Comments on: Interview: Ran Prieur http://boingboing.net/2011/05/27/interview-ran-prieur.html Brain candy for Happy Mutants Wed, 22 May 2013 20:32:00 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.4.1 By: Anonymous http://boingboing.net/2011/05/27/interview-ran-prieur.html#comment-1122824 Anonymous Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1122824 Salient points abound, and clearly Prieur recognizes that the world he is dropping out of is not an accidental one, but one of political, sociological, economic and ultimately - - - Philosophical design. The 800 pound proverbial eleplhant that I see, could be gleaned by reading "Atlas Shrugged". Prieur is a looter. He loots dumpsters and depends on the work of other individuals. If the commerce he despises but accepts as necessary didn't exist, there would be no materials,no bicycle, no surpluses, and no food in the dumpster of Whole Foods for him to live from. He talks about freedom turning on the ability to say no. I would add to that, that the basis of intelligence is recognizing a weak argument. I'll buy the ill's of societal design he points towards, but I will never buy his lack of moral character, or his desultory excuse for a set of human values as worthwhile beyond a cursory examination. He may be bright, but his premises in large, are well, Stupid. Salient points abound, and clearly Prieur recognizes that the world he is dropping out of is not an accidental one, but one of political, sociological, economic and ultimately – - – Philosophical design. The 800 pound proverbial eleplhant that I see, could be gleaned by reading “Atlas Shrugged”. Prieur is a looter. He loots dumpsters and depends on the work of other individuals. If the commerce he despises but accepts as necessary didn’t exist, there would be no materials,no bicycle, no surpluses, and no food in the dumpster of Whole Foods for him to live from.

He talks about freedom turning on the ability to say no. I would add to that, that the basis of intelligence is recognizing a weak argument. I’ll buy the ill’s of societal design he points towards, but I will never buy his lack of moral character, or his desultory excuse for a set of human values as worthwhile beyond a cursory examination. He may be bright, but his premises in large, are well, Stupid.

]]> By: dMc http://boingboing.net/2011/05/27/interview-ran-prieur.html#comment-1122825 dMc Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1122825 I wanted to like this guy so I went to his website. When I saw his 9/11 FAQ, that was the end for me. I wanted to like this guy so I went to his website. When I saw his 9/11 FAQ, that was the end for me.

]]> By: druse http://boingboing.net/2011/05/27/interview-ran-prieur.html#comment-1124105 druse Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1124105 Thanks for the info! Thanks for the info!

]]> By: aelfscine http://boingboing.net/2011/05/27/interview-ran-prieur.html#comment-1122826 aelfscine Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1122826 How do you 'drop out of society' but have a 'website' and a fan base? Does he like come back once a week for attention whoring? Also, as someone whose parents went to college, I disagree that that alone makes you think 'like an educated person.' My parents are smart as hell, but having time away from them where I had to be independent, where I had to sort out (and accomplish) the tasks for 4-5 classes, and where I was exposed to people of races, beliefs, and genders I'd never encountered is what made me think like an educated person. My parents took it as a given that I'd go to college and strongly urged me NOT to go to school in my home town, precisely so I'd get the experiences I described. He also sounds like one of those guys that does something, reaps all the benefits, and then badmouths it later. "I went to college, and it's how I met my beautiful wife and got the wherewithal to earn the skills I need to be an adult. But now that I'm an adult it doesn't really help me much, so screw college, I never needed it." How do you ‘drop out of society’ but have a ‘website’ and a fan base? Does he like come back once a week for attention whoring?

Also, as someone whose parents went to college, I disagree that that alone makes you think ‘like an educated person.’ My parents are smart as hell, but having time away from them where I had to be independent, where I had to sort out (and accomplish) the tasks for 4-5 classes, and where I was exposed to people of races, beliefs, and genders I’d never encountered is what made me think like an educated person. My parents took it as a given that I’d go to college and strongly urged me NOT to go to school in my home town, precisely so I’d get the experiences I described.

