Comments on: Converting pixel art to vectors http://boingboing.net/2011/05/25/converting-pixel-art.html Brain candy for Happy Mutants Sat, 25 May 2013 01:57:00 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.4.1 By: voiceinthedistance http://boingboing.net/2011/05/25/converting-pixel-art.html#comment-1121281 voiceinthedistance Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1121281 I've used VectorMagic for years, since they were in beta, for the same thing ('cause vectorizing in Illustrator sux). I'm curious, if the hamster powering their website ever recovers, to see how the two stack up against one another. I’ve used VectorMagic for years, since they were in beta, for the same thing (’cause vectorizing in Illustrator sux). I’m curious, if the hamster powering their website ever recovers, to see how the two stack up against one another.

]]> By: doggo http://boingboing.net/2011/05/25/converting-pixel-art.html#comment-1120525 doggo Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1120525 Lookout <a href="http://dieselsweeties.com/">diesel sweeties</a>! Lookout diesel sweeties!

]]> By: ncinerate http://boingboing.net/2011/05/25/converting-pixel-art.html#comment-1120537 ncinerate Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1120537 This sort of tech has been around a long time - it's even implemented into some of the emulators you can download off the net, automatically smoothing and upscaling your graphics to be a bit more modern. I'm all for nostalgia, but I have to admit, playing the resulting upscaled games was easier on the old eyes. Mario never looked so good. I spent my whole life amazed at the "next amazing graphics leap". I used to get excited about new games not because of their quality, but because of the increase in realism/graphics. That was the whole reason to upgrade from the atari to the nintendo, and then to grab that sega genesis and super nintendo, and on and on and on. It's funny to think that there are people today who want to cling to the old pixels, when there was likely a time in all of your lives where you dreamed of graphics such as the one demonstrated. I've learned to enjoy the graphics improvements scalers allow for. I can't even imagine playing a game such as Star Control 2 (ur quan masters) without turning on a scaler. It's like night-and-day. This sort of tech has been around a long time – it’s even implemented into some of the emulators you can download off the net, automatically smoothing and upscaling your graphics to be a bit more modern.

I’m all for nostalgia, but I have to admit, playing the resulting upscaled games was easier on the old eyes. Mario never looked so good. I spent my whole life amazed at the “next amazing graphics leap”. I used to get excited about new games not because of their quality, but because of the increase in realism/graphics. That was the whole reason to upgrade from the atari to the nintendo, and then to grab that sega genesis and super nintendo, and on and on and on.

It’s funny to think that there are people today who want to cling to the old pixels, when there was likely a time in all of your lives where you dreamed of graphics such as the one demonstrated.

I’ve learned to enjoy the graphics improvements scalers allow for. I can’t even imagine playing a game such as Star Control 2 (ur quan masters) without turning on a scaler. It’s like night-and-day.

]]> By: Cowicide http://boingboing.net/2011/05/25/converting-pixel-art.html#comment-1121051 Cowicide Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1121051 Yes, johanneskopf.de is fried... for future reference: http://www.downforeveryoneorjustme.com/http://johanneskopf.de Yes, johanneskopf.de is fried… for future reference:

http://www.downforeveryoneorjustme.com/http://johanneskopf.de

]]> By: Salviati http://boingboing.net/2011/05/25/converting-pixel-art.html#comment-1120543 Salviati Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1120543 The problem is that many older games were never really seen as that blocky by the players. Most games were played on 17-25" CRT TVs, which appear much smaller and softer due to their lower-resolution capabilities. Even Shigeru Miyamoto (the creator of Mario and Zelda) said in an interview that he never intended the figures to appear jagged as they do now on modern monitors. I personally had to delete many programs I digitized (using a TV tuner card) years ago because I couldn't stand how bad they appear now. At the time, I spent days choosing and testing different resolutions and codecs to optimize for my 27" CRT. At the time I was very happy with them. But now on my 42" Plasma, the low resolution and compression artifacts are unbearable. The problem is that many older games were never really seen as that blocky by the players. Most games were played on 17-25″ CRT TVs, which appear much smaller and softer due to their lower-resolution capabilities. Even Shigeru Miyamoto (the creator of Mario and Zelda) said in an interview that he never intended the figures to appear jagged as they do now on modern monitors.

I personally had to delete many programs I digitized (using a TV tuner card) years ago because I couldn’t stand how bad they appear now. At the time, I spent days choosing and testing different resolutions and codecs to optimize for my 27″ CRT. At the time I was very happy with them. But now on my 42″ Plasma, the low resolution and compression artifacts are unbearable.

