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	<title>Comments on: Incandescent light bulbs have not been&#160;banned</title>
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	<link>http://boingboing.net/2011/08/10/incandescent-light-bulbs-have-not-been-banned.html</link>
	<description>Brain candy for Happy Mutants</description>
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		<title>By: Antinous / Moderator</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2011/08/10/incandescent-light-bulbs-have-not-been-banned.html#comment-1186362</link>
		<dc:creator>Antinous / Moderator</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Aug 2011 08:16:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=112873#comment-1186362</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;there&#039;s not really a whole lot that can &quot;go wrong&quot;.&lt;/blockquote&gt;That&#039;s the Nicene Creed of Jinxology.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>there&#8217;s not really a whole lot that can &#8220;go wrong&#8221;.</p></blockquote>
<p>That&#8217;s the Nicene Creed of Jinxology.</p>
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		<title>By: gordonjcp</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2011/08/10/incandescent-light-bulbs-have-not-been-banned.html#comment-1186334</link>
		<dc:creator>gordonjcp</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Aug 2011 07:45:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=112873#comment-1186334</guid>
		<description>Well I guess it wouldn&#039;t hurt to swap a &quot;known-good&quot; lamp in.  I can&#039;t see why the base would make a difference, though.  It&#039;s just two brass pins on springs, there&#039;s not really a whole lot that can &quot;go wrong&quot;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well I guess it wouldn&#8217;t hurt to swap a &#8220;known-good&#8221; lamp in.  I can&#8217;t see why the base would make a difference, though.  It&#8217;s just two brass pins on springs, there&#8217;s not really a whole lot that can &#8220;go wrong&#8221;.</p>
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		<title>By: Navin_Johnson</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2011/08/10/incandescent-light-bulbs-have-not-been-banned.html#comment-1185571</link>
		<dc:creator>Navin_Johnson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Aug 2011 15:48:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=112873#comment-1185571</guid>
		<description>The article is about the U.S.   get over it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The article is about the U.S.   get over it.</p>
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		<title>By: jan angevine</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2011/08/10/incandescent-light-bulbs-have-not-been-banned.html#comment-1185435</link>
		<dc:creator>jan angevine</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Aug 2011 13:05:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=112873#comment-1185435</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t get it. If you can buy an incandescent 70 watt bulb (that produces 100 watts), how can this be construed as &quot;banning incandescents&quot;? If you can buy incandescents, they are not banned. Right? </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t get it. If you can buy an incandescent 70 watt bulb (that produces 100 watts), how can this be construed as &#8220;banning incandescents&#8221;? If you can buy incandescents, they are not banned. Right? </p>
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		<title>By: Andrew Davies</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2011/08/10/incandescent-light-bulbs-have-not-been-banned.html#comment-1185371</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew Davies</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Aug 2011 11:26:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=112873#comment-1185371</guid>
		<description>You can if you want, but you&#039;ll have to wait 6-10 years for them to burn out.  

Personally, I&#039;d recommend taking them to your local recycling center (unless you&#039;re one of those recycling haters).  Many of the stores that sell CFLs will also take used ones back.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You can if you want, but you&#8217;ll have to wait 6-10 years for them to burn out.  </p>
<p>Personally, I&#8217;d recommend taking them to your local recycling center (unless you&#8217;re one of those recycling haters).  Many of the stores that sell CFLs will also take used ones back.</p>
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		<title>By: Andrew Davies</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2011/08/10/incandescent-light-bulbs-have-not-been-banned.html#comment-1185367</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew Davies</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Aug 2011 11:22:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=112873#comment-1185367</guid>
		<description>Wow, do you get your talking points from the same place as Wally?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow, do you get your talking points from the same place as Wally?</p>
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		<title>By: Wally Ballou</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2011/08/10/incandescent-light-bulbs-have-not-been-banned.html#comment-1185361</link>
		<dc:creator>Wally Ballou</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Aug 2011 11:05:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=112873#comment-1185361</guid>
		<description>&quot;Whistle a happy tune and toss the things in a dumpster.&quot;

Not a bad idea.

One thing I do NOT recommend under any circumstances is that opponents of the ban lightly pack used CFL&#039;s and then mail them to the local offices of legislators who voted for it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Whistle a happy tune and toss the things in a dumpster.&#8221;</p>
<p>Not a bad idea.</p>
<p>One thing I do NOT recommend under any circumstances is that opponents of the ban lightly pack used CFL&#8217;s and then mail them to the local offices of legislators who voted for it.</p>
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		<title>By: masamunecyrus</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2011/08/10/incandescent-light-bulbs-have-not-been-banned.html#comment-1185355</link>
		<dc:creator>masamunecyrus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Aug 2011 10:27:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=112873#comment-1185355</guid>
		<description>I was actually looking into alternative lighting for my cousin&#039;s wedding (better than a toaster, yo), recently, and now is really finally the time, I think, when lightbulb technology is advancing. I&#039;d like to share what I have found.