He also sounds like one of those guys that does something, reaps all the benefits, and then badmouths it later. “I went to college, and it’s how I met my beautiful wife and got the wherewithal to earn the skills I need to be an adult. But now that I’m an adult it doesn’t really help me much, so screw college, I never needed it.”

]]> By: Anonymous http://boingboing.net/2011/05/27/interview-ran-prieur.html#comment-1124362 Anonymous Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1124362 First off, Ran is not pompous. To those who are themselves pompous perhaps it comes off that he has the same motivations as you. Authority always has a problem with "insolence". Ran is "pompous" and a "looter" because he does not recognize the authority you worship. Secondly, he bought his land because he is frugal and yeah, a "freegan" dumpster diver too. The dude simply has no need for just about anything. He has a bare bones PC running I believe Damn Small Linux. Dude has no addictions or habits. He's simply an inquisitive man with a big heart and recognizes the vast, vast, vast amounts of waste and sadness this existence and society produce. Ran is not an "authority", he's an idea box who believes everything is free at its core existential level. He's more law abiding probably than anyone posting comments here. He just doesn't follow your rules. I've often disagreed with him. But the nice thing about Ran is disagreement is not a personal matter. Ran is not a guru. Ran is just a man with a lot of ideas many of us in the early 2000s here in Seattle and elsewhere (thanks to the Internet) pontificated on a more sane "lifestyle" in this post 9/11 world all at the same time and built off of each other's ideas. Ran is legit and a simple idealist. --dunneiv First off, Ran is not pompous. To those who are themselves pompous perhaps it comes off that he has the same motivations as you. Authority always has a problem with “insolence”. Ran is “pompous” and a “looter” because he does not recognize the authority you worship.

Secondly, he bought his land because he is frugal and yeah, a “freegan” dumpster diver too. The dude simply has no need for just about anything. He has a bare bones PC running I believe Damn Small Linux. Dude has no addictions or habits. He’s simply an inquisitive man with a big heart and recognizes the vast, vast, vast amounts of waste and sadness this existence and society produce.

Ran is not an “authority”, he’s an idea box who believes everything is free at its core existential level. He’s more law abiding probably than anyone posting comments here. He just doesn’t follow your rules. I’ve often disagreed with him. But the nice thing about Ran is disagreement is not a personal matter.

Ran is not a guru. Ran is just a man with a lot of ideas many of us in the early 2000s here in Seattle and elsewhere (thanks to the Internet) pontificated on a more sane “lifestyle” in this post 9/11 world all at the same time and built off of each other’s ideas. Ran is legit and a simple idealist.

–dunneiv

]]> By: greebo http://boingboing.net/2011/05/27/interview-ran-prieur.html#comment-1122828 greebo Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1122828 Some interesting thoughts there, but he seems to be missing the idea of building communities who approach this together rather than as individuals. The Walk Out movement seems more viable: http://www.walkoutwalkon.net/ As does the transition town movement in the UK: http://transitionculture.org/about/ We're going to need a lot more of this kind of work as we face the slow collapse, now that the era of cheap abundant energy is over. Some interesting thoughts there, but he seems to be missing the idea of building communities who approach this together rather than as individuals.

The Walk Out movement seems more viable:
http://www.walkoutwalkon.net/
As does the transition town movement in the UK:
http://transitionculture.org/about/

We’re going to need a lot more of this kind of work as we face the slow collapse, now that the era of cheap abundant energy is over.

]]> By: jalmos http://boingboing.net/2011/05/27/interview-ran-prieur.html#comment-1122829 jalmos Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1122829 Didn't even see that one. He's not only a pompous ass, he's also a nutter. Didn’t even see that one.

He’s not only a pompous ass, he’s also a nutter.