]]> By: Jellybit http://boingboing.net/2011/05/25/converting-pixel-art.html#comment-1120802 Jellybit Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1120802 Yes, it's certainly amazing. But I think the point you brought up is why old fogeys aren't wild about it. It's creating information the original artists in several cases wouldn't have wanted. And in the cases where it's something the artist may have wanted, it's not done at the quality they would have. It's an algorithm creating art without any attention to communication or intent. In some cases, it's ok. In many others, it breaks things. Here are some other examples that I got off of Google Image Search since the original site is not responding (not sure how long the links will be good): This one is great: http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTleAlz81h24ozO43ka45VPZlgN5_1bgYDfrUrs23I9Swzr2-mdzQ These are weird: http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcS4vZuHhmd6JwTFDaaASrzjEWGDL7Go5MYr_zyyRl7znASo_Kq7kQ http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcReWP6nK6bSs04BhXun-llbkaD2_GP_WlaYtlgejiv86tZ47zekFA And if you get into non-line art, it gets really crazy. It changes it into a different art style, and loses information like in a game of telephone. Imagine a classic album's digital remastering that changes the genre of music electronically (without such a thing being its intent), and even making some of the words unintelligible where it was once understood easily. Even if it sounds cool, something's lost when the intent is to clarify what was originally intended/there. And that's assuming the pixel art style fits the algorithm. Basically, it works best on a specific art style, and maybe not throughout that same game. Give it something more gradient-based than line-based, and it'll likely fall to pieces. Maybe it's old fogeyism, but it might also be respect for the work/intent that built these historically important, foundation laying pieces. Which, also might be old fogeyism. Yes, it’s certainly amazing. But I think the point you brought up is why old fogeys aren’t wild about it. It’s creating information the original artists in several cases wouldn’t have wanted. And in the cases where it’s something the artist may have wanted, it’s not done at the quality they would have. It’s an algorithm creating art without any attention to communication or intent. In some cases, it’s ok. In many others, it breaks things.

Here are some other examples that I got off of Google Image Search since the original site is not responding (not sure how long the links will be good):

This one is great:
http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTleAlz81h24ozO43ka45VPZlgN5_1bgYDfrUrs23I9Swzr2-mdzQ

These are weird:
http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcS4vZuHhmd6JwTFDaaASrzjEWGDL7Go5MYr_zyyRl7znASo_Kq7kQ

http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcReWP6nK6bSs04BhXun-llbkaD2_GP_WlaYtlgejiv86tZ47zekFA

And if you get into non-line art, it gets really crazy. It changes it into a different art style, and loses information like in a game of telephone. Imagine a classic album’s digital remastering that changes the genre of music electronically (without such a thing being its intent), and even making some of the words unintelligible where it was once understood easily.

Even if it sounds cool, something’s lost when the intent is to clarify what was originally intended/there. And that’s assuming the pixel art style fits the algorithm. Basically, it works best on a specific art style, and maybe not throughout that same game. Give it something more gradient-based than line-based, and it’ll likely fall to pieces.

Maybe it’s old fogeyism, but it might also be respect for the work/intent that built these historically important, foundation laying pieces. Which, also might be old fogeyism.

]]> By: Anonymous http://boingboing.net/2011/05/25/converting-pixel-art.html#comment-1121318 Anonymous Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1121318 So, does this mean we have moved way past potrace? So, does this mean we have moved way past potrace?

]]> By: Anonymous http://boingboing.net/2011/05/25/converting-pixel-art.html#comment-1121063 Anonymous Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1121063 I think we're all missing the most important question... can it be used to uncensor cartoon porn? I think we’re all missing the most important question…

can it be used to uncensor cartoon porn?

]]> By: codesuidae http://boingboing.net/2011/05/25/converting-pixel-art.html#comment-1120809 codesuidae Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1120809 That's really impressive, I wonder if it's fast enough to be be used for gameplay. I'd love to see some of the old games running through such a system. That’s really impressive, I wonder if it’s fast enough to be be used for gameplay. I’d love to see some of the old games running through such a system.

]]> By: jonw http://boingboing.net/2011/05/25/converting-pixel-art.html#comment-1120820 jonw Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1120820 This is gonna make forgery so much easier. I was just getting used to recognizing pixels, now I have to look for vectors as well? This is gonna make forgery so much easier. I was just getting used to recognizing pixels, now I have to look for vectors as well?

