Comments on: Egyptian port-workers refuse to sign for tons of US-made tear-gas shipped in by Ministry of the Interiorworkers http://boingboing.net/2011/11/30/132202.html Brain candy for Happy Mutants Sun, 26 May 2013 01:40:00 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.4.1 By: Purplecat http://boingboing.net/2011/11/30/132202.html#comment-1283898 Purplecat Wed, 30 Nov 2011 21:59:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=132202#comment-1283898 Here's the thing... "Non-lethal weapon" overlaps neatly with "torture device". People who would use the latter don't want to end up with a dead body on their hands, after all. Here’s the thing…

“Non-lethal weapon” overlaps neatly with “torture device”. People who would use the latter don’t want to end up with a dead body on their hands, after all.

]]> By: Thebes http://boingboing.net/2011/11/30/132202.html#comment-1283889 Thebes Wed, 30 Nov 2011 21:48:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=132202#comment-1283889 Good on them for Resisting. But they could have dumped it in the harbor for a more long term fix. Imagine Global Revolution. Good on them for Resisting.
But they could have dumped it in the harbor for a more long term fix.
Imagine Global Revolution.

]]> By: TheHowl http://boingboing.net/2011/11/30/132202.html#comment-1283516 TheHowl Wed, 30 Nov 2011 17:54:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=132202#comment-1283516 Absolutely true. That is why I didn't use the term 'nonlethal.' Tear gas can kill, pepper spray can kill, Tasers can kill, batons can kill. But none of them kill nearly as effectively as machinegun fire, which is the traditional alternative to tear gas in much of the world. Absolutely true. That is why I didn’t use the term ‘nonlethal.’ Tear gas can kill, pepper spray can kill, Tasers can kill, batons can kill. But none of them kill nearly as effectively as machinegun fire, which is the traditional alternative to tear gas in much of the world.

]]> By: Marja Erwin http://boingboing.net/2011/11/30/132202.html#comment-1283508 Marja Erwin Wed, 30 Nov 2011 17:47:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=132202#comment-1283508 It can kill. It may be less-lethal, but calling it less-than-lethal is deceptive. Many protesters in Egypt have recently been killed by tear gas, though probably CN instead of CS. It can kill. It may be less-lethal, but calling it less-than-lethal is deceptive. Many protesters in Egypt have recently been killed by tear gas, though probably CN instead of CS.

]]> By: Navin_Johnson http://boingboing.net/2011/11/30/132202.html#comment-1283501 Navin_Johnson Wed, 30 Nov 2011 17:43:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=132202#comment-1283501 "less lethal"  ungh...gross “less lethal”  ungh…gross

]]> By: TheHowl http://boingboing.net/2011/11/30/132202.html#comment-1283486 TheHowl Wed, 30 Nov 2011 17:31:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=132202#comment-1283486 This is the perpetual problem with less-than-lethal munitions. How do you separate out the cases where not having them is going to dramatically improve the situation, and the cases where not having them is going to dramatically harm the situation? I think we can all agree that UC Davis campus cops should probably have their pepper spray taken away from them for a while. But Officer J. Random Dickhead probably isn't going to shoot a line of linked-arms protesters with his sidearm. A third world government, however, gives no guarantees. If  Myanmar, or Algeria, or Cote d'Ivoire, or Egypt (minus the current, and probably fleeting, media attention) can't disperse protesters with tear gas, they're going to do it with 7.62mm. And those protesters aren't going to run away screaming. They're just going to die screaming. (This should not be read as advocating tyrannical governments using /any/ sort of force on their own citizens. It should be read as an acknowledgment that they /are/ going to, and until that ceases to be the case, I'm all for harm reduction.) I'm thinking that Syria, for example, could use a lot more tear gas shipments and a lot fewer ammunition shipments. This is the perpetual problem with less-than-lethal munitions. How do you separate out the cases where not having them is going to dramatically improve the situation, and the cases where not having them is going to dramatically harm the situation?

I think we can all agree that UC Davis campus cops should probably have their pepper spray taken away from them for a while. But Officer J. Random Dickhead probably isn’t going to shoot a line of linked-arms protesters with his sidearm.

A third world government, however, gives no guarantees. If  Myanmar, or Algeria, or Cote d’Ivoire, or Egypt (minus the current, and probably fleeting, media attention) can’t disperse protesters with tear gas, they’re going to do it with 7.62mm. And those protesters aren’t going to run away screaming. They’re just going to die screaming.