]]> By: Wallenstein http://boingboing.net/2011/05/27/interview-ran-prieur.html#comment-1122831 Wallenstein Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1122831 It still feels like a trendy hobby, rather than a serious commitment. Ran's not dropped out of society, he's just bought into the normal middle-class goal of having a weekend bolthole when life in the city gets a bit too much. Ran uses a truck like the rest of us, buys his building supplies in Home Depot, and had $12000 dollars to spend on a "place in the country" (I wish!)... he even wants to put satellite internet in his cob house! Having said that, his advice from the 2004 essay is good: basically, you can't "drop out" completely, but you can find a mental space that gives you some freedom from the pressures of society. I can't see how that links to the doomer scenario though... could be summarised as "there's more to life than work, so find something interesting to do in your free time". It still feels like a trendy hobby, rather than a serious commitment.

Ran’s not dropped out of society, he’s just bought into the normal middle-class goal of having a weekend bolthole when life in the city gets a bit too much.

Ran uses a truck like the rest of us, buys his building supplies in Home Depot, and had $12000 dollars to spend on a “place in the country” (I wish!)… he even wants to put satellite internet in his cob house!

Having said that, his advice from the 2004 essay is good: basically, you can’t “drop out” completely, but you can find a mental space that gives you some freedom from the pressures of society.

I can’t see how that links to the doomer scenario though… could be summarised as “there’s more to life than work, so find something interesting to do in your free time”.

]]> By: jsd http://boingboing.net/2011/05/27/interview-ran-prieur.html#comment-1122834 jsd Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1122834 This guy indulges in some of the most absurd 9/11 conspiracy theories. His argument is invalid. This guy indulges in some of the most absurd 9/11 conspiracy theories. His argument is invalid.

]]> By: Samuel http://boingboing.net/2011/05/27/interview-ran-prieur.html#comment-1128214 Samuel Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1128214 Most of these comments try to find one or two details to dismiss the entirety of his philosophies. My favorite is this: "and had $12000 dollars to spend on a "place in the country" (I wish!)..." The man is extremely frugal. He didn't get that land by buying every latest iPhone, spending a lifetime obsessing over finding opportunities to bring in more cash, buying the most expensive house said cash can barely support, and then finally, one day, purchasing land with dozens of times the income he has. I bet his land is the only thing he owns that is more expensive than what you own. Also, most of the commenters respond to his ideas about civilization and "going back to the land" by imagining a silly stereotype, like some fool running around in animal skins banging sticks together or something like that. People who live "outside of civilization" have been taking advantage of civilization's byproducts for as long as they've existed. That's entirely separate from the question of whether or not our form of civilization is a healthy thing that will last. And it fails on both counts. Most of these comments try to find one or two details to dismiss the entirety of his philosophies.

My favorite is this:

“and had $12000 dollars to spend on a “place in the country” (I wish!)…”

The man is extremely frugal. He didn’t get that land by buying every latest iPhone, spending a lifetime obsessing over finding opportunities to bring in more cash, buying the most expensive house said cash can barely support, and then finally, one day, purchasing land with dozens of times the income he has.

I bet his land is the only thing he owns that is more expensive than what you own.

Also, most of the commenters respond to his ideas about civilization and “going back to the land” by imagining a silly stereotype, like some fool running around in animal skins banging sticks together or something like that. People who live “outside of civilization” have been taking advantage of civilization’s byproducts for as long as they’ve existed. That’s entirely separate from the question of whether or not our form of civilization is a healthy thing that will last. And it fails on both counts.

]]> By: Anonymous http://boingboing.net/2011/05/27/interview-ran-prieur.html#comment-1122840 Anonymous Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1122840 To quote my brother "Ran Prieur is a boss, not in the sense of hierarchical employment in the sense of a boss." To quote my brother
“Ran Prieur is a boss, not in the sense of hierarchical employment in the sense of a boss.”

]]> By: pauldavis http://boingboing.net/2011/05/27/interview-ran-prieur.html#comment-1123354 pauldavis Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1123354 I think we've had enough Douglas Rushkoff right here on BB, directly from the horse's mouth, as they say. I think we’ve had enough Douglas Rushkoff right here on BB, directly from the horse’s mouth, as they say.