]]> By: sla29970 http://boingboing.net/2011/05/25/converting-pixel-art.html#comment-1121082 sla29970 Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1121082 Isn't the ultimate test running http://boingboing.net/giftguide/rob.png http://boingboing.net/giftguide/cory.png etc thru the algorithm? Isn’t the ultimate test running
http://boingboing.net/giftguide/rob.png
http://boingboing.net/giftguide/cory.png
etc thru the algorithm?

]]> By: Anonymous http://boingboing.net/2011/05/25/converting-pixel-art.html#comment-1121342 Anonymous Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1121342 My fogery beef: The image on the left is understood to be an approximation of a drawn image (was understood 30 years ago. Now just is) It is at the height of its technique. The image on the right is not at the height of its technique. The line weights are all wrong, making a displeasing toon. My fogery beef:

The image on the left is understood to be an approximation of a drawn image (was understood 30 years ago. Now just is) It is at the height of its technique.

The image on the right is not at the height of its technique. The line weights are all wrong, making a displeasing toon.

]]> By: Alvis http://boingboing.net/2011/05/25/converting-pixel-art.html#comment-1120577 Alvis Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1120577 You're right, and I've read some interesting analysis of trying to recreate the effects of RF modulators to produce the same look. My issue is that gaming sites should present screenshots as the game generated them. Eagle, Super 2x Sai... whatever interpolater someone uses changes those graphics. It's an artistic interpretation, but is often passed-off as original (or at least without comment upon the visual processing), just because it looks "better" to current audiences. You’re right, and I’ve read some interesting analysis of trying to recreate the effects of RF modulators to produce the same look.

My issue is that gaming sites should present screenshots as the game generated them. Eagle, Super 2x Sai… whatever interpolater someone uses changes those graphics. It’s an artistic interpretation, but is often passed-off as original (or at least without comment upon the visual processing), just because it looks “better” to current audiences.

]]> By: Anonymous http://boingboing.net/2011/05/25/converting-pixel-art.html#comment-1120594 Anonymous Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1120594 This looks like an illustrator. I can tell from the vectors. This looks like an illustrator. I can tell from the vectors.

]]> By: Shay Guy http://boingboing.net/2011/05/25/converting-pixel-art.html#comment-1121119 Shay Guy Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1121119 I still want a way to make Webkit do nearest-neighbor interpolation. I mean, even <i>IE</i> has that option. I still want a way to make Webkit do nearest-neighbor interpolation. I mean, even IE has that option.

]]> By: Anonymous http://boingboing.net/2011/05/25/converting-pixel-art.html#comment-1121379 Anonymous Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1121379 Could this help as a preprocessing step before doing OCR? Could this help as a preprocessing step before doing OCR?

]]> By: Anonymous http://boingboing.net/2011/05/25/converting-pixel-art.html#comment-1120876 Anonymous Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1120876 This seems really exciting for when you are trying to use a logo in a presentation, but your only contact at the company has no clue what a vector graphic is. This seems really exciting for when you are trying to use a logo in a presentation, but your only contact at the company has no clue what a vector graphic is.

]]> By: RebNachum http://boingboing.net/2011/05/25/converting-pixel-art.html#comment-1121667 RebNachum Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1121667 Ah, but what does it do for ASCII art? Ah, but what does it do for ASCII art?

]]> By: proginoskes http://boingboing.net/2011/05/25/converting-pixel-art.html#comment-1120939 proginoskes Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1120939 @graphicsman I think the story was on Slashdot before Boing Boing and I've been trying all day to get the linked home page with no result. :^( So all I know is that there is a claim of an algorithm that produces better results than what you find in most emulators, and no word on speed. In any case it's probably good for making posters and T shirts! @graphicsman I think the story was on Slashdot before Boing Boing and I’ve been trying all day to get the linked home page with no result. :^( So all I know is that there is a claim of an algorithm that produces better results than what you find in most emulators, and no word on speed.

In any case it’s probably good for making posters and T shirts!

]]> By: dancentury http://boingboing.net/2011/05/25/converting-pixel-art.html#comment-1120430 dancentury Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1120430 Has someone done this for Nyan Cat yet? Has someone done this for Nyan Cat yet?

]]> By: Hawke http://boingboing.net/2011/05/25/converting-pixel-art.html#comment-1120690 Hawke Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1120690 The problem is that there is no one “as the game generated them”. They were generated locally at each console and presented on the hardware available. You could connect your NES to the composite input on a current television and it will look different than it looked on a 13 inch CRT TV in 1985, and it will almost certainly be using a scaling algorithm on it. I don’t see how using one scaling algorithm vs. another is more “real”. The problem is that there is no one “as the game generated them”. They were generated locally at each console and presented on the hardware available.