Firstly, I send you to this link from PhysOrg, where a researcher came up with a way of both improving incandescent efficiency to CFL levels, but also simultaneously found a way to improve their spectrum.
http://www.physorg.com/news162821951.html

Then there is the new halogen-cfl hybrid bulb by GE. It looks like a normal lightbulb, uses a halogen to turn bright immediately, and turns the halogen off when the CFL bulb reaches maximum brightness.
http://inhabitat.com/ge-unveils-hybrid-halogen-cfl-light-bulbs-for-2011/

There are also these great ESL bulbs (I have one on pre-order). They look to have an improved spectrum over LED and CFL, they are cheap, and they are dimmable. The technology also has a nice side-effect of taking about a second to reach max brightness, so they sort of fade on instead of abruptly and instantly turning on.
http://www.vu1corporation.com/

Philips has recently come out with their A19 AmbientLED bulb which appears to be the first 60W equivalent LED bulb. It&#039;s dimmable, omni-directional, and looks the same as an incandescent.
http://www.led-resource.com/2011/06/philips-ambientled-a19-12-5w-led-bulb-review/

And Cree has produced a proof-of-concept LED bulb called the TrueWhite that is just as good, if not better, than the Philips.
http://www.truewhitelight.com/#/content/pages/light.html

And also with the energy crisis in Japan, we have the best electronics companies in the world pumping money into energy-efficient lighting like there&#039;s no tomorrow.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was actually looking into alternative lighting for my cousin&#8217;s wedding (better than a toaster, yo), recently, and now is really finally the time, I think, when lightbulb technology is advancing. I&#8217;d like to share what I have found.</p>
<p>Firstly, I send you to this link from PhysOrg, where a researcher came up with a way of both improving incandescent efficiency to CFL levels, but also simultaneously found a way to improve their spectrum.<br />
<a href="http://www.physorg.com/news162821951.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.physorg.com/news162821951.html</a></p>
<p>Then there is the new halogen-cfl hybrid bulb by GE. It looks like a normal lightbulb, uses a halogen to turn bright immediately, and turns the halogen off when the CFL bulb reaches maximum brightness.<br />
<a href="http://inhabitat.com/ge-unveils-hybrid-halogen-cfl-light-bulbs-for-2011/" rel="nofollow">http://inhabitat.com/ge-unveils-hybrid-halogen-cfl-light-bulbs-for-2011/</a></p>
<p>There are also these great ESL bulbs (I have one on pre-order). They look to have an improved spectrum over LED and CFL, they are cheap, and they are dimmable. The technology also has a nice side-effect of taking about a second to reach max brightness, so they sort of fade on instead of abruptly and instantly turning on.<br />
<a href="http://www.vu1corporation.com/" rel="nofollow">http://www.vu1corporation.com/</a></p>
<p>Philips has recently come out with their A19 AmbientLED bulb which appears to be the first 60W equivalent LED bulb. It&#8217;s dimmable, omni-directional, and looks the same as an incandescent.<br />
<a href="http://www.led-resource.com/2011/06/philips-ambientled-a19-12-5w-led-bulb-review/" rel="nofollow">http://www.led-resource.com/2011/06/philips-ambientled-a19-12-5w-led-bulb-review/</a></p>
<p>And Cree has produced a proof-of-concept LED bulb called the TrueWhite that is just as good, if not better, than the Philips.<br />
<a href="http://www.truewhitelight.com/#/content/pages/light.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.truewhitelight.com/#/content/pages/light.html</a></p>
<p>And also with the energy crisis in Japan, we have the best electronics companies in the world pumping money into energy-efficient lighting like there&#8217;s no tomorrow.</p>
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		<title>By: Antinous / Moderator</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2011/08/10/incandescent-light-bulbs-have-not-been-banned.html#comment-1185344</link>
		<dc:creator>Antinous / Moderator</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Aug 2011 10:07:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=112873#comment-1185344</guid>
		<description>You really made yourself an identity called &#039;anonymouspostingnowbanned&#039;?  Wow.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You really made yourself an identity called &#8216;anonymouspostingnowbanned&#8217;?  Wow.</p>
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		<title>By: anonymouspostingnowbanned</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2011/08/10/incandescent-light-bulbs-have-not-been-banned.html#comment-1185339</link>
		<dc:creator>anonymouspostingnowbanned</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Aug 2011 09:58:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=112873#comment-1185339</guid>
		<description>Nobody has banned the incandescant light bulb? No - that is wrong - and even worse, lazy.
Maybe nobody has banned them in the same sense that hand guns are legal and we all drive on the right. But Boing Boing - there is a world out there beyond the USA you know?  I am sure I have seen the odd post that refers to it . . . 