]]> By: Samuel http://boingboing.net/2011/05/27/interview-ran-prieur.html#comment-1128222 Samuel Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1128222 (P.S. I like one-liners) "So drop out all you want. But a few folks from your parents (or grandparents) generation did that too. And a few folks from their parents or grandparents did too. And yet ... here we are. Something to think about." And if a few people jumped off the Titanic, that would have changed nothing at all. (P.S. I like one-liners)

“So drop out all you want. But a few folks from your parents (or grandparents) generation did that too. And a few folks from their parents or grandparents did too. And yet … here we are. Something to think about.”

And if a few people jumped off the Titanic, that would have changed nothing at all.

]]> By: Anonymous http://boingboing.net/2011/05/27/interview-ran-prieur.html#comment-1122854 Anonymous Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1122854 He lost me when he essentially refused to answer anything. For example: "Well, I don't know if I like to be a hero. I think it was Nietzsche who said that nobody who understands fame wants to be famous" "Well, I'm a little wary of the term "self sufficiency" if you take it in a strict sense, self sufficiency is a lie" "But the word "permaculture", I always carefully define it as a brand. Permaculture is a brand like Nike or something." He doesn't really answer much. permaculture is, if anything, the practical side of the movement - it's not about why you should be doing things, it's about how to do them once you've decided to. You buy a book about permaculture, and it spends the entire time talking about how best to look after your vegetable garden in a three-season system, so the chickens have one third of the garden to roam at any given time. He lost me when he essentially refused to answer anything. For example:

“Well, I don’t know if I like to be a hero. I think it was Nietzsche who said that nobody who understands fame wants to be famous”
“Well, I’m a little wary of the term “self sufficiency” if you take it in a strict sense, self sufficiency is a lie”
“But the word “permaculture”, I always carefully define it as a brand. Permaculture is a brand like Nike or something.”

He doesn’t really answer much. permaculture is, if anything, the practical side of the movement – it’s not about why you should be doing things, it’s about how to do them once you’ve decided to. You buy a book about permaculture, and it spends the entire time talking about how best to look after your vegetable garden in a three-season system, so the chickens have one third of the garden to roam at any given time.

]]> By: pauldavis http://boingboing.net/2011/05/27/interview-ran-prieur.html#comment-1123120 pauldavis Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1123120 I don't actually care whether he is a farce or pretensious. All I care about is when people advocate things that have been done in generations that came before and did not lead to the predicted outcome. The hippies and more broadly the back-to-the-land and communitarian movements of the late 1960's and early 1970's definitely had some effects on US society. But did either of them in any way remotely accomplish what their advocates claimed was the point (even if the point was to have no point) ? And punk definitely has had an impact both on the US and the UK and possibly wider afield, but has it actually changed things in any ways that are remotely like the original chants, goals, tastes of the original punks? So drop out all you want. But a few folks from your parents (or grandparents) generation did that too. And a few folks from their parents or grandparents did too. And yet ... here we are. Something to think about. I don’t actually care whether he is a farce or pretensious. All I care about is when people advocate things that have been done in generations that came before and did not lead to the predicted outcome. The hippies and more broadly the back-to-the-land and communitarian movements of the late 1960′s and early 1970′s definitely had some effects on US society. But did either of them in any way remotely accomplish what their advocates claimed was the point (even if the point was to have no point) ? And punk definitely has had an impact both on the US and the UK and possibly wider afield, but has it actually changed things in any ways that are remotely like the original chants, goals, tastes of the original punks?

So drop out all you want. But a few folks from your parents (or grandparents) generation did that too. And a few folks from their parents or grandparents did too. And yet … here we are. Something to think about.

]]> By: johan,karlskrona http://boingboing.net/2011/05/27/interview-ran-prieur.html#comment-1123894 johan,karlskrona Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1123894 You're probably right, but a good interview is something else. You’re probably right, but a good interview is something else.