You could connect your NES to the composite input on a current television and it will look different than it looked on a 13 inch CRT TV in 1985, and it will almost certainly be using a scaling algorithm on it. I don’t see how using one scaling algorithm vs. another is more “real”.

]]> By: antikewl http://boingboing.net/2011/05/25/converting-pixel-art.html#comment-1120444 antikewl Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1120444 Reminds me of all the horrible digital noise reduction that Warner did on those classic Looney Tunes cartoons a few years ago. An "improvement" on something that doesn't need to be done. Reminds me of all the horrible digital noise reduction that Warner did on those classic Looney Tunes cartoons a few years ago. An “improvement” on something that doesn’t need to be done.

]]> By: MashTheStampede http://boingboing.net/2011/05/25/converting-pixel-art.html#comment-1120700 MashTheStampede Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1120700 The detractors here sound like a bunch of old fogeys complaining about how much better LPs sound compared to CDs. And though those arguments have a degree of merit, there's a major point being missed here: the image to the right looks like there's information being created out of nowhere! This isn't just about old games being turned into something that looks new. You can take old, low resolution images hardly good for displaying on the web and upscale them so they can be printed out at 300 dpi, at the very least. As a graphic artist, I find this to be nothing short of amazing. The detractors here sound like a bunch of old fogeys complaining about how much better LPs sound compared to CDs. And though those arguments have a degree of merit, there’s a major point being missed here: the image to the right looks like there’s information being created out of nowhere! This isn’t just about old games being turned into something that looks new. You can take old, low resolution images hardly good for displaying on the web and upscale them so they can be printed out at 300 dpi, at the very least. As a graphic artist, I find this to be nothing short of amazing.

]]> By: jimkirk http://boingboing.net/2011/05/25/converting-pixel-art.html#comment-1121213 jimkirk Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1121213 Enhance! Enhance!

]]> By: graphicsman http://boingboing.net/2011/05/25/converting-pixel-art.html#comment-1120707 graphicsman Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1120707 anyone else having troubles getting johanneskopf.de? Did we Boing them to death? anyone else having troubles getting johanneskopf.de? Did we Boing them to death?

]]> By: Alvis http://boingboing.net/2011/05/25/converting-pixel-art.html#comment-1120458 Alvis Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1120458 Amen to the original looking better. I hate it when classic gaming sites display images of older games as run through a modern emulator with all sorts of smoothing algorithms engaged. Amen to the original looking better.

I hate it when classic gaming sites display images of older games as run through a modern emulator with all sorts of smoothing algorithms engaged.

]]> By: Newman http://boingboing.net/2011/05/25/converting-pixel-art.html#comment-1120972 Newman Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1120972 They look to be Slashdotted/Boinged, but somebody put the full paper up on Dropdo: http://dropdo.com/2Rm/Depixelizing%20%20Pixel%20%20Art They look to be Slashdotted/Boinged, but somebody put the full paper up on Dropdo:
http://dropdo.com/2Rm/Depixelizing%20%20Pixel%20%20Art

]]> By: Kimmo http://boingboing.net/2011/05/25/converting-pixel-art.html#comment-1121489 Kimmo Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1121489 I'm pretty impressed... I think it does a fine job of making up info and guessing right. It's definitely a leap ahead for pixel art upscaling. I’m pretty impressed… I think it does a fine job of making up info and guessing right.

It’s definitely a leap ahead for pixel art upscaling.

]]> By: dwdyer http://boingboing.net/2011/05/25/converting-pixel-art.html#comment-1120478 dwdyer Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1120478 For classic games at the same-as-original display size, I agree. But this would allow for easier upscaling. For classic games at the same-as-original display size, I agree. But this would allow for easier upscaling.

]]> By: Anonymous http://boingboing.net/2011/05/25/converting-pixel-art.html#comment-1120757 Anonymous Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1120757 I dunno, I think they both look cool, although the one on the right has some lineshapes that look a little awkward (and probably wouldn't be there if you were designing a new image from scratch). I'd love to see what this looks like on a variety of different sprites, or even an entire scene with backgrounds... It might be good, or it might look like a mess. I dunno, I think they both look cool, although the one on the right has some lineshapes that look a little awkward (and probably wouldn’t be there if you were designing a new image from scratch). I’d love to see what this looks like on a variety of different sprites, or even an entire scene with backgrounds… It might be good, or it might look like a mess.

]]>