practice Policy, I am obliged to close my Paypal account immediately henceforth.”

  48. arikol says:

    paypal has shown their suckitude before. Freezing funds seemingly at random and generally behaving like dicks.
    Even the credit card companies are better than Paypal…

  49. imag says:

    PayPal account: cancelled.

    I have to say, I feel like this is pretty historic. Even though everyone knew a lot of these things were happening, look at what has been confirmed this week: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/nov/29/wikileaks-embassy-cables-key-points

    Basically, the US is a imperialist world power which operates without regard for the rule of law or the democratic principals it espouses, protecting its own war criminals, supporting dictators over their populaces, jamming legislation down the throats of sovereign nations, and forcing other nations to admit to military actions which it perpetrated.

    That same imperialist power – my government – is cutting off its own free speech rights in public in a broad spectrum of ways. It has prevented access to a site which has not proved to be illegal or harmful. It is preventing US companies from serving their own customers in a pointless and counterproductive attempt to prevent further dishonesty from being uncovered. And it is trying to find ways to extradite and find guilty a person who is only publishing truthful information, information which the US created – and leaked – in the first place.

    On top of that, we have an unknown number of people (but probably fewer than 100) who are bringing an entire global imperialist power to its knees, simply by relaying that power’s own information, leaked by that power’s own people – on the network which that power created in the first place.

    I don’t know about you, but I think that’s pretty serious sh!t.

    • MustWarnOthers says:

      Imag, is it ok if I quote you as “some dude on boing boing”, in regards to your summary of what Wikileaks has done?

      Specifically this:

      Basically, the US is a imperialist world power which operates without regard for the rule of law or the democratic principals it espouses, protecting its own war criminals, supporting dictators over their populaces, jamming legislation down the throats of sovereign nations, and forcing other nations to admit to military actions which it perpetrated.

  50. emdubya says:

    Yeah I wanna dump amazon over this, but I think that means I can’t read the e-books I bought from them, right? Or can I close my account and still use the Kindle app… This is all so much more confusing than dealing with a shelf full of paperbacks.

    • headfoo says:

      Valid questions, emdubya, and in a situation like this, I personally would say to heck with the ebooks and kindle. IMO a true boycott means a full boycott, even if it means causing myself inconvenience or financial loss. I keep saying “I” and “my” because those are my own feelings. Yours are your own, obviously.

      Anyways, I just initiated a transfer of all my PayPal funds to my bank account, and when the money is in my bank I’m closing the PayPal account. Once my money is safe, I’m emailing PayPal and explaining that I don’t feel safe dealing with a company run by an oppressive government, citing the wikileaks banning as an example.

    • lhl says:

      @emdubya, you can use a number of scripts (search for kindle mobidedrm) to remove the DRM from the ebooks you’ve purchased. These days, it’s much easier. There’s a handy dandy Applescript and a Calibre plugin even. If you’re on a PC, there’s also a script for decoding from K4PC.

  51. Anonymous says:

    I’m going to go ahead and show my full deck.

    Why haven’t we been scamming the hell out of PP if they put money into your account for linking a bank account with them.* Just have to be able to crack their captcha and create an extremely large amount of bank accounts. A million bank accounts each receiving 27 cents is a fair bit of money. And would it even be illegal?

  52. Anonymous says:

    Thanks, @cowicide, now I know exactly what to do with the giftmas money I was going to spend at Amazon and via PayPal. I’m going to also ask people to donate to Julian and to Wikileaks instead of buying stuff for me.

  53. Anonymous says:

    I highly doubt the US government is “pressuring” Paypal and Amazon to end Wikileaks – Those two companies have ignored the company in the past. The real issue is that Amazon was being overloaded by Wikileaks with the DDOS attack and if any illegal activity is ever discovered (hm..like maybe leaking classified documents which is illegal) neither company was to be connected to the operation for fear that they too could be charged with assisting.

    Wikileaks has a awesome idea: Leak information to make the world more open. However there are aspects of government operations that need to remain classified for the protection of our soldiers, state department employees overseas, intelligence personnel and civilians overseas. After all, how would you like it if Wikileaks posted the locations of every nuclear missile in the United States? (That information is undoubtedly Secret or Top Secret.) Would you still feel safe knowing that everyone in the world knows where our nuclear missiles are stored?