]]> By: arikol http://boingboing.net/2011/05/27/interview-ran-prieur.html#comment-1122874 arikol Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1122874 I have to agree with the above comments. Some of his stuff makes sense, then you get to the apparent doublethink, and finally you come to http://www.ranprieur.com/essays/911FAQ.html sorry, but no. greebo #6 also has a great point about community, and working together. Heck, all the above comments are sane, sensible, well thought out, and show this guy to be a nutter with a summerhouse in the woods. I have to agree with the above comments. Some of his stuff makes sense, then you get to the apparent doublethink, and finally you come to http://www.ranprieur.com/essays/911FAQ.html

sorry, but no.

greebo #6 also has a great point about community, and working together.

Heck, all the above comments are sane, sensible, well thought out, and show this guy to be a nutter with a summerhouse in the woods.

]]> By: Anonymous http://boingboing.net/2011/05/27/interview-ran-prieur.html#comment-1123386 Anonymous Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1123386 The rash and pompous :) over-use of the word "pompous" in these comments sprouts from the dynamic between Ran's personal and neurotic fixations and the similarly poised fixations of people sitting at the other end of the spectrum. People like the reformed hippies of the 70's who've awoken from their stupor of idealism only to find solace in the realistic idea of industrial hard-ship, or, for example, the college graduates who rest the budding of their emotional intelligence on ADMISSION and COMPLETION of a student' tenure. Does he not encourage thinking people to attend universities? I think he's just saying that you can don't HAVE to grind your way through years of a degree that makes you unhappy, whilst holding only the EXPECTATION that contentedness will come when your degree's over. Sorry, when you get that first job. Sorry again, after that first promotion (Not that all students/graduates experience this). I don't think there's any need for anger or derision, I think he's merely preaching HIS guide to spiritual balance. Or we could just burn him at the stake. After all, tolerance IS a boring farce. The rash and pompous :) over-use of the word “pompous” in these comments sprouts from the dynamic between Ran’s personal and neurotic fixations and the similarly poised fixations of people sitting at the other end of the spectrum. People like the reformed hippies of the 70′s who’ve awoken from their stupor of idealism only to find solace in the realistic idea of industrial hard-ship, or, for example, the college graduates who rest the budding of their emotional intelligence on ADMISSION and COMPLETION of a student’ tenure. Does he not encourage thinking people to attend universities? I think he’s just saying that you can don’t HAVE to grind your way through years of a degree that makes you unhappy, whilst holding only the EXPECTATION that contentedness will come when your degree’s over. Sorry, when you get that first job. Sorry again, after that first promotion (Not that all students/graduates experience this).

I don’t think there’s any need for anger or derision, I think he’s merely preaching HIS guide to spiritual balance.

Or we could just burn him at the stake. After all, tolerance IS a boring farce.

]]> By: Anonymous http://boingboing.net/2011/05/27/interview-ran-prieur.html#comment-1122879 Anonymous Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1122879 Dear high school kids (all of them, not just the smart ones), Do everything possible to go to college. Seriously. Somehow this guy seems to think that the only thing you learn at college is how to "think and act like an educated person." However, a "smart kid" or anyone who actually attends classes and puts forth effort into the academic side of their chosen major will absolutely learn more than an affected social manner. The value of what any honest person learns at college - socially, academically, emotionally, etc... - far exceeds the monetary cost incurred. Also, you end up with a degree, which has very real value in today's world. Debt is only scary to people who are unwilling to do the work it takes to pay it off, and a college loan is the very best kind of monetary debt to carry into your chosen profession. Don't ever let some pedantic wannabe hermit lecture you about an educational establishment he obviously didn't pay attention to. Dear BoingBoing, Please don't feed trolls, especially professional conspiracy theorists who can't wait to tell us how wrong we all have it. At the very least, read the trolls' websites and stick with people who have some kind of realistic grasp of the world the rest of us live in. Please? Dear high school kids (all of them, not just the smart ones),
Do everything possible to go to college. Seriously. Somehow this guy seems to think that the only thing you learn at college is how to “think and act like an educated person.” However, a “smart kid” or anyone who actually attends classes and puts forth effort into the academic side of their chosen major will absolutely learn more than an affected social manner. The value of what any honest person learns at college – socially, academically, emotionally, etc… – far exceeds the monetary cost incurred. Also, you end up with a degree, which has very real value in today’s world.

