Ebert: film industry is losing money because they charge too much and deliver too little

Roger Ebert poo-poos the idea that piracy is at the root of dropping film revenues and ascribes the phenomenon instead to crappy movies and crappy theaters that charge too much.

2. Ticket prices are too high. People have always made that complaint, but historically the movies have been cheap compared to concerts, major league sports and restaurants. Not so much any longer. No matter what your opinion is about 3D, the charm of paying a hefty surcharge has worn off for the hypothetical family of four.
3. The theater experience. Moviegoers above 30 are weary of noisy fanboys and girls. The annoyance of talkers has been joined by the plague of cell-phone users, whose bright screens are a distraction. Worse, some texting addicts get mad when told they can't use their cell phones. A theater is reportedly opening which will allow and even bless cell phone usage, although that may be an apocryphal story.
4. Refreshment prices. It's an open secret that the actual cost of soft drinks and popcorn is very low. To justify their inflated prices, theaters serve portions that are grotesquely oversized, and no longer offer what used to be a "small popcorn." Today's bucket of popcorn would feed a thoroughbred.

I'll tell you why movie revenue is dropping...

I write books. My latest is a YA science fiction novel called Homeland (it's the sequel to Little Brother). More books: Rapture of the Nerds (a novel, with Charlie Stross); With a Little Help (short stories); and The Great Big Beautiful Tomorrow (novella and nonfic). I speak all over the place and I tweet and tumble, too.

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http://twitter.com/a_w_young a_w_young

Could this be the first time I’ve partially agreed with Ebert? I’m frightened.
gws

These are solid points Ebert makes. Is the general movie audience too fractured to support overblown promotional campaigns pushing mediocre mainstream garbage? The Monoculture in decline, and all that? Who can say.
gws

(I always thought it was spelled “pooh-poohs,” but even my own pedantry disgusts me.)
- Stooge
  
  I always thought that to poo-poo something you had to actually mention it.
Guest

Also, whippersnappers.
- http://lemoutan.blogspot.com/ Lemoutan
  
  Ah, but are they cool hwippersappers?
Will

With respect, it’s because the film industry is an industry.

These are businesses, and their responsibility is apparently not to make a good product or win customer respect, but is purely the most profit for the least possible investment. Why do you think we’re getting a big-budget movie entitled Battleship next year? Because Transformers, another CGI crap-fest about a toy, made money. It doesn’t matter that the Transformers movies were reviewed as terrible and most of the audience thought they had as much substance as a hand full of popcorn, what mattered was they made money off it. That’s why ticket prices are high, that’s why theaters are forced to charge so much for concession items, and that’s why the studios rarely take risks.

Additionally, like all big, older businesses, they’re not just terrified of change, they actively work to thwart change. SOPA is an example of an antiquated industry that is unwilling to invest in innovation, choosing instead to carpet-bomb the internet in a foolhardy attempt to stop piracy that’s ultimately impossible to stop. They fight Apple and Amazon and others attempting to help guide them into the present tooth and nail, ultimately biting the hand that’s trying to feed them, and all along alienating more and more people.

The result is what we’re seeing now: record profits, dropping attendance, shirtless werewolves, exponentially increasing piracy, massively unfair frivolous lawsuits against minor pirates, draconian anti-piracy legislation, the majority of movies being redundant and unoriginal, and Michael Bay STILL GETTING WORK.

And you know what? We’re to blame. We are the consumer base, and we dictate what they do with our money. If we stopped going to bad movies, they would stop making them purely out of necessity. It would cease to be profitable if no one went to see the vampire c-section or Adam Sandler be his own sister or the King of Queens tragically lose his mind in a zoo.

But there’s good news: no one went to see Atlas Shrugged, so we won’t have to put up with a slew of terrible Ayn Rand movies.
- http://profiles.google.com/rodaniel Rob O’Daniel
  
  Couldn’t agree more with your points, Will!
  
  Much like Detroit has had to take its lumps (at our expense, thank you) to finally learn that they too need to embrace the changing times, Hollywood will eventually have to learn from painful experience that we viewers are demanding more quality. When I’d rather stay home and stream 4 yr old seasons of shows from Netflix than sink my money into the mostly-dismal fare at the multiplex, there’s an unmistakable message for anyone who bothers listening. (Although I’ll readily admit that “The Girl With the Dragon Tattoo” was terrific!)
  
  Nearly all of the Hollywood mainstream players have become so enamored with the glossy flash of CGI that they’ve lost all sight of the need for a solid underlying story and characters that we can care about. Do we really need another brainless and pointless Bruckheimer, Bay, or McG offering? How many more comic books will Hollywood mindlessly mine before they get that we’ve already had our fill of this insipid superhero tripe? And Tin Tin couldn’t have just as easily been live-action?
  
  Sadly, even Pixar has fallen prey to complacency and have relied more on fluff than substance in their latest 2 films. I was so very disappointed with Cars 2. Oh sure, it has a few new good characters, but Lightning took a backseat to the story and needless violence crept into most scenes. (The bad guys threatened to KILL Lightning enough times that my 5 yr old was overwrought and had to be taken out to the lobby to cool off and dry away his tears. Shame on you, Pixar!) These guys need to get off of the sequel bandwagon (gravy train?) and fast!
  
  Maybe I’m just more attuned to this now (as a parent) but I can’t stomach the overbearing need for Hollywood to force-feed us Hip-Hop culture at every turn. Really? Penguins, chipmunks, and even Smurfs must be “gangsta?” Shame on you guys for pandering to the very lowest common denominator. Kids read much more out of this stuff than we give them credit for.
  
  Outliers like Chris Nolan and Peter Jackson will undoubtedly clean up in ’12 — and rightfully so. They understand that stunning visuals without plot and people to support them are nothing but fleeting eye candy.
  - http://www.ikaink.net Itsumishi
    
    It is hardly surprising that kids films will reference pop-culture and lets face it Hip-Hop is the biggest and most influential form of pop-culture of the last decade or two. I also wouldn’t consider referencing hip-hop pandering to the “very lowest common denominator”. Seems like someone else might need to ‘embrace the changing (or changed) times’.
    
    Apart from that I agree with everything you’ve said, but for some reason that paragraph bugs me.
    - chaoskittenii
      
      Tell that to Tim Burton’s charmless, digitally multiplied hip hop Oompa Loompa. I walked out of that film’s with the original Oompa Loompas’ songs in my head. My mind actually rejected it and returned to the songs I heard 30 years ago for relief.
      - blueelm
        
        This. So true.
        