  54. imag says:

    I would agree that the number of people canceling Amazon and PayPal accounts doesn’t nearly equal what the government could do to either one of those companies –

    - but –

    - it has still showed that there is *some cost* to bowing down. If no one canceled his or her account, then it would show that no one even cares, that there isn’t even a tradeoff for these corporations.

    Even if we only account for %0.1 of revenue, it’s better than nothing. Other companies need to see that there is at least some PR and business cost to bending over, so that they at least put up a bit of resistance with the government tells them to do it. And my guess is that Bezos and a few others at both companies aren’t happy about this at all.

    My question is: will Lieberman bother with Twitter? Would Twitter knuckle under? I kind of doubt it – on both counts – right now, but as Twitter becomes a more critical part of the internet whack-a-mole game, I wonder what will happen.

  55. arborman says:

    Every one of these little attacks and shutdowns against Wikileaks underlines the importance of what they are doing.

    There are all kinds of wacky websites doing all kinds of things under the radar. But this one is speaking the truth about the powers that be. And powers that be are shitting their pants the world over.

    Whatever happens to wikileaks and its people, we have them to thank for the model. The idea is loose int he world and unstoppable.

  56. Eric Ragle says:

    As someone who has been an active member of PayPal for over a decade, I want to believe that what I did today makes a difference. I cancelled my account. Time to stop riding the fence on Wikileaks. What they are doing is what real journalists should be doing.

  57. Anonymous says:

    If I were in need of a internet host, I would be honored to give my business to Sweden’s Banhof AB; Wikileaks host. It’s not about boycotting those companies that don’t support freedom of speech. It is supporting those that do.

  58. Anonymous says:

    I just closed my personal and business accounts. Just looking at alternatives ATM.

  59. vaporlock says:

    Just dumped PayPal… still hesitating on Amazon. I really do find this disgusting. At least the wolves are being flushed out into the open.

    Yesterday Assange answered questions on the Guardian’s website. All his answers where quite reasonable.
    http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/blog/2010/dec/03/julian-assange-wikileaks

  60. merovingian says:

    You may find that as a wikileaks suporter that a few million turn up in your Bank account thats nice.

    Mastercard VISA PayPal
    Your servers and any one who coludes with you including banks look to be DOOMED.

    Make sure you draw it all out and give it away to people you dont know. That way they cant say you did it for personal gain.

    OK. Good.

  61. Anonymous says:

    My paypal account is now closed

    This is disgusting how the influence of our government is making these corporations truly shake in their boots. What a time we live in. I truly hope Americans will get off their asses and start boycotting to hell these corporations and businesses that are buckling under government pressure, and hopefully we can really start a fight against this imperialist empire that we have always thought to be a “free” nation. More power to Wikileaks and Julian Assange, I will continue to donate to them in the fight for truth.

  62. Anonymous says:

    Paypal’s explanation makes no sense. As Wikileaks is acting as a publisher, and is not the source of the leaked information, they haven’t actually done ANYTHING illegal. It sounds like more caving to political pressure to me.

  63. Anonymous says:

    closed my paypal. asshats.

  64. Cowicide says:

    Paypal… you’re FUCKED.

    Good Riddance, assholes.

    http://i.imgur.com/C35Ty.png

  65. CharlesSpongeworth says:

    I think that Amazon and PayPal don’t really have a choice. The US government is using pretty dirty tricks at the moment, so it would be surprising if they didn’t use them on these companies to get their way too.

    All it takes is for the US government to tell a company that the boss’s browsing history, medical records, or private life will be publicised, and that is enough to stop anyone doing anything. It’s the reason that the UK politicians didn’t want to investigate the News Of The World phone hacking scandal. Everyone has something recorded somewhere that they are embarrassed about, and the US Government has the means and the lack of morals to take advantage of that. Failing that, there’s the threat of false sex crime accusations, drug investigations etc etc etc. Just think “what would the Soviet Union have done back in the day?”, and then apply it to the US, but with more subtlety.

    • petsounds says:

      Charles, they don’t have a choice? According to the Supreme Court corporations are individuals, and so they should exercise their free will. If they have the rights of individuals, they’d better f’ing display a conscience like one.