Debt is only scary to people who are unwilling to do the work it takes to pay it off, and a college loan is the very best kind of monetary debt to carry into your chosen profession. Don’t ever let some pedantic wannabe hermit lecture you about an educational establishment he obviously didn’t pay attention to.

Dear BoingBoing,
Please don’t feed trolls, especially professional conspiracy theorists who can’t wait to tell us how wrong we all have it. At the very least, read the trolls’ websites and stick with people who have some kind of realistic grasp of the world the rest of us live in. Please?

]]> By: Anonymous http://boingboing.net/2011/05/27/interview-ran-prieur.html#comment-1123136 Anonymous Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1123136 Personally, I try to find insight where I can. It does not matter to me what else a person says if I can connect to any part of it. I found the parts about how much more difficult it is try to follow your own path, rather than to do what is expected of you moving. I also found learning of "Operation Northwoods" to be particularly chilling. Personally, I try to find insight where I can. It does not matter to me what else a person says if I can connect to any part of it.

I found the parts about how much more difficult it is try to follow your own path, rather than to do what is expected of you moving.

I also found learning of “Operation Northwoods” to be particularly chilling.

]]> By: ahmacrom http://boingboing.net/2011/05/27/interview-ran-prieur.html#comment-1122884 ahmacrom Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1122884 I read the FAQ on (9/11). He reads Charles Fort ! Since there are gaping holes in the official 9/11 reports, he's asking and trying to find the answers to questions a lot of people are asking. My straight laced science teacher thought Sagan was a loser cause he smoked pot and would not entertain any discussions of his books. I read the FAQ on (9/11). He reads Charles Fort ! Since there are gaping holes in the official 9/11 reports, he’s asking and trying to find the answers to questions a lot of people are asking. My straight laced science teacher thought Sagan was a loser cause he smoked pot and would not entertain any discussions of his books.

]]> By: Anonymous http://boingboing.net/2011/05/27/interview-ran-prieur.html#comment-1138510 Anonymous Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1138510 Wow...sounds like Ran really hit some nerves. Those who are ranting and raving against him are clearly firmly rooted in the messed up society Ran talks about dropping out of. Go Ran! Keep on writing. Love your stuff. Wow…sounds like Ran really hit some nerves. Those who are ranting and raving against him are clearly firmly rooted in the messed up society Ran talks about dropping out of.

Go Ran! Keep on writing. Love your stuff.

]]> By: Anonymous http://boingboing.net/2011/05/27/interview-ran-prieur.html#comment-1122903 Anonymous Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1122903 Wow! I never expected two of my favorite blogs to cross pollinate like this! Thanks for the interview Ran! @jalmos : at the heart of anger lies fear Wow! I never expected two of my favorite blogs to cross pollinate like this! Thanks for the interview Ran!

@jalmos : at the heart of anger lies fear

]]> By: Anonymous http://boingboing.net/2011/05/27/interview-ran-prieur.html#comment-1123422 Anonymous Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1123422 Here is a thought, maybe Ran is just a person, trying in his own way to do, and to be, what he believes? Just like you, just like me. If nothing else, he should get credit for openly sharing what he is, what he is doing, what he believes...knowing full well the wide range of responses he is likely to elicit. There is far too much work to do, for anyone to waste time Throwing the First Stone. One of Ran's points with which I absolutely agree: do not go into massive debt for college, or for *anything* else...there is always another way. Debt will suck the life out of you, debt makes a free man into a slave. This should not be news to anyone with a brain. Is Dumpster Diving "looting"? Is the Perfect the Enemy of the Good? Debating beliefs or concepts is fair. Ad hominem quips are not. I don't agree with everything he says on his site, but I respect him for speaking honestly and for making an effort to inspire dialogue. -phadraigin Here is a thought, maybe Ran is just a person, trying in his own way to do, and to be, what he believes?