In the EU such bulbs are banned - as in &quot;banned&quot;: it is even illegal for a private individual to bring one into any EU country in a suitcase, such is their terrifying ability to raise sea-levels and stoke warming around the world.

Unthinking headlines that assume USA=Generality reinforces the USA stereotype of seeing the rest of the world as an amusing potpourri of pictureque happenings that basically don&#039;t matter, as opposed to a set equally valid lifestyles and beliefs - and bans. Not what I expect from happy mutants.

And hey - no more anonymous comments?  Right . . . got to keep a track of us. And the advice given by your chosen partner? &quot;Your browser has to accept cookies from all domains&quot;!

And little by little the golden age of the internet crumbles and it becomes just another tool of registration and control. Boing Boing joins the pack - &quot;Get along there with the rest of the sheep you readers!&quot; </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nobody has banned the incandescant light bulb? No &#8211; that is wrong &#8211; and even worse, lazy.<br />
Maybe nobody has banned them in the same sense that hand guns are legal and we all drive on the right. But Boing Boing &#8211; there is a world out there beyond the USA you know?  I am sure I have seen the odd post that refers to it . . . </p>
<p>In the EU such bulbs are banned &#8211; as in &#8220;banned&#8221;: it is even illegal for a private individual to bring one into any EU country in a suitcase, such is their terrifying ability to raise sea-levels and stoke warming around the world.</p>
<p>Unthinking headlines that assume USA=Generality reinforces the USA stereotype of seeing the rest of the world as an amusing potpourri of pictureque happenings that basically don&#8217;t matter, as opposed to a set equally valid lifestyles and beliefs &#8211; and bans. Not what I expect from happy mutants.</p>
<p>And hey &#8211; no more anonymous comments?  Right . . . got to keep a track of us. And the advice given by your chosen partner? &#8220;Your browser has to accept cookies from all domains&#8221;!</p>
<p>And little by little the golden age of the internet crumbles and it becomes just another tool of registration and control. Boing Boing joins the pack &#8211; &#8220;Get along there with the rest of the sheep you readers!&#8221; </p>
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		<title>By: Antinous / Moderator</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2011/08/10/incandescent-light-bulbs-have-not-been-banned.html#comment-1185327</link>
		<dc:creator>Antinous / Moderator</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Aug 2011 08:44:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=112873#comment-1185327</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s very possibly not the bulbs, but the fixtures.  (Or to be pedantic, it&#039;s not the lamps, but the luminaires.)  I have one lamp that eats light bulbs.  They&#039;re always dim and they burn out frequently.  If I switch the bulb to any other lamp, it burns as brightly as it should.  A new base is cheaper than a CFL, so I should probably just fix it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s very possibly not the bulbs, but the fixtures.  (Or to be pedantic, it&#8217;s not the lamps, but the luminaires.)  I have one lamp that eats light bulbs.  They&#8217;re always dim and they burn out frequently.  If I switch the bulb to any other lamp, it burns as brightly as it should.  A new base is cheaper than a CFL, so I should probably just fix it.</p>
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		<title>By: gordonjcp</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2011/08/10/incandescent-light-bulbs-have-not-been-banned.html#comment-1185325</link>
		<dc:creator>gordonjcp</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Aug 2011 08:38:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=112873#comment-1185325</guid>
		<description>I can&#039;t read at all under CFL lighting, and I can&#039;t distinguish between colours properly.  This makes it difficult to work on electronic equipment. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I can&#8217;t read at all under CFL lighting, and I can&#8217;t distinguish between colours properly.  This makes it difficult to work on electronic equipment. </p>
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		<title>By: gordonjcp</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2011/08/10/incandescent-light-bulbs-have-not-been-banned.html#comment-1185324</link>
		<dc:creator>gordonjcp</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Aug 2011 08:36:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=112873#comment-1185324</guid>
		<description>I have CFLs that start dim, and stay dim.  Even after the couple of minutes it takes them to warm up, they&#039;re still nowhere near as bright as advertised.  Doesn&#039;t matter if they&#039;re expensive name-brand ones or el-cheapo ones, you still need more lamps to get the same amount of light.

All the CFLs in my house are less than six months old, because that&#039;s about how long they last.  I&#039;m switching back to 100W incandescents (which haven&#039;t been banned in the UK) because they give out more light and take less power *once you take into account the hideous power factor effects that CFLs have*. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have CFLs that start dim, and stay dim.  Even after the couple of minutes it takes them to warm up, they&#8217;re still nowhere near as bright as advertised.  Doesn&#8217;t matter if they&#8217;re expensive name-brand ones or el-cheapo ones, you still need more lamps to get the same amount of light.</p>
<p>All the CFLs in my house are less than six months old, because that&#8217;s about how long they last.  I&#8217;m switching back to 100W incandescents (which haven&#8217;t been banned in the UK) because they give out more light and take less power *once you take into account the hideous power factor effects that CFLs have*. </p>
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		<title>By: Itsumishi</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2011/08/10/incandescent-light-bulbs-have-not-been-banned.html#comment-1185306</link>
		<dc:creator>Itsumishi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Aug 2011 06:29:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=112873#comment-1185306</guid>
		<description>Every CFL I&#039;ve bought in my flat turns on instantly, however two bulbs that I&#039;m nearly positive are CFLs that were purchased before we moved in take bloody ages to warm up. 2-3 minutes when its cold.