        I actually really like hip-hop. I grew up with the stuff. However, saying you like hip-hop is like saying you like rock, or jazz, or electronica. It’s a big genre, and there is an awful lot that is just not very special or innovative. You will find most of that part of the genre in films, which hasn’t always been true of music in the movies. The oompa loompas in the TB version are a good example. They pretty much ruined that film for me, not because I hate hip-hop but because they were just a horrible insult to hip-hop or music at all. It was almost on par with “praise bands’” and Christian metal. This is not to even begin to mention how out of place they were with the continuity of the film.
  - philipb
    
    Remember Toy Story 1? The “bad guy” was the obviously abused and neglected child next door.
  - Will
    
    “(Although I’ll readily admit that “The Girl With the Dragon Tattoo” was terrific!)”
    
    Notice they waited for this to be popular in Europe first, to verify that it was a good investment.
    
    “(The bad guys threatened to KILL Lightning enough times that my 5 yr old was overwrought and had to be taken out to the lobby to cool off and dry away his tears. Shame on you, Pixar!)”
    
    Jeez! Hopefully the quality of movies like Wall-E and Up! hasn’t left Pixar. Those were such amazing movies, movies that respected the audience and told great stories and actually utilized great animation for a reason. At least you can go back and get classic kids’ movies on DVD and BluRay for your child. And there’s always PBS.
    - http://profiles.google.com/rodaniel Rob O’Daniel
      
      Gotta mention that while I was kinda ho-hum on Wall-E but my son and I both really loved Up! And yes, Mantz’s character did threaten Carl & Russell, but overall the film was so much less violent and intense for very young kids.
      
      Cars remains one of our favorites as well, but the sequel lacked the heart and message of the original. It amped up the action and intensity, but did nothing to retain the charm of the first film.
- snodle
  
  Well said. Quite a few of your points are picked up and expanded upon in this great article on why the industry is in its current state:
  http://www.gq.com/entertainment/movies-and-tv/201102/the-day-the-movies-died-mark-harris?currentPage=all
  - DMStone
    
    Thank you for that link. It was a great read. I loved the point at the end of there being no risk for “missing” a movie in the theatre.
  - Will
    
    That’s a great article. And here all I thought GQ did was tell me what sweater to wear!
    - snodle
      
      I was quite surprised to find it there as well. But it makes sense to put an article about the movie industry right next to adverts for skin moisturizer – I just had the softest facepalm ever.
- asuffield
  
  SOPA is an example of an antiquated industry that is unwilling to invest in innovation, choosing instead to carpet-bomb the internet in a foolhardy attempt to stop piracy that’s ultimately impossible to stop.
  
  Oh, it’s worse than that. SOPA isn’t foolhardy, it’s highly cynical and the same damn thing they’ve been trying to do for ages: offload enforcement costs on to the government, the ISPs, or anybody else they can find. They aren’t looking even to solve piracy, they are looking for a single year profit kick of at least 10%.
  
  They don’t care what effect it has on piracy. They only care about the short-term effect on their stock value.
  - Will
    
    Excellent point, asuffield.
  - http://obbop.wordpress.com/ obbop
    
    ” SOPA”
    
    Senior Officer Present Afloat.
    
    When two or more US Navy warships are anchored, moored to piers, steaming together at sea, whatever the SOPA needs to be known so it is known who has tactical or strategic or command of any type if something needs doing.
    
    From what course to steam or speed or what action or inaction to take (from launching warshots intended to destroy an enemy to getting the heck outta’ there.
    
    My favorite Navy acronym of all time and there is a multitude of them was:
    
    FLEASWTRACENPAC and sounded out in several words that the letters kinda’ form.
    
    One WW2 era acronym altered was the one for the high-ranking admiral in charge of an entire fleet:
    
    Commander-in-Chief US.
    
    Omitted purposefully was the word “Forces” to allow the shortest acronym length possible.
    
    The acronym was spoken: Sink Us.
    
    It lasted a brief time until altered.
    
    This history lesson tossed at the human herd hereabouts for no logical reason whatsoever by a Disgruntled Old Coot who shouts aloud;
    
    Have a lousy day ye vermin.
- digi_owl
  
  Made money perhaps, but thanks to hollywood accounting it may never make a on the books profit…
- Dan Woods
  
  Thats the difference between Stable Profits and Quick Money.
  The Studios are going after Short-Term Profits by pushing Crap that appeals to Ignorant Children, alienating the more cerebral movie-goer.
  
  Once the Fad of crap films is over, and the Ignorant Children start getting their entertainment elsewhere (which is starting to happen), The Cerebral Movie-Goer (who used to go once a week) will find that alternate means of getting their Film Experience (Arthouse Cinemas, Live Theatre and Vimeo) are much more convenient.
  
  By that time, Studio executives and Theatre Managers will sell up and move on the next Get Rich Quick Scam, leaving their waste to Nostalgiaists to clean up.
  
  The same thing happened on the early Eighties. The Plot behind the comedy “Hercules Returns” tells such a story.
  - Adam R.
    
    Why were you randomly capitalizing words? Very few of those nouns were names.
kekko

I really liked what Roger Ebert had to say about the issue, but unfortunately some of the points don’t apply in Italy, where I live. There’s no Netflix, only iTunes (and the prices are ridiculously high,) though we still have rental shops. And then there are the cinemas. The price for a movie: 7€ (9$).
I guess the major problem is, as far as I’m concerned, these new movies don’t address the soul anymore. They deliver too little, yes, but in a different department.
- http://twitter.com/HubrisSonic HubrisSonic
  
  *cough* Bittorrent *cough*
- MelSkunk
  
  I feel he’s only referring to the US, since some or most of these don’t apply to anywhere else. Which I suppose makes sense since most of the time ‘success’ in the movie industry = how much money they make from the US.
Mister44

Ebert knows his stuff. One of the few critics who I respect. Its really sad what happened to his face :o/
- MelSkunk
  
  Why are you even bringing that up??
  - Mister44
    
    Because it’s an unfortunate reality and I empathize with the situation.
John Davis

Most recent US movies are crap.

I’m not surprised no one goes to see them.
hypersomniac

This dude doesn’t have a jaw, but he knows what he’s talking about.
- MadRat
  
  Yup, obvious article is obvious.
hypersomniac

Can we have a discussion on Tree of Life? Because I really liked it.
- David Kopelman
  
  No.
Max

What I find scary is that the film industry have to be told that their films are crap, cinemas are nasty and food and drink overpriced….
Every time someone drags me to the cinema I think to myself ”never again”.
Poor focus, poor sound (old speakers that have been overdriven and are basically shagged) and damaged screens have to compete with sticky floors, uncomfortable and chewing gummed seats, strange odours, tall people in front, noisy people all around and WHY don’t they turn the f^%$ing lights off????
If I ever own a cinema, it will be pitch black while the film is playing and it will have a faraday cage. Anyone caught trying to use a mobile will be executed. We’ll stop the film for a moment, take them to the front, terminate them and then carry on. Anyone talking will be branded on their way out so we can make sure they never come back in.
Failing that, we take off and nuke the site from orbit. It’s the only way to be sure.