Just like you, just like me.

If nothing else, he should get credit for openly sharing what he is, what he is doing, what he believes…knowing full well the wide range of responses he is likely to elicit.

There is far too much work to do, for anyone to waste time Throwing the First Stone.

One of Ran’s points with which I absolutely agree: do not go into massive debt for college, or for *anything* else…there is always another way. Debt will suck the life out of you, debt makes a free man into a slave. This should not be news to anyone with a brain.

Is Dumpster Diving “looting”? Is the Perfect the Enemy of the Good?

Debating beliefs or concepts is fair. Ad hominem quips are not. I don’t agree with everything he says on his site, but I respect him for speaking honestly and for making an effort to inspire dialogue.

-phadraigin

]]> By: duncan http://boingboing.net/2011/05/27/interview-ran-prieur.html#comment-1122920 duncan Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1122920 It sounds to me like he's just another part of the system he purports is going down. It sounds to me like he’s just another part of the system he purports is going down.

]]> By: Glogin http://boingboing.net/2011/05/27/interview-ran-prieur.html#comment-1123442 Glogin Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1123442 In terms of college, I think Ran is just trying to say you should pick institutions which fits your circumstances whether it be a traditional university, technical trade school, art school, an internship, a professional job, or etc. Also, since many colleges in the U.S. have become unaffordable it makes sense that he’d complain about debt forcing individuals to choose from a shrinking set of options which may or may not fit their educational needs and aspirations. I’ve also been told many times that college, life after high school, (and, trust me when I say this life does go on after high school), or what have you is a place in time when you get an opportunity to find then redefine yourself instead of letting today’s public school institutions, which may or may not provide for a student s full intellectual enrichment (especially due to recent budget shortfalls), do it for you. Of course, Ran does without a doubt ramble on a lot during improvisational interviews and like any of us is susceptible to error since, he’s just human. Overall though, his trials along with his errors, as this interview doubtlessly shows, have changed his viewpoints on many issues over time to the point where he’s had to revise or get rid of old perspectives. So, instead of just tearing down Ran’s ideas, I think its important to just take the strong points he makes then build from those while also making our own mistakes while doing so. In terms of college, I think Ran is just trying to say you should pick institutions which fits your circumstances whether it be a traditional university, technical trade school, art school, an internship, a professional job, or etc. Also, since many colleges in the U.S. have become unaffordable it makes sense that he’d complain about debt forcing individuals to choose from a shrinking set of options which may or may not fit their educational needs and aspirations. I’ve also been told many times that college, life after high school, (and, trust me when I say this life does go on after high school), or what have you is a place in time when you get an opportunity to find then redefine yourself instead of letting today’s public school institutions, which may or may not provide for a student s full intellectual enrichment (especially due to recent budget shortfalls), do it for you. Of course, Ran does without a doubt ramble on a lot during improvisational interviews and like any of us is susceptible to error since, he’s just human. Overall though, his trials along with his errors, as this interview doubtlessly shows, have changed his viewpoints on many issues over time to the point where he’s had to revise or get rid of old perspectives. So, instead of just tearing down Ran’s ideas, I think its important to just take the strong points he makes then build from those while also making our own mistakes while doing so.

]]> By: wylkyn http://boingboing.net/2011/05/27/interview-ran-prieur.html#comment-1122932 wylkyn Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1122932 This guy's philosophy strikes me as that of the teenage variety, but instead of ranting about screwed up "the parents" are, it is "society" that has serious problems. (I'm guessing that when he was in school, all his teachers just didn't understand him!) How this guy makes being a parasite sound morally superior...amazing. We adults will continue to try to work together to try to make society better, a little at a time. You kids go ahead and run away from home...I'm sure you'll show us! And after you're done plucking those organic eggs (that we paid for) from the trash, be sure to put the lid back on the trash can. And be quiet about it, would you? Some of us have to work in the morning. This guy’s philosophy strikes me as that of the teenage variety, but instead of ranting about screwed up “the parents” are, it is “society” that has serious problems. (I’m guessing that when he was in school, all his teachers just didn’t understand him!) How this guy makes being a parasite sound morally superior…amazing. We adults will continue to try to work together to try to make society better, a little at a time. You kids go ahead and run away from home…I’m sure you’ll show us! And after you’re done plucking those organic eggs (that we paid for) from the trash, be sure to put the lid back on the trash can. And be quiet about it, would you? Some of us have to work in the morning.