Unfortunately for me, they&#039;re up high and in difficult to open light shades... oh and they&#039;re in the bathroom and kitchen, the two rooms in the house you actually want to be able to see clearly if you wake up in the middle of the night needing to use either of them. 

I probably should borrow a ladder from someone... and a car to carry it I suppose.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Every CFL I&#8217;ve bought in my flat turns on instantly, however two bulbs that I&#8217;m nearly positive are CFLs that were purchased before we moved in take bloody ages to warm up. 2-3 minutes when its cold.</p>
<p>Unfortunately for me, they&#8217;re up high and in difficult to open light shades&#8230; oh and they&#8217;re in the bathroom and kitchen, the two rooms in the house you actually want to be able to see clearly if you wake up in the middle of the night needing to use either of them. </p>
<p>I probably should borrow a ladder from someone&#8230; and a car to carry it I suppose.</p>
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		<title>By: Shawn RIchardson</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2011/08/10/incandescent-light-bulbs-have-not-been-banned.html#comment-1185283</link>
		<dc:creator>Shawn RIchardson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Aug 2011 04:54:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=112873#comment-1185283</guid>
		<description>To all the people asking for lumens, lumens are a crap number that is totally manipulated on the packaging.  Lumens are how bright the human eye perceives the light to be.  That would be all well and good if humans perceives the entire visible spectrum evenly but we don&#039;t. We perceive the green range as brighter.  So the manufacturers spike the green spectrum to get higher lumen values because they have convinced you that it&#039;s meaningful. But the CRI or color rendition index ends up being crap and colors look different than under CRI 100 sunlight or tungsten incandescents.

It also makes me laugh that people are now arguing that a halogen is a type of incandescent bulb so incandescents aren&#039;t banned.  True but completely disingenuous.  Incandescent bulbs as currently defined in the vernacular means an Edison bulb with a tungsten filament filled with an inert gas.  The halogen bulb works with a distinctively different chemical reaction and has been rightly considered a different type of bulb.  It sure sounds like &quot;Edison bulbs with tungsten filaments in an inert gas without a halogen that has been commonly referred to as an incandescent even though the classification of incandescent is more expansive than that and everyone knows to what you are referring unless they are being an obtuse dick&quot; are being banned to me.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To all the people asking for lumens, lumens are a crap number that is totally manipulated on the packaging.  Lumens are how bright the human eye perceives the light to be.  That would be all well and good if humans perceives the entire visible spectrum evenly but we don&#8217;t. We perceive the green range as brighter.  So the manufacturers spike the green spectrum to get higher lumen values because they have convinced you that it&#8217;s meaningful. But the CRI or color rendition index ends up being crap and colors look different than under CRI 100 sunlight or tungsten incandescents.</p>
<p>It also makes me laugh that people are now arguing that a halogen is a type of incandescent bulb so incandescents aren&#8217;t banned.  True but completely disingenuous.  Incandescent bulbs as currently defined in the vernacular means an Edison bulb with a tungsten filament filled with an inert gas.  The halogen bulb works with a distinctively different chemical reaction and has been rightly considered a different type of bulb.  It sure sounds like &#8220;Edison bulbs with tungsten filaments in an inert gas without a halogen that has been commonly referred to as an incandescent even though the classification of incandescent is more expansive than that and everyone knows to what you are referring unless they are being an obtuse dick&#8221; are being banned to me.</p>
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		<title>By: greggman</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2011/08/10/incandescent-light-bulbs-have-not-been-banned.html#comment-1185285</link>
		<dc:creator>greggman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Aug 2011 04:54:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=112873#comment-1185285</guid>
		<description>So I just want to add that 

1) In Japan, because of the quake, LEDs are everywhere. They are really pushing them. There are more LED lights on sale than CFLs at this point.