(See that film companies : there used to be films that people took quotes from. Name me a film in the last 10 years you can think of a quote which has entered into common use when it’s clearly not something you would ordinarily need to say and I’ll name you 10 from the previous 10-20 years.)
- hadlockk
  
  The lights not coming down is based on an automation sensor. You program it to dim the lights slightly during the previews, off during the film, back to dim during the credits, then full-on when it’s over so the cleaning crew can do their work. The automation queues are triggered by little pieces of aluminum foil that are taped on the film
  (seriously) and reflect back an IR signal to the sensor. If the tape falls off (usually around week 2 or 3) then the sensor doesn’t trigger.
  
  The simple solution is to walk down to the concession stand (or have the theater on speed dial) and tell them to have the projectionist fix the lights/framing etc.. usually by the time you get back they’ve fixed the problem. With one projectionist managing up to 10 (or more) screens there isn’t a lot of down time to fix (let alone catch) these problems. Speaking to a manager keeps them on their toes, and will usually put pressure on the head projectionist to pick up their act a bit.
- http://www.ikaink.net Itsumishi
  
  Wow cinemas near you must be terrible. In most cinemas I attend (apart from the old ones with much, much more charm) seats are comfortable, the floors are not too shabby, sound quality is usually good (again apart from some of the older more charming independent cinemas) and I’ve never been in a cinema with the lights still on, except of course the “emergency exit” and stairwell lights which obviously have to be kept on for OH&S reasons.
  
  I did see a film the other day at one of the older cinemas though and the bulb in the projector seemed to crap itself 2/3rds of the way through the film, leaving the last third quite dark and not very sharp. That was very disapointing and I complained. I like the cinema too much to have asked for my money back though.
- Genre Slur
  
  “…TROLLLLLLLLLL!”
  Only quote I can think of…
- John Delaney
  
  You know there is hope for Ebert’s quips: there are a few theaters that are bucking the trend a bit by making the theater experience about more than the movie by selling a reasonably priced dinner and beer along with the movie.
  
  In Oakland, there used to be the Parkway Speakeasy, but due to a bad business partnership with the city of El Cerrito, they were forced to close both of their movie theaters. Then there are the Mcmenamins in portland which show second run movies for a pittance in old school renovated movie theaters. Way to take advantage of tax breaks on registered historical monuments.
  
  //begin rambling rant:
  If I could pay $3-5 for a movie, then eat dinner and drink good local beer at 1-2 star restaurant prices, I would go see a movie once or twice a week.
  
  The second run model also allows a theater to take risks and do late night Rocky Horror Picture Shows, small independent films, double features, etc.
  
  With the current cost of rent and real estate prices, though, I fear that small business can’t get away with this kind of business as I would imagine the break even/profit point is several years out. But these sort of small business theaters which seemed to have all gone out of business are great for a community. Its kind of like the Phoenix theater in Petaluma which has provided an awesome place for High School kids to have a good time and play in rock bands for over 20 years. Its made Petaluma what it is today.
  
  At current theaters, I kind of feel like cattle getting herded in, sat down for a few hours for mindless entertainment, then herded out.
  //end rambling rant
  - Cameron Huff
    
    There is a place in Salt Lake City called Brewives. The cool thing about it is exactly what you just described. While it takes some time to get the movies there, you can go and watch them and get beer and something more that just popcorn (though they have that) food wise. At the very least, even if the movie sucks, you have beer to make the pain go away
- http://www.doggo.org doggo
  
  “What I find scary is that the film industry have to be told that their films are crap, cinemas are nasty and food and drink overpriced….”
  
  Ebert was right, but it’s not news. Ask anyone you know and they’ll probably bring up the same issues Ebert does. It’s been like this for a long time.
  
  And it is scary. It’s scary that business in general just continues to roll right over consumers at every turn. They’re so busy trying to squeeze every last cent out of everything, that they don’t even bother with quality, or even safety, in some cases. American business has lost its way. From the banking system, to the movies, to fast food. It’s no longer, “we’re in the business of (doing this or that thing)…” Now it’s, “We’re in the business of making money.”
  
  As long as the sole interest people have in running a business is making money, then their product, or service, will be crap. If you’re making films solely to turn a profit, then most of them will suck. And if every consideration in the production of films is based on cost vs. profit, most of them will suck.
  
  If your theatre is centered around squeezing every last penny from your patrons and giving the barest minimum of service in return, then the theatre-going experience is going to suck.
  
  Believe me, I’m no crazed communist, or anti-materialist, but there comes a time when you’ve got to realize that society-wide unfettered greed is killing American (and I’m sure others) society, culture, and people.
hadlockk

I only saw one movie this year in theaters, that was the new Sherlock Holmes movie –and only because I was out of town and trapped with my cousins the afternoon after a wedding. Perhaps 4 or 5 years ago when every third person didn’t own a 40″+ TV you could make the argument that theaters were better than a home theater, but I think modern technology has finally ruined the theater experience for me. All of my movie watching this year has been from netflix or similar digital distribution.

Being nearly 30, it’s really hard to get interested in mainstream movies; even the R-rated moves feel like they’re making too many major concessions to draw in the high school audiences.
davnel

Roger is exactly right. Unfortunately, Hollyweird couldn’t care less. Maybe when all of the customers abandon them, and they start to go broke, they’ll listen…or not. They’ll more likely try for even more draconian legislation.
http://www.jjsaul.com Jim Saul

I love Ebert and agree with his points, and believe that the movie theater has become obsolete for adults.

However, the underlying assumption that there has been a huge drop in even box office revenues is false. If you include streaming, rental, broadcast, and dvd sales, the movie industry is making more money than ever.

http://www.the-numbers.com/market/
- dancharvey
  
  Exactly. Sure that doesn’t make Eberts points wrong necessarily but the premise for the argument couldn’t be further from the truth.
- http://twitter.com/sqlrob Rob
  
  “If you include streaming, rental, broadcast, and dvd sales”
  
  Those aren’t box office revenue. And he explicitly MENTIONS those.
  
  You need to dispute David Germain on the box office numbers. Unfortunately, Ebert doesn’t provide a link. The numbers you provide show an almost 10% drop in box office revenue and a 12% drop in tickets since 2009. So why do you say the underlying assumption is false?
  - http://www.jjsaul.com Jim Saul
    
    Perhaps I was insufficiently clear. I said ” the underlying assumption that there has been a huge drop in even box office revenues is false.”
    
    To be clearer, the numbers show that the total gross ticket sales have been remarkably consistent over the past decade, considering that for the past three years we have seen recession and massive unemployment.
    