]]> By: Anonymous http://boingboing.net/2011/05/27/interview-ran-prieur.html#comment-1124987 Anonymous Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1124987 I think Ran's work is in the same vein as Crass... it's all about self-empowerment. "There is No Authority But Yourself" I wonder about anyone Ran's writing manages to anger. If this interview makes you mad, ask yourself why. No well adjusted person should be upset by anything he writes. I know Ran won't be reading these comments, but he knows how much his fans love him. Keep it up Ran! I think Ran’s work is in the same vein as Crass… it’s all about self-empowerment. “There is No Authority But Yourself”

I wonder about anyone Ran’s writing manages to anger. If this interview makes you mad, ask yourself why. No well adjusted person should be upset by anything he writes.

I know Ran won’t be reading these comments, but he knows how much his fans love him. Keep it up Ran!

]]> By: andyhavens http://boingboing.net/2011/05/27/interview-ran-prieur.html#comment-1123198 andyhavens Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1123198 I'm confused about what I don't have the power to say "no" to that's based on culture, technology, business or socialization. As a citizen, I can't say "no" to stuff like, you know... laws... but the rest of it? I don't have to shop, eat, watch or drive anything I don't want to. Do I? I mean, as he says, it's much harder to do for yourself... but, then again, it always has been. What I say "no" to *RIGHT NOW* is growing my own food, cooking my own medicine and performing my own dental surgery. I have the freedom to say "no" to writing my own novels, filming my own movies/tv, performing my own music and designing my own video games. I very much enjoy the work of others -- both culturally and industrially -- and say "no" to doing it myself. Could we do a better job environmentally, etc? Sure. All kinds of ways we could do better. But I don't see that rejecting the whole shebang is helpful. Seems kind of over-simplistic and, well... douchey. I’m confused about what I don’t have the power to say “no” to that’s based on culture, technology, business or socialization. As a citizen, I can’t say “no” to stuff like, you know… laws… but the rest of it? I don’t have to shop, eat, watch or drive anything I don’t want to. Do I? I mean, as he says, it’s much harder to do for yourself… but, then again, it always has been.

What I say “no” to *RIGHT NOW* is growing my own food, cooking my own medicine and performing my own dental surgery. I have the freedom to say “no” to writing my own novels, filming my own movies/tv, performing my own music and designing my own video games. I very much enjoy the work of others — both culturally and industrially — and say “no” to doing it myself.

Could we do a better job environmentally, etc? Sure. All kinds of ways we could do better. But I don’t see that rejecting the whole shebang is helpful. Seems kind of over-simplistic and, well… douchey.

]]> By: LT http://boingboing.net/2011/05/27/interview-ran-prieur.html#comment-1124478 LT Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1124478 Enjoyed the article. I am a "Ran Fan" having followed his web site for about 6 months. If you enjoy thinking outside the box, and are concerned with the way energy decline will play out or just want to head toward downshifting your economic footprint then I would highly recommend his web site. If you are into conformity .... it's not likely to be your cup of tea. I also see 9-11 needs to be added to religion and politics as subjects to avoid if you don't want to ruffle feathers ;-) Enjoyed the article. I am a “Ran Fan” having followed his web site for about 6 months. If you enjoy thinking outside the box, and are concerned with the way energy decline will play out or just want to head toward downshifting your economic footprint then I would highly recommend his web site. If you are into conformity …. it’s not likely to be your cup of tea. I also see 9-11 needs to be added to religion and politics as subjects to avoid if you don’t want to ruffle feathers ;-)

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