2) They are much colder than CFLs so if nothing else I want them because they&#039;ll keep my already hot apartment that much cooler.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So I just want to add that </p>
<p>1) In Japan, because of the quake, LEDs are everywhere. They are really pushing them. There are more LED lights on sale than CFLs at this point.</p>
<p>2) They are much colder than CFLs so if nothing else I want them because they&#8217;ll keep my already hot apartment that much cooler.</p>
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		<title>By: greggman</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2011/08/10/incandescent-light-bulbs-have-not-been-banned.html#comment-1185281</link>
		<dc:creator>greggman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Aug 2011 04:52:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=112873#comment-1185281</guid>
		<description>Where do you get your CFLs? Mine all take about 3 minutes to &#039;warm&#039; up. The most obvious one is the &quot;floodlight&quot; replacement in my shower. Turn it on and you can stare right at it because it&#039;s not so bright. Come back in 3 mins and it&#039;s too bright to look at.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Where do you get your CFLs? Mine all take about 3 minutes to &#8216;warm&#8217; up. The most obvious one is the &#8220;floodlight&#8221; replacement in my shower. Turn it on and you can stare right at it because it&#8217;s not so bright. Come back in 3 mins and it&#8217;s too bright to look at.</p>
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		<title>By: blurgh</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2011/08/10/incandescent-light-bulbs-have-not-been-banned.html#comment-1185272</link>
		<dc:creator>blurgh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Aug 2011 04:31:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=112873#comment-1185272</guid>
		<description>Aw, go on, it&#039;s a ban.

Yes, yes, it&#039;s only currently banning certain particularly inefficient and powerful incandescent bulbs. Yes, it&#039;s only like banning particularly fuel inefficient cars. Specifically, it&#039;s like banning particularly inefficient cars, with a planned ratcheting of the standard that means that in a decade&#039;s time all cars will be banned. (Dodgy analogy? I didn&#039;t start it. ;)

You know what? Call it a ban, I don&#039;t care. It&#039;s a good idea. Using incandescent bulbs is basically irrational - in a homo economicus free market hardly anyone would buy them. Energy inefficiency leads to pointless pollution. Energy consumption is costly and necessary, but inefficiency just means Deepwater Horizons and Fukushimas in vain. Since energy is such a big input into the economy, inefficiency is a real problem.

When someone does something that&#039;s irrational and harmful to themselves and (especially to) others around them, with no real upside, I see no problem in banning it. Just have the guts to call it that. Anything else is mealy-mouthed political reframing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Aw, go on, it&#8217;s a ban.</p>
<p>Yes, yes, it&#8217;s only currently banning certain particularly inefficient and powerful incandescent bulbs. Yes, it&#8217;s only like banning particularly fuel inefficient cars. Specifically, it&#8217;s like banning particularly inefficient cars, with a planned ratcheting of the standard that means that in a decade&#8217;s time all cars will be banned. (Dodgy analogy? I didn&#8217;t start it. ;)</p>
<p>You know what? Call it a ban, I don&#8217;t care. It&#8217;s a good idea. Using incandescent bulbs is basically irrational &#8211; in a homo economicus free market hardly anyone would buy them. Energy inefficiency leads to pointless pollution. Energy consumption is costly and necessary, but inefficiency just means Deepwater Horizons and Fukushimas in vain. Since energy is such a big input into the economy, inefficiency is a real problem.</p>
<p>When someone does something that&#8217;s irrational and harmful to themselves and (especially to) others around them, with no real upside, I see no problem in banning it. Just have the guts to call it that. Anything else is mealy-mouthed political reframing.</p>
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		<title>By: CastanhasDoPara</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2011/08/10/incandescent-light-bulbs-have-not-been-banned.html#comment-1185258</link>
		<dc:creator>CastanhasDoPara</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Aug 2011 03:30:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=112873#comment-1185258</guid>
		<description>Hmmm.. first off not an expert but... I do have some very pertinent info on this subject.

The anecdotes first. I have a few &#039;cheapo&#039; CFL lamps in use and they do take some time to warm up even in the summer. Especially the vanity lamps in the bathroom, not only that but they start off pink, purple and green (three lamps) and take about a minute to turn white and reach full brightness. Next up is a situation that seems to be more useful, the regular cheapos I have used because I didn&#039;t have anything else at the time seem to last a good long time. Haven&#039;t burned one in three years in this relatively new (to me) residence. I also have incandescents that haven&#039;t blown yet which were original to the house. So basically YMMV. Or I seem to have stable surge-free electrical supply which is surprising given the state of the system in this place, man does it need an update. Continuing, a friend of mine has had the same CFL light on his porch longer than ten years. It&#039;s a really old-school clunky looking beast and it&#039;s been outside all this time in extremes of cold and hot. So that sort of tells me that the first run was built a lot more robust that the current ones. Now, I&#039;ve lost my porch light about once a year, and it didn&#039;t matter what type it was. So I don&#039;t really know what is up with that. Save for the fact that the two CFLs were newish. I have had a table lamp burn a CFL bulb on me but that was a ground fault issue. So aside from the ones in the bathroom I have had little problem with the things. 