    From the link:
    
    Ticket Sales only
    Revenue ($bn)
    1995 $5.29
    1996 $5.59
    1997 $6.51
    1998 $6.77
    1999 $7.30
    2000 $7.48
    2001 $8.13
    2002 $9.19
    2003 $9.35
    2004 $9.27
    2005 $8.95
    2006 $9.25
    2007 $9.63
    2008 $9.85
    2009 $10.65
    2010 $10.46
    2011 $9.97
    
    My second statement was:
    “If you include streaming, rental, broadcast, and dvd sales, the movie industry is making more money than ever.”
    
    Ebert’s core point is that theater ticket sales are shifting to at-home viewing. It isn’t a piracy article, it’s an article about how the theater viewing experience is no longer superior to at-home viewing. Though the link says “movie revenue is dropping”, Ebert’s point is that “theater revenue is dropping.”
    
    I agree with that statement. Indeed, I was shocked to find that ticket sales have not suffered a dramatic decline. The difference between the peak and the current is less than the ticket sales of a single blockbuster like Avatar.
    
    I think his point will become true in the near future. It has not yet.
    
    However, the movie industry is not losing money. I’m surprised that the theater chains have not fallen off more than they have, considering that there’s really not much incentive for adults to choose to see movies in that environment.
    
    Much as with big pharma, a deeper issue is that the movie industry spends more on advertising than it does on creating good products.
IMoriarty

It’s good to see someone of Ebert’s standing to finally wise up to what our social circle has known for years – the movie theater industry is in decline due to a poor value offered to it’s customers on nearly every front. I’ve since moved, but the last theater experience I can remember truly enjoying from walking in the door to exiting the theater was at Austin’s Alamo. I still get a chuckle every once in awhile when they put out (on youtube) one of their anti-cellphone rants.
davnel

The theatre situation probably also explains the piracy problem. Much easier, and much cheaper to either buy the DVD or grab it from an online source. Theatres are too expensive and a real bummer to attend.
- Antinous / Moderator
  
  davnel,
  
  Please stop attaching your image to your comments.
  - http://twitter.com/cbuchner1 Christian Buchner
    
    So why do you enable this feature if you don’t like it being used?
    - http://celesteagnes.blogspot.com/ Sekino
      
      Because it’s fun when people add images/videos related to the topic, not so much when they just clone their own avatar in every post. Just like extra line breaks, it’s wasted space.
    - Guest
      
      we can have the nice things taken away. Just sayin’
      - Antinous / Moderator
        
        A couple of months ago, lots of commenters started putting URLs in parentheses so that you’d get a 404. Since yesterday, three people have started adding their avatar as an image. What’s happening?
        
        Turning and turning in the widening gyre
        the falcon cannot hear the falconer.
      - Antinous / Moderator
        
        I’m actually kind of wondering if it’s a glitch.
      - http://www.jjsaul.com Jim Saul
        
        That’s a convention I always found annoying on gaming forums… every comment had a gigantic .sig with images, computer specs, character stats, quotes, slogans, advertisements, guilds, sparkles, and a sniper in a pear tree.
freddyskinny

I fully agree with Egbert’s article. But what I hate most is that I have to pay a ridiculous high price to see a movie AND I get force-fed half an hour of crappy commercials. So I don’t go to movie theaters any more because I feel ripped off. You can’t have it both ways: or you lower the price and make a good revenue through advertising, or you have no advertising, resulting in a higher ticket price. But to have it both ways seems very greedy to me. Of course, I can’t blame movie theaters for trying, but they’re not getting my money.
- putty
  
  I agree completely. I can download commercial free movies from Netflix and Itunes (not to mention Bittorrent). So why do I want to pay so much money for a theater seat where they’re going to play advertisements? Remember when it was just previews for upcoming movies instead of a long string of tv commercials?
  Also, some of the theaters near my house have several screens of various sizes. If you get lucky, you’ll get one of the big screens, otherwise you end up watching on a screen not much bigger than what most people have at home. They should be honest about what you’re paying for and put the screen size next to the price when you buy the tickets. If I come away from a theater feeling ripped off, I’m unlikely to return.
  Also, I would really like cell phone jammers to kick in once the show starts. The last few times I went to the movies, I’ve almost got into fights with people who insist on talking on their phone during the movie. What is it that these people find it so offensive about me asking them to take their phone calls in the lobby?
  Also, like Cory, I think 3D is for wankers. I don’t want bells and whistles and I don’t care for shitty candy, popcorn or soda. What I do want is an enjoyable movie experience where I can get immersed in the drama instead of distracted by stupid gimmicks.
  - DMStone
    
    I really hope a director finds a way to tell a better story with 3d, but I doubt that will happen. Until then, for me at least, it is only acceptable for sports and Jackass sequels.
    - http://profiles.google.com/rodaniel Rob O’Daniel
      
      3D is not a story enabler – it’s just more visual fluff to distract the viewer in an attempt to mask poor content quality.
      
      3D does next to nothing to improve excellent movies like Avatar or Inception and actually makes the image murkier.
      
      The clunky 3D glasses are also rather uncomfortable for many prescription glasses wearers.
- http://www.boxofficepunchup.co.uk/ Pete Heffernan
  
  Half an hour of forced adverts and several messages featured both in the hallways and on-screen telling me, their (regular) paying customer, how bad piracy is. I think the well-known DVD vs. piracy image that was featured on Boing Boing a while back shows the industry view on the paying public, and why the second option is preferred by many: http://boingboing.net/2010/02/18/infographic-buying-d.html
- Guest
  
  I fully agree. I hate marketing saturation and that is what it is. I avoid these things as if they were the plague.
momus_98

Can we please stop calling it piracy? We aren’t Captain Ron sailing the high seas in the Caribbean; it is simple copyright infringement. Nothing more, nothing less.

And I agree with Ebert. I do not see the value of going to the movies anymore. I have beer, I have Netflix, I have an HDTV; what I don’t have is a need for a traditional movie theater.
- Bevatron Repairman
  
  Instead of piracy, let’s just call it theft.
  
  I get that through bittorrent and the like it’s impossible to stop theft, that industries need to think about how to compete to add value to products when the world is full of thieves and that people ought not be shut off the intertubes on the vaguest allegation of theft. But it’s still theft.
  - dnebdal
    
    That’s exactly the issue, though: It’s not theft by the normal definition of the word. It’s unlicensed, unpaid usage that might – or might not – take the place of paid usage.
  - retepslluerb
    
    No, it isn’t theft. Theft requires a physical object.
    