      • CharlesSpongeworth says:

        Maybe I didn’t explain what I was trying to say as well as I could have. They might be corporations, but all corporations are run by people, and all people are blackmailable, as everybody on the planet has broken the law in some minor way (e.g. copyright law) or has something they are embarrassed or ashamed about (or something that could be reported in a way that would make them embarrassed and ashamed). The more social standing your job has, the more there are even minor things that can bring about your downfall.

        I suppose the people within companies such as Amazon *do* have a choice, but it is a choice that will result in great personal trouble for themselves.

  66. Zederbaum says:

    Rob: “The rationale seems more convincing (at least from PayPal’s perspective) than Amazon’s wheedling about rights and redaction.”

    That is a painfully naive statement given the pattern of events over the last week or so.

  67. Anonymous says:

    PayPal violates its own Acceptable Use Policy: By blocking Wikileaks, PayPal facilitates the covering up of, and so continuation of, US war crimes, crimes against humanity and plain old murders.

  68. Amelia_G says:

    Already stopped using my PayPal accounts years ago because they take too high a cut and because they dropped their once-interesting interest rate.

    I was heavily reliant on amazon, both for me and gifts to friends and family. No more. I would probably not have looked elsewhere if amazon hadn’t taken this craven move, but thanks for the impetus. I’ll probably find some great alternatives I was ignoring.

    Worthwhile Pacific Northwest competitors:
    http://www.Powellsbooks.com
    http://www.elliottbaybook.com

  69. Anonymous says:

    Im sick and tired of ebay/Paypal’s increasingly political policies, im closing my paypal account.

  70. Damien says:

    If wikileaks are engaged in illegal activity, surely Paypal have been profiting from the proceeds of crime.
    What they’re doing is the result of a political decision, not a legal issue.

    Any Australians considering dropping Amazon should look at http://www.booko.com.au (I am not affiliated, just a happy customer). Booko finds the cheapest deal from a large number of online bookshops, including postage, currency exchange, etc. Amazon was never in the top spot, so boycotting them is no great loss to me.

  71. Anonymous says:

    And my account goes poof.

  72. Stooge says:

    CharlesSpongeworth, why does your version of an amoral, old-school-Soviet-style US Government have to make things so complicated, risky and ineffective?

    Couldn’t they just have paid someone to kill off few low-level informants referred to in the Afghan War documents, point a finger at WikiLeaks, and then finish their breakfasts like real sociopathic governments would, or is it integral to your narrative arc that they do things the hard way?

  73. Anonymous says:

    That’s what money orders and checks are for!

  74. alllie says:

    I’ve always liked paypal and have used them enough that I trusted them to have my bank account and credit card numbers. I actually like using them more than a CC for donations. But thinking about this it seems to me that I no longer like them, that we need more than paypal and need something not in the US. Looking at Cowicide’s post I see there are other ways but I’m not familiar with them. I don’t know if I should trust them the way I trusted paypal till a half hour ago.

    This will cost paypal, something, at least.

    There needs to be other companies, international companies, free of US interference, that will do what paypal did. But how do we know who to trust? We need something…in Iceland.

    I wonder if the US’s over response is more about preventing the upcoming Bank of America release than the minor diplomatic crap revealed so far, none of which is really surprising. I really want BoA to die but the US government might have given them so much of our money that they can’t allow that to happen.

  75. Anonymous says:

    Will Paypal ban themselves?

    They’re acting as a bank without being licensed as one!

    That’s very illegal.

  76. Bulone says:

    Ya right illegal activity. Why not go ahead and close all other media outlets accounts who are also doing the same thing as wikileak does by hosting the same information. Pusillanimous losers.

  77. Bulone says:

    @allie : I don’t know about iceland, but in Canada, Canadapost sells prepaid visa cards. You only need to pay small amount to load it up. See if your country has the same.

  78. ADavies says:

    Interesting to see who can’t stand the heat.

  79. Anonymous says:

    Another thing tis mess shows is the huge emerging problem the combination of an american national security state and the dominance of american institutions and corporations on the internet. I think the future of the internet is going to be modelled on the chinese and iranian way of organizing the internet.

  80. Bulone says:

    Does anyone able to access paypalblog?Cuz I can’t. Is it under DDOS attack?

  81. Anonymous says:

    I just closed my paypal account, I’ve never really cared for their service.

  82. Anonymous says:

    cancelled my account

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