Scientifically, using CFLs not intended for dimming is definitely not recommended. My father experienced a small electrical fire with them. Not the bulb but the dimmer. Not really sure what was the cause there but I am really glad I was there for the event. The switch just smoked for some reason. Whatever the case, it was not cool. I replaced the dimmer with a regular switch and all is fine now. Furthermore, the environmental impact of these units seems less to me. For the rare occasion that one breaks one of these things it is a significant fraction of the amount of mercury from a full 4&#039; tube. On that note, people used to chop them up in something like a woodchipper to dispose of them. They don&#039;t do this now as it&#039;s known to be a health hazard. Still though the tiny little CFL is nowhere near the volume of a 4&#039; tube. And not only that they are a good deal more resilient. 

FWIW, I think they are more beneficial overall given the significant reduction in energy use. But there are still those elements out there that will say anything to get people riled up against regulations. It&#039;s really not about efficiency, it&#039;s about perceived control and that is the real trouble. At least the trouble &#039;republicans&#039; have with the issue of CFLs and such.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hmmm.. first off not an expert but&#8230; I do have some very pertinent info on this subject.</p>
<p>The anecdotes first. I have a few &#8216;cheapo&#8217; CFL lamps in use and they do take some time to warm up even in the summer. Especially the vanity lamps in the bathroom, not only that but they start off pink, purple and green (three lamps) and take about a minute to turn white and reach full brightness. Next up is a situation that seems to be more useful, the regular cheapos I have used because I didn&#8217;t have anything else at the time seem to last a good long time. Haven&#8217;t burned one in three years in this relatively new (to me) residence. I also have incandescents that haven&#8217;t blown yet which were original to the house. So basically YMMV. Or I seem to have stable surge-free electrical supply which is surprising given the state of the system in this place, man does it need an update. Continuing, a friend of mine has had the same CFL light on his porch longer than ten years. It&#8217;s a really old-school clunky looking beast and it&#8217;s been outside all this time in extremes of cold and hot. So that sort of tells me that the first run was built a lot more robust that the current ones. Now, I&#8217;ve lost my porch light about once a year, and it didn&#8217;t matter what type it was. So I don&#8217;t really know what is up with that. Save for the fact that the two CFLs were newish. I have had a table lamp burn a CFL bulb on me but that was a ground fault issue. So aside from the ones in the bathroom I have had little problem with the things. </p>
<p>Scientifically, using CFLs not intended for dimming is definitely not recommended. My father experienced a small electrical fire with them. Not the bulb but the dimmer. Not really sure what was the cause there but I am really glad I was there for the event. The switch just smoked for some reason. Whatever the case, it was not cool. I replaced the dimmer with a regular switch and all is fine now. Furthermore, the environmental impact of these units seems less to me. For the rare occasion that one breaks one of these things it is a significant fraction of the amount of mercury from a full 4&#8242; tube. On that note, people used to chop them up in something like a woodchipper to dispose of them. They don&#8217;t do this now as it&#8217;s known to be a health hazard. Still though the tiny little CFL is nowhere near the volume of a 4&#8242; tube. And not only that they are a good deal more resilient. </p>
<p>FWIW, I think they are more beneficial overall given the significant reduction in energy use. But there are still those elements out there that will say anything to get people riled up against regulations. It&#8217;s really not about efficiency, it&#8217;s about perceived control and that is the real trouble. At least the trouble &#8216;republicans&#8217; have with the issue of CFLs and such.</p>
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		<title>By: teufelsdrochk</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2011/08/10/incandescent-light-bulbs-have-not-been-banned.html#comment-1185233</link>
		<dc:creator>teufelsdrochk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Aug 2011 02:18:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=112873#comment-1185233</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ve read the comments and I now know: the essential problem is that bulbs are rated for watts, not for lumens. People think a 70W bulb produces less light than a 100W bulb. Rate them for lumens and the conversation goes away.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve read the comments and I now know: the essential problem is that bulbs are rated for watts, not for lumens. People think a 70W bulb produces less light than a 100W bulb. Rate them for lumens and the conversation goes away.</p>
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		<title>By: mccrum</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2011/08/10/incandescent-light-bulbs-have-not-been-banned.html#comment-1185231</link>
		<dc:creator>mccrum</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Aug 2011 02:09:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=112873#comment-1185231</guid>
		<description>Things have changed as technologies have.  GE has a line called Energy Smart Dimming Spirals and Philips rolls with Energy Saver Dimmables.  Originally forward-phase dimming had issues with CFLs because of the way the wave jumps from 0-120 volts and then simply turns off sooner rather than later.  This caused 60 turn-ons a second in a technology that was looking for constant voltage to keep the electrons excited between the electrodes.  But again, in some cases, electronic ballasts have solved the issue.With improved electronic ballasts they no longer have increased draw at end of cycle, solving the second issue as well.  However, LED&#039;s currently are going through the same end of life cycle increased voltage draw but since they operate at low voltage in the first place the chance of fire is multitudes lower (and more often a result of improper heat dissipation, but that&#039;s a story for another day).IAALD (I Am A Lighting Designer, but always still studying)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Things have changed as technologies have.  GE has a line called Energy Smart Dimming Spirals and Philips rolls with Energy Saver Dimmables.  Originally forward-phase dimming had issues with CFLs because of the way the wave jumps from 0-120 volts and then simply turns off sooner rather than later.  This caused 60 turn-ons a second in a technology that was looking for constant voltage to keep the electrons excited between the electrodes.  But again, in some cases, electronic ballasts have solved the issue.With improved electronic ballasts they no longer have increased draw at end of cycle, solving the second issue as well.  However, LED&#8217;s currently are going through the same end of life cycle increased voltage draw but since they operate at low voltage in the first place the chance of fire is multitudes lower (and more often a result of improper heat dissipation, but that&#8217;s a story for another day).IAALD (I Am A Lighting Designer, but always still studying)</p>
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		<title>By: hardtoport</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2011/08/10/incandescent-light-bulbs-have-not-been-banned.html#comment-1185215</link>
		<dc:creator>hardtoport</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Aug 2011 01:39:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=112873#comment-1185215</guid>
		<description>The Republicans can promote inefficiency as much as they want with their legislation.  Unfortunately, those socialist countries that produce lighting products have serious energy supply shortages and they are the ones that are driving the market to low energy lighting solutions.  I&#039;m sure, over time, the cost of incandescent bulbs will rise in costs relative to LEDs....the market will price the declining demand and limited supply of incandescent bulbs at premium prices and Teapublicans can buy as many as their pocketbook and politics will allow.