    I’m not saying that copyright infringement is harmless, but it is quite obviously not theft.
    - Bevatron Repairman
      
      If I move $1,000 from your account to my account, I’ve obviously stolen something from you. So tangibility can’t be the dividing line.
      - retepslluerb
        
        That’d be embezzlement.
      - http://naughtyme.myopenid.com/ NME
        
        But, in the case of torrenting, there is still $1000 in the account – you’ve simply cloned the $1000 into yours.
    - jennybean42
      
      I’mma just leave this here for you :
      http://youtu.be/IeTybKL1pM4
  - guanto
    
    Instead of theft, how about we just use a word that’s actually appropriate and accurate? It’s not like there’s a shortage of words in the English language…
  - Yacko
    
    I like to think of it as curation of a possibly ephemeral product.
  - http://twitter.com/shay_guy Shay Guy
    
    A hem.
- daniel123123
  
  The OED records this usage of piracy back to 1703. But sure, if you don’t like it, I suppose we can quit calling it that.
http://twitter.com/TylerTinsley Tyler Tinsley

maybe were just spending all that money we used to spend on music and movies on video games, anyone think of that one yet?

nope it has to be piracy

nope it’s that movies suck now days.

it can not possibly be that we are just doing something else with our time and money.

i would love for someone to pair a graph showing the shrinking size of the music and movie industries against the growth of the video game industry.
- http://www.drake.org.uk Martyn Drake
  
  It’s easier to blame piracy than it is to admit to the real problem. Why, it’s so easy to use this for ANY situation.
  
  Piracy was responsible for a car driver opening his door as I was cycling along and breaking my ribs. Damn you pirates! Piracy was responsible for buses running late. Piracy was responsible for David Cameron. You get the idea.
  - http://obbop.wordpress.com/ obbop
    
    BBQ ribs are yummy.
    
    If dropped and they break but remain in the bag you can still eat them, right?
- quietstorms
  
  How about links to where the gaming industry growth is in decline this year?
  
  http://www.zacks.com/stock/news/57106/Gaming+Industry+Declines+Again
  
  http://allthingsd.com/20111220/digital-game-revenues-werent-enough-to-offset-broader-industry-declines-in-q3/
  
  It is simply silly to say people aren’t listening to new music and watching new movies. This has to do with piracy and also a struggling economy.
  - http://www.drake.org.uk Martyn Drake
    
    I’d need to see figures for console sales as well as those for the games themselves before I see anything remotely relating the decline to piracy. I buy (and play) very few games, and those that I do are for the iPhone/iPad. I’ve not bought a PC or Mac game for years. Don’t have time to play them as often as I once did. Habits change.
    
    Piracy is going to be there in the background, and is a problem, yes, but I don’t honestly believe you can put all the blame on it for declining game sales. I work in a town in which EA and Lionhead Studios have bases (in fact Lionhead are a few buildings away from where I am now). If piracy was such a big problem, they’d be long gone by now.
    
    I’ve worked in the film industry for 6 years and the amount of work that came in had never dwindled despite all the calls that piracy is affecting jobs.
    
    Also I’ve worked for a software developer (in the VFX industry, as was what I was in previously) and piracy of the product was going on – no doubt about that (and ironically by those wanting to get into the film business, were in the film business, or just casual piracy) and although a ton of us were made redundant it was due to the fact the company was putting all it’s energies into a product that didn’t work – not piracy. Whether piracy played a part in the redundancy process I just don’t know – but I seriously doubt it.
    - quietstorms
      
      Like you, I’m a former gamer that only plays games now on my iPhone and iPad.
      
      I’m not blaming declining game sales on piracy. It could have to do with casual gamers moving to mobile devices where games are much cheaper. It could also be due to a lack of high quality games worth buying. My only point is to say that if people were choosing to buy video games instead, it is not showing in terms of revenues generated.
      
      The main reason, I believe, that the film industry hasn’t suffered is because there isn’t enough high-speed access available around the world and even many parts of the US.
      
      The music industry’s situation is different and I do think it is hurting. It may not hurt the top-tier of artists but it will hurt the rest. To me it’s simply impossible to believe that people aren’t listening to new music. There is a very serious problem when the top selling album of 2011 (a very good album at that) only sold 5 million copies.
      - http://www.drake.org.uk Martyn Drake
        
        Another potential factor for the decline of game sales are the numerous rental services. Why pay when you can rent? In terms of movies, what I’m seeing with the VoD services is that the film studios have a window (which range from days to weeks) where they will only allow you to buy. After that, you can rent.
        
        Universal Pictures have stopped selling their rental titles to LOVEFiLM in the UK as LOVEFiLM refuse to pay what Universal wants for them. Similar thing with Warner Bros. and Blockbuster – although Blockbuster were renting sale-only titles (I believe). Rental, at least for films, is looking less than ideal these days. A shame, because I refuse to pay full price for a DVD or digital download before I’ve either seen it first, or so hyped up about a film I’ll take the risk. Alas! No film over the past year has made me terribly excited about seeing it.
        
        As for music: the music industry is slowly adjusting. Some people see that if giving music away for free generates ticket sales for concerts, that’ll work. Prince did away from selling his CDs and has used UK newspapers to GIVE away his latest albums – he’s betting that the concerts will attract the big bucks – more so than CD and digital downloads alone.
        
        Also there appears to be a big uptake for Spotify, Pandora and all the other services that give you an all-you-can-eat listening service for a fixed monthly price.
        
        The question I pose is this: is it the end of sales and more of a one-fee for all model?
      - Antinous / Moderator
        
        There is a very serious problem when the top selling album of 2011 (a very good album at that) only sold 5 million copies.
        
        I’d say that there’s a big problem when 5 million people are brainwashed into buying the same mass market drivel instead of learning to make their own music.
  - Yacko
    
    It’s a one year phenom. Does it include casual gaming? Mobile devices? The video game industry has been in growth for the last several years versus traditional entertainment media. Global video game revenues surpassed music and movies (individually) by 2008 and is now neck and neck with books. It has been spectacular growth for 10 years, give or take the current one. Videogames now sap up to $30bn over and above the normal sedate growth of sales pre-1999, that might have gone to other entertainment formats. It has been a steady buildup to the current situation, so yes, Hollywood is in decline. Could this be the moment things turn around again – sure thing, but the movie industry has a long climb back to parity.
  - http://twitter.com/TylerTinsley Tyler Tinsley
    
    i want data that stretches back 20 years.
http://echofox3.blogspot.com efergus3

The coroner’s report on the movie industry will read: ‘Cause of death – suicide’.
- Guest
  
  . . . “accidental suicide” maybe?
  - http://echofox3.blogspot.com efergus3
    
    They’re doing it on purpose. Maximum short-term money, to hell with the long-term.
blueelm

I agree with this completely. It is cheaper than ever to set up a home theater these days. I would go out to see films if I could find a place that showed good unusual films, had some style to make it stand out, served decent food and beverages, and where people were a bit more considerate (or a lot more fun and spirited) while watching.