(This should not be read as advocating tyrannical governments using /any/ sort of force on their own citizens. It should be read as an acknowledgment that they /are/ going to, and until that ceases to be the case, I’m all for harm reduction.)

I’m thinking that Syria, for example, could use a lot more tear gas shipments and a lot fewer ammunition shipments.

]]> By: scav http://boingboing.net/2011/11/30/132202.html#comment-1283445 scav Wed, 30 Nov 2011 16:28:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=132202#comment-1283445 The trade events that CTS plan to attend are listed on their website http://www.less-lethal.com/ The next one is in Vegas on January 18-21 Just sayin' The trade events that CTS plan to attend are listed on their website http://www.less-lethal.com/
The next one is in Vegas on January 18-21

Just sayin’

]]> By: Mordicai http://boingboing.net/2011/11/30/132202.html#comment-1283444 Mordicai Wed, 30 Nov 2011 16:27:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=132202#comment-1283444 This little anecdote right here & others like it might have a lot to do with, oh, the state of American geopolitical diplomacy.  Right in a nutshell.  "Hey, democracy, that is great!  Have you heard about capitalism?  It is the thing our semi-secret plutocracy use to aid your oppressors!  Ha ha ha ha, PS we hate your skin colour, your religion & your way of life." This little anecdote right here & others like it might have a lot to do with, oh, the state of American geopolitical diplomacy.  Right in a nutshell. 

“Hey, democracy, that is great!  Have you heard about capitalism?  It is the thing our semi-secret plutocracy use to aid your oppressors!  Ha ha ha ha, PS we hate your skin colour, your religion & your way of life.”

]]> By: angusm http://boingboing.net/2011/11/30/132202.html#comment-1283439 angusm Wed, 30 Nov 2011 16:22:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=132202#comment-1283439 The next thing is for port workers in the US to start refusing to ship the stuff out. The next thing is for port workers in the US to start refusing to ship the stuff out.

]]> By: Teller http://boingboing.net/2011/11/30/132202.html#comment-1283437 Teller Wed, 30 Nov 2011 16:18:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=132202#comment-1283437 Good for port workers. Though, after the vote in Egypt, it appears there won't be much use for tear gas, one hopes. Good for port workers. Though, after the vote in Egypt, it appears there won’t be much use for tear gas, one hopes.

]]> By: scav http://boingboing.net/2011/11/30/132202.html#comment-1283436 scav Wed, 30 Nov 2011 16:17:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=132202#comment-1283436 Looks like the shameful manufacturer is: COMBINED TACTICAL SYSTEMS 388 KINSMAN ROAD JAMESTOWN PA Looks like the shameful manufacturer is:

COMBINED TACTICAL SYSTEMS

388 KINSMAN ROAD

JAMESTOWN PA

]]> By: querent http://boingboing.net/2011/11/30/132202.html#comment-1283434 querent Wed, 30 Nov 2011 16:14:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=132202#comment-1283434 Power to the people, right on. Don't go all Boston tear-gas party, though.  That shit is harsh. Power to the people, right on.

Don’t go all Boston tear-gas party, though.  That shit is harsh.

]]> By: scav http://boingboing.net/2011/11/30/132202.html#comment-1283432 scav Wed, 30 Nov 2011 16:09:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=132202#comment-1283432 Here's a question: who in the US is exporting this CS gas to Egypt, and what can be done to encourage them to re-think their assumptions about the  trade-off between profit and ethics? Note, I didn't ask what can be done *legally* :) Here’s a question: who in the US is exporting this CS gas to Egypt, and what can be done to encourage them to re-think their assumptions about the  trade-off between profit and ethics?

Note, I didn’t ask what can be done *legally* :)

]]> By: Cocomaan http://boingboing.net/2011/11/30/132202.html#comment-1283430 Cocomaan Wed, 30 Nov 2011 16:06:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=132202#comment-1283430 Don't you guys know? Production of CS canisters here in the US creates JOBZ!!!!11111 Don’t you guys know? Production of CS canisters here in the US creates JOBZ!!!!11111

]]> By: aynrandspenismighty http://boingboing.net/2011/11/30/132202.html#comment-1283416 aynrandspenismighty Wed, 30 Nov 2011 15:47:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=132202#comment-1283416 If they don't want it, our local police will take it. If they don’t want it, our local police will take it.

]]> By: petershultz http://boingboing.net/2011/11/30/132202.html#comment-1283408 petershultz Wed, 30 Nov 2011 15:34:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=132202#comment-1283408 I salute these conscientious objectors. We should all be so brave. I salute these conscientious objectors. We should all be so brave.

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