I do find it funny, though, that the Party of free market principles is busy passing legislation that attempts to disrupt the very principles that they claim to support so dearly!  </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Republicans can promote inefficiency as much as they want with their legislation.  Unfortunately, those socialist countries that produce lighting products have serious energy supply shortages and they are the ones that are driving the market to low energy lighting solutions.  I&#8217;m sure, over time, the cost of incandescent bulbs will rise in costs relative to LEDs&#8230;.the market will price the declining demand and limited supply of incandescent bulbs at premium prices and Teapublicans can buy as many as their pocketbook and politics will allow.</p>
<p>I do find it funny, though, that the Party of free market principles is busy passing legislation that attempts to disrupt the very principles that they claim to support so dearly!  </p>
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		<title>By: Antinous / Moderator</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2011/08/10/incandescent-light-bulbs-have-not-been-banned.html#comment-1185177</link>
		<dc:creator>Antinous / Moderator</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Aug 2011 00:13:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=112873#comment-1185177</guid>
		<description>When I studied lighting design, those were two red flags for starting a fire.  I don&#039;t know the reasons for the first one.  The second one is because fluorescent and incandescent bulbs have different life cycles.  They may draw the same amount of power when they&#039;re first installed, but a couple of years later is a different story.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>When I studied lighting design, those were two red flags for starting a fire.  I don&#8217;t know the reasons for the first one.  The second one is because fluorescent and incandescent bulbs have different life cycles.  They may draw the same amount of power when they&#8217;re first installed, but a couple of years later is a different story.</p>
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		<title>By: Philbert42</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2011/08/10/incandescent-light-bulbs-have-not-been-banned.html#comment-1185158</link>
		<dc:creator>Philbert42</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Aug 2011 23:46:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=112873#comment-1185158</guid>
		<description>CFLs burning out too soon?

&quot;Fluorescent lights are more expensive to buy, and &lt;b&gt;their operating life is more affected by the number of times they are switched on and off, relative to incandescent lights.&lt;/b&gt;&quot;
http://www.energysavers.gov/your_home/lighting_daylighting/index.cfm/mytopic=12280</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>CFLs burning out too soon?</p>
<p>&#8220;Fluorescent lights are more expensive to buy, and <b>their operating life is more affected by the number of times they are switched on and off, relative to incandescent lights.</b>&#8221;<br />
<a href="http://www.energysavers.gov/your_home/lighting_daylighting/index.cfm/mytopic=12280" rel="nofollow">http://www.energysavers.gov/your_home/lighting_daylighting/index.cfm/mytopic=12280</a></p>
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		<title>By: mccrum</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2011/08/10/incandescent-light-bulbs-have-not-been-banned.html#comment-1185155</link>
		<dc:creator>mccrum</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Aug 2011 23:43:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=112873#comment-1185155</guid>
		<description>You really, really should when it&#039;s the correct kind of compact fluorescent (I know Philips, for example, makes a series that uses standard dimming switches).