I would watch more major motion pictures if there were more out there that were interesting, innovative, or just left you with anything to think about or were really visually stunning without having a ton of awful cloying crud in the plot, or were, like, actually funny.

As far as video games, I don’t play those, so that’s definitely at least not where I’d end up in a statistical analysis (there should be a study on this donchathink?)

I don’t pirate films though because it’s too much trouble so I Netflix and buy outright films that I like, watch them on my home screen, which actually does play 3D but I don’t really like most 3D films I’ve seen, and I can be with friends, no other people, eat and drink what I like, and not have to smell that nasty popcorn “butter” stench.

I think what the movie industry is actually facing is a perfect storm from all of these problems though, but the one that doesn’t deflate investor confidence is probably the “perils of piracy” so that’s where they sink their $$$ so they can keep raking it in.
http://www.drake.org.uk Martyn Drake

The big problem is that it’s not entirely the cinema’s fault. Since they’re pretty much at the mercy of the distributors and consequently the studios – they have to kowtow the line in terms of what they have to relinquish from their profits back to the distributor/studio. As such, refreshment prices go up to make up for loss profit.

Then the distributor/studio insists that they have the cinema staff walk around in the dark with night vision goggles to detect piracy – probably if the cinema refused they’d lose the ability to exhibit any of said distributors films in the future.

Does the cinema attempt to exhibit indie films from smaller distributors at the risk of the pile ‘em high approach to the bigger, more repulsive films that would potentially make more money from sheer bum-on-seat numbers alone? Would a Finnish film called something like “The Donkey Fish” outsell a film called “Mega Robot Explosions IV” in more built up areas? What incentive does the cinema have for showing the Finnish film?

BTW, I can’t remember if this is true or not, but can studios continue to operate their own cinema chains these days? I don’t believe they can, but times may have changed since I first read about that.
Pedantic Douchebag

I wouldn’t mind paying the prices currently charged if the theaters (and bathrooms) were cleaner, the concession food and drinks were delicious, the films were in focus, the sound mix was good, the seats were comfortable, and the ushers actually enforced the no talking/noise/brightly lit devices rules.

Why would I intentionally pay a company for an experience I know to be shitty? This is why there’s no such thing as a Black Death theme park. SEE! The rotting corpses! HEAR! The screams of the dying! FEEL! The hungry bite of a diseased rat! All for the low, low price of $15, plus $20 for food and beverages. No thanks.
hypersomniac

Let me just take this chance to say (long-winded opinion no one will read).
Hanglyman

Three things that would get me back in theaters:

Good movies. Every once in a while, one comes out. I see it. This happens once or twice a year at most. I’m hoping the next Batman will be one of these.

Good remakes of bad movies instead of awful remakes of good movies. Easier said than done, since so many bad movies just don’t give filmmakers anything to work with, and unlike remakes of good movies, they won’t hook people on name recognition. But wouldn’t it be nice if cinema were working towards making things better overall, rather than actively trying to ruin the few good things remaining?

Just show old, good movies. The last movie I saw in a theater was the re-release of Ghostbusters in October, and it was well worth the money. Hollywood is pretty much dead anyway, why even bother making new movies when you could keep making money off of the old ones that don’t suck? Yes, you could easily watch these at home, but every time I’ve seen a familiar movie in a theater for the first time, it’s a whole different experience, and definitely worth a little extra money.

Unfortunately, the never ending stream of people willing to pay $15 to see Godawful Unnecessary Sequel 5 will keep the current system going for years to come.
MelSkunk

I don’t mind paying to see movies in theatres, but I find I tend to be extremely selective now. I also spend my money more on the smaller ‘value’ theatre with smaller screens near me to see more movies and go to the big boys infrequently.

Just saw TinTin for example in a BIG theatre, in 3d (I was curious, don’t feel it really needed it though, unlike How to Train your Dragon or Avatar) and the only thing I was dissatisfied with was the concessions. The options of crazy huge or very tiny kid’s combo was basically it, and I settled for paying too much for a small amount meant for a child then way way too much for a huge amount I couldn’t possibly finish or need.

I really feel the theatres are trying. I just worry the system is broken.
http://diodeus.myopenid.com/ diodeus

I’m tired of being “marketed to” while waiting to see a film. I paid for the theatre experience, which does not include 20-minutes of commercials.
Yacko

Never underestimate the underwhelming theater experience as a core cause of the drop off. A reasonably decent home theater setup can be obtained for $2000. A family could invest in one, watch just DVD rentals and maybe every so often entertain a few friends, relatives and neighbors (no charge of course) and consider it to have paid its keep in as little as 1 year time. When you factor in that the equipment can be used for other purposes like, OTA, cable, internet, some family computer use, gaming, home videos, the cost effectiveness of rolling your own is undeniable. The savings are like paying yourself.
pkpk

Serve alcohol. DUH! It’s just a pain in the ass to fill my flask before a movie so I’d rather just stay home where I can drink openly.
- http://www.facebook.com/people/Sparg-Otyebat/1818893984 Sparg Otyebat
  
  Ah, the good old days of West German movie theatres. Reclining seats, cup holders für das Bier, und ashtrays. Hier kommt das Boot!
BensFlare

I did not see where Ebert mentioned piracy in his Sun-Times article (as indicated in the blog headline). However, I agree with the premise. In Columbia/ Ellicott City, Md, 20 mi outside Baltimore there are Zero art film theaters, and the 2 megaplexes that exist show the same hollywood crap. By the way, the popcorn still is popped with cottonseed oil, which is known to be the unhealthiest cooking oil. I know, I’m getting a bit grumpy…
djfrantz

One thing he misses, and I didn’t see it in the thread, is that concession prices are high to keep the cinemas open. At least what we were told when I worked at theatre was there was a sliding scale of the box office receipts that went back to the studios. Something like 95-100% of opening weekend box office goes back to the studios, with that sliding down the longer the film is out. Even working at a second run theatre most of our opening weekend box office went back to the studios. The theaters don’t make money showing movies, they make money selling popcorn.
- http://www.drake.org.uk Martyn Drake
  
  Exactly!
andyhavens

We get the crap we deserve. If we deserved better, they’d sell it to us. Great little indie movies go unnoticed and solid, meaningful films make a couple million while grotesque, shallow crap like “Avatar” makes hundreds of times that.

Look at the list of the top grossing films of all time: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_highest-grossing_films

Of those 50, only 1 — “Forest Gump” — isn’t an action-fest, kids’ movie, sequel or based on strong, existing IP. I’m not saying they’re all bad moves… I enjoyed many of them. But when you want to understand an industry, look at what fills seats. For the love of Fellini… “Kung Fu Panda 2″ made the list.