I am very interested in your statement about not mixing lamp sources in fixtures.  If a lamp uses 120 volts, it uses 120 volts, regardless of source, LED, CFL, cold cathode, incandescent, halogen.  I make a living mixing sources in fixtures and yet somehow I and the fixtures I spec are all still very much non-historical.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You really, really should when it&#8217;s the correct kind of compact fluorescent (I know Philips, for example, makes a series that uses standard dimming switches).</p>
<p>I am very interested in your statement about not mixing lamp sources in fixtures.  If a lamp uses 120 volts, it uses 120 volts, regardless of source, LED, CFL, cold cathode, incandescent, halogen.  I make a living mixing sources in fixtures and yet somehow I and the fixtures I spec are all still very much non-historical.</p>
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		<title>By: Stefan Jones</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2011/08/10/incandescent-light-bulbs-have-not-been-banned.html#comment-1185137</link>
		<dc:creator>Stefan Jones</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Aug 2011 23:17:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=112873#comment-1185137</guid>
		<description>Conservatives with panties painfully twisted over CFL disposal issues &lt;I&gt;could&lt;/I&gt; use the method employed by janitors since tube-style florescent lights were introduced well over fifty years ago:

Whistle a happy tune and toss the things in a dumpster.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Conservatives with panties painfully twisted over CFL disposal issues <i>could</i> use the method employed by janitors since tube-style florescent lights were introduced well over fifty years ago:</p>
<p>Whistle a happy tune and toss the things in a dumpster.</p>
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		<title>By: teufelsdrochk</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2011/08/10/incandescent-light-bulbs-have-not-been-banned.html#comment-1185135</link>
		<dc:creator>teufelsdrochk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Aug 2011 23:15:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=112873#comment-1185135</guid>
		<description>You are not banning incandescent light bulbs which produce the amount of light as a current 100W bulb. You are making the incandescent bulbs produce the same amount of light for 70W.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You are not banning incandescent light bulbs which produce the amount of light as a current 100W bulb. You are making the incandescent bulbs produce the same amount of light for 70W.</p>
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		<title>By: teufelsdrochk</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2011/08/10/incandescent-light-bulbs-have-not-been-banned.html#comment-1185133</link>
		<dc:creator>teufelsdrochk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Aug 2011 23:13:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=112873#comment-1185133</guid>
		<description>Yeah, why is this hard to understand?

Incandescent aren&#039;t being banned. They are being required to have higher efficiencies; in incandescents this usually means filling the bulb with nitrogen or argon. 

Your 70 watt, totally normal light bulb now produces the same amount of light as a 100 watt. Go to the store and buy a totally normal incandescent light bulb, and it just costs less money to use. What&#039;s not to like?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yeah, why is this hard to understand?</p>
<p>Incandescent aren&#8217;t being banned. They are being required to have higher efficiencies; in incandescents this usually means filling the bulb with nitrogen or argon. </p>
<p>Your 70 watt, totally normal light bulb now produces the same amount of light as a 100 watt. Go to the store and buy a totally normal incandescent light bulb, and it just costs less money to use. What&#8217;s not to like?</p>
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		<title>By: Antinous / Moderator</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2011/08/10/incandescent-light-bulbs-have-not-been-banned.html#comment-1185132</link>
		<dc:creator>Antinous / Moderator</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Aug 2011 23:11:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=112873#comment-1185132</guid>
		<description>Your really, really shouldn&#039;t use an incandescent dimmer with a CFL. You also really, really shouldn&#039;t mix CFLs and incandescents in one fixture. Either of those could get you a different and far more historical light source.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Your really, really shouldn&#8217;t use an incandescent dimmer with a CFL. You also really, really shouldn&#8217;t mix CFLs and incandescents in one fixture. Either of those could get you a different and far more historical light source.</p>
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		<title>By: mccrum</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2011/08/10/incandescent-light-bulbs-have-not-been-banned.html#comment-1185122</link>
		<dc:creator>mccrum</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Aug 2011 22:55:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=112873#comment-1185122</guid>
		<description>It also depends on the dimmer switch you have in your wall, some CFLs work just fine on traditional incandescent dimmers, others require fluorescent-specific dimmers and still others are happy with 0-10 volt controls.

It&#039;s going to be a little crazy out there with new lower-wattage halogens replacing incandescents and most of the media coverage I have seen is not helpful in any way.

Your theatre lamp collection probably has less to do with voltage and more likely with someone touching the glass lamp envelope itself and letting skin oils disrupt the thermal dispersion (ie, all the heat stays where the oil is and isn&#039;t evenly distributed).  In a standard theatrical dimmer the voltage isn&#039;t going above the rated 120 (or 277, depending).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It also depends on the dimmer switch you have in your wall, some CFLs work just fine on traditional incandescent dimmers, others require fluorescent-specific dimmers and still others are happy with 0-10 volt controls.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s going to be a little crazy out there with new lower-wattage halogens replacing incandescents and most of the media coverage I have seen is not helpful in any way.</p>
<p>Your theatre lamp collection probably has less to do with voltage and more likely with someone touching the glass lamp envelope itself and letting skin oils disrupt the thermal dispersion (ie, all the heat stays where the oil is and isn&#8217;t evenly distributed).  In a standard theatrical dimmer the voltage isn&#8217;t going above the rated 120 (or 277, depending).</p>
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