Maybe “Titanic,” too. I wasn’t a huge fan of the movie, but at least it had some dialogue that wasn’t puns or mildly racy double entendres.

Don’t get me wrong: I entirely support everyone’s right to see, read, play and listen to their own preferred brand of crap. I have some highly questionable tastes in TV.

I’m just always surprised when people are surprised that entertainment isn’t “better.” Not only is “better” very hard to create, it’s hard to sell… and hard to enjoy. Easy is easy.
- fredox
  
  It’s notable that “movies are crap” doesn’t make Ebert’s list. The dearth of “great little indie movies” and “solid, meaningful films” matter only to those that crave ”great little indie movies” and “solid, meaningful films”. i.e., a minuscule portion of the movie-going audience. Ebert’s point is that the mass market isn’t going to see mass market movies in the theatre like they used to, and blaming ticket prices, concession prices and douchebags that won’t shut the f**k up seems like a good place to start,
- Daneel
  
  This is a better (and slightly less depressing) inflation-adjusted list.
  
  http://boxofficemojo.com/alltime/adjusted.htm
  - L_Mariachi
    
    That’s adjusted for ticket price inflation, which I assume does not track directly to monetary inflation. Is there a list somewhere that adjusts for the latter?
Lobster

Says a man who turned watching movies into a career.

This is a little like the Pope preaching austerity from his golden altar.
- http://www.drake.org.uk Martyn Drake
  
  Well, that’s the movies for you. It’s all one great big hypocrisy.
http://2012diaries.blogspot.com/ tristan eldritch

I blame Spielberg and Locust.
- millie fink
  
  I credit Day of the Locust (West’s more than Schlesinger’s). For prophecy, that is.
Ed Hawkes

I thought Ebert’s list was pretty good. He’s a straight shooter.

My complaints:
1. Movies are too loud. I’ve walked out cause sitting in a wall off screams and explosion is painful. Maybe it’s just me, or I’m old and everything is loud these days.

2. They don’t make good B movies anymore.
- Antinous / Moderator
  
  Movies are too loud.
  
  Possibly related to the sound being set for a full theater when only half the seats are filled. I take earplugs to the Sunday matinee when there are sometimes only a dozen people in the theater.
ROSSINDETROIT

If you care about high quality image presentation, you still care about theaters. No matter how big your TV, the resolution can’t compare to film projection properly done. TVs are good enough for most people most of the time but if projection cinema goes away an important capability of film will be gone forever.
http://pulse.yahoo.com/_CKKOXRLFKJV4TGKOEHKCNJ4MEM John in Queens

I went to see The Descendants the other night. A woman next to me texted at least 100 times during the movie. Each time her bright blue screen flashed in my eyes, it drove me crazy. After the movie I suggested next time she stay home if she needed to text so much during a movie. And she said to me, and I quote, “If texting bothers you so much during a movie, you should just rent it and watch it alone.” I used to see a movie once a week in the theaters. To me, there’s no better shared experience. But all the texting and distractions nowadays aren’t worth it. I now go about four times a year except when I visit Austin Texas and then I go to the Drafthouse where they throw people out for cellphones and texting.
Leto_Atreides

One good way to stop or reduce piracy would be to treat paying customers with respect.

I know this picture is old, but it’s still so true:

http://www.geek.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/piratedvd.jpg
- chellberty
  
  try pressing stop, stop, play it will go to the main movie most of the time. Also lots of dvd players have backdoors to make the player Regionfree.
- Zig
  
  As someone who put down good money you shouldn’t have to go through the hassle, but there are programs that will rip the DVD to an iso so it can be burned. The hassle free copy will allow you to go right to the root menu.
ROSSINDETROIT

Regarding TXT in movie theaters, perhaps what’s needed is not a ban on TXT but a way to do it without annoying others. After all, when someone’s typing at least they’re not jabbering so TXT is kind of a win/lose. It’s the bright screen that irritates. And you don’t really need a bright screen in a dark place to TXT. Darker TXT screen settings for dark places. Probably already exists. Ought to be mandatory.
- Antinous / Moderator
  
  Or we could just cut off their hands.
http://gristleoflife.wordpress.com/ Analog Kid

Humongous bucket of popcorn and gigantic cup of soda: 20 bucks…but…FREE REFILLS! Soda and popcorn must have something nearing 95% profit.
Ridiculous. No wonder people sneak food into the movies.
- Jamie Norwood
  
  I do not sneak food into theaters!
  
  It is perfectly legal here to bring in your own food, despite the theatres trying to change the law. So for $10 I can bring in a soda and a bag of M&Ms/whatever, OR, I can pay theater prices of $15 for the same thing, only with poorly mixed soda that is more water than soda.
  
  I understand the theater’s position in that most of the profits for the actual movie are taken by the studio, leaving them to only make profit off the ‘extras’, but that is a broken system. It is not my job to support both of them, and I will not do so just for the sake of it.
  
  I am in the hypothetical family of 4. Me, my partner, two kids. Even a decade ago, going to the movies cost less than $10 a ticket and snacks ran about the same for a soda and M&Ms/popcorn/whatever.
  
  We went to see Tin Tin this weekend. $14 a head for the tickets,and they want $6 for a small soda and $8 for any kind of snack, most of which can be had at the local shops for literally half the price. And their small soda is very much a small, running less than the 600 ml/20 oz bottles I can get for $4 at the same store.
  
  I can forgive the floors, and they do well with the sound and light at our theaters, but if charging double market price for things is the only way to stay viable, well, I won’t miss you when you are gone. Sorry.
  
  (Note that we can buy an entire season of most TV shows on DVD for less than the ticket cost alone to get the four of us into a movie. One offers a really big screen with annoyances like sticky floors and other people. The other offers a much small screen, but without other people, and about 10x the content.)
  
  Until the movie industry steps back and looks at ways to make going to the movies and such more appealing than staying home, they are doomed. And the answer isn’t ‘make movies harder to steal’ because that isn’t what is keeping people from going.
donovan acree

I wonder how much the bottom line would be improved if they saved their money and stopped trying to ‘fight piracy’?
DMStone

There was a similar article a little while ago somewhere (my google-fu isn’t working) about the music industry.

An insider was talking about an increase in sales in the last year, and his point was that the studios don’t make or lose money based on piracy or new technology. They make their money based on the quality of the catalog, and the last couple years they released several good records which made people want to spend some money.

I think the movie industry would do well to learn the same lesson, however, distribution is a problem. Movies are in theaters for such a short period, by the time they generate a little bit of hype and I decide to finally make the trek (and shell out the cash) the film has already been replaced. Thusly, I wind up only seeing huge advertised blockbusters and sequels and miss out on anything promising and original. I doubt I am the only one.

I did finally see Inception as a $5.00 Imax matinee this last year. I hope discounted second run 3D and Imax films become a trend.
GonzO Rodrigue

If there is any question as to why movie theaters are struggling, the answer is simple: none of them are anything like The Alamo in Austin, TX.
Genre Slur

The Plaza theater in Calgary is still chugging along. Not the amazing rep theater it used to be , but still a notch above the Biggies. I tend to hit it 4-5 times for every instance of Biggie exposure. Biggies seem to be designed (in Calgary) to cater to people who are fresh into the weed-smoking/mushroom inhaling experience (IE 15-17 yr olds), yet don’t appreciate reading. Bells, whistles, Egyptian mock-up light shows, arcades… the lobbies seem to be where the main action is. Not my style, so my friends and I usually watch at home, or go to the reps to watch midnight showings of The Thing, Casablanca, et cetera.
D Wyatt

Its society, corporations, and the populations cravings for more for less that causes everything to turn to shit.
Cheaper cheaper cheaper= everything in decline.
Save a buck lose thousands of customers=the norm.
Make product inferior but get it out faster/sooner or cheaper=Lets do it!!
I have more things that say “made in china” in my house then I do made in the usa. Actually Im hard pressed to find something in this entire house stamped with the good ole MADE IN THE U.S.A.

Along with obvious skimping and lack of effort on the movie industry. The main problem I see is the same exact thing that is wrong with most companies, the government, etc.
The company/government gets so large that they become completely ignorant to the inner workings. Ignorant to flaws, and completely clueless and uncaring to the other side of the coin. Citizens > Government, Company < Consumer.

Without the citizens or consumers on board you are destined to fail, regardless of effort, without us there can be no "them"
- guanto
  
  Ironically it’s American companies that are selling crap hardware today (e.g. HP “EliteBooks”, flimsiest and most expensive computer I’ve ever bought) and Asian companies (e.g. Lenovo, Toshiba — I have a Toshiba notebook that cost me one third of the price of that HP POS; better in every respect) that sell excellent hardware. Both are produced in China. It’s the company, not the country where it’s produced; “China” does in no way equate to “low quality.”
  - Jamie Norwood
    
    This is very true. For a while we worked with a woman doing Montessori school implement import and she spent a lot of time in China finding factories and such that could do what she wanted. She found out quickly that you can get anything made that you want, but you get what you pay for. If you have a choice between somewhere charging $4 and $5 for an item, there is a good chance the $4 one will be crap. She had no problem getting really good quality by just paying what amounted to a remarkably small per-item cost.
    
    But the way ‘big’ companies work, quality is irrelevant. They get in 5 featureless sheets of paper that say ‘we can do X for Y’ and choose whatever is the lowest Y’ That the ones charging more do a better job is utterly and completely irrelevant to them. The bottom line is the only line.
zilljah

I saw one film in a theater this year-Senna, and that was because it wasn’t going to be on DVD anytime soon. I’ve been so disgusted with the “theater experience” that I prefer staying home and watching films on TV than put up with the BS.
http://twitter.com/twistmeyer Mike Meyer

The film industry is losing money because they are clinging to a one-size-fits-all distribution model based on theatrical distribution as the main revenue stream. This is a huge moneymaker when you have blockbuster releases, but these days there are so many films being made everywhere. The theater chains want the blockbusters and pay lip service to the smaller films (indies, documentaries, any big budget film that didn’t prove its mettle on opening weekend). The release of DVDs, VOD, etc. are all timed to favor the theatrical releases, as are all the promotional efforts. It’s all about opening big.

This doesn’t work for a lot of movies, though. There are a lot of documentaries and indie films that just don’t get shown anywhere, and though hundreds of people and millions of dollars are spent to make major releases, if a good portion of your audience for any reason can’t see the film on opening weekend, it disappears rapidly. The theater chains want to fill seats, so they have no interest in a movie that catches on slowly through word-of-mouth. It’s like building a huge mansion and then burning it down if there are no offers in the first open house.

I often read about an interesting film, find that it’s playing in something like 1 theatre in all of Los Angeles, and miss it. Maybe it goes to DVD, maybe it shows up on iTunes or another on demand service. By the time it does, my attention is elsewhere and the promotional dollars and critical goodwill have long been spent and forgotten.

The film industry is bending over backwards to preserve a distribution channel which is killing them by starving out everyone but the current top 5. I honestly believe that all releases costing, say, $40 million or less to make should have simultaneous day-and-date release to DVD and digital channels. I’m not sure it even makes sense to release documentaries and indie films to theaters any more; certainly the current timeline of release windows serves this material poorly.

Pirate channels tend to offer the long tail just as poorly as the theatrical system. Obscure and older material is much harder to BitTorrent than the same top 10 that’s already in the theatre. As a consumer, I want the option of seeing everything ever made, right now, in a way I can sample some items before I buy, and I want things offered at a price that recognizes the abundance of entertainment out there.

My three rules:

1) I want to be able to find everything — it’s not enough to offer it if it’s essentially hidden.
2) I want to watch it at my convenience, in a timeframe and format of my choosing.
3) I want it at a reasonable price. I actually think that Netflix’s streaming service pricing is skewed too far in the other direction to be sustainable (and apparently content providers agree).
ErnestPayne

Toss in declining incomes and higher priorities and the decline should have been predictable.
aaronk415

Movies are terrible now. While the level of craftsmanship is extremely high in major American movies there is no Art. Art is what stays with you after the movie is over. We have had so many years of well crafted but hollow films that the entire form has been degraded and now that people can find more economical means of spending 2 hours they will take it because lets face it, that movie you are watching is now on the same shallow level as the crap that’s on TV.
Daemonworks

He’s not really saying anything that most people hasn’t been said five thousand times by pretty much everyone on and off the net.

Also, I refuse to accept the idiot-business-jargon redefinition of the phrase “lose money” to mean “not making as much money as they think they should be”
http://obbop.wordpress.com/ obbop

My Disgruntled Old Coot Opinion is not only worthless bat, additionally, meaningless and adds nothing to the high-caliber discussion within this lengthy thread so I obviously feel compelled to add my 36-cents worth to the fray.

Averaged out I probably view a theater-based movie perhaps once every five or six years and the time between theater visits increase as I age and with the economy kicking me in the face and leaving my discretionary income at, basically, zero so it is possible that I may never pay to enter a movie theater again.

There is a budget-type theater over yonder ‘cross the holler where on weekdays one can enter for three bucks and view a fairly-recently released movie.

Tried it once a few months back.

Perhaps a couple dozen humans infesting the place.

Noise from the herd within tolerable.

Vittle prices high but did buy a small popcorn but it was srale, verging on rancid.

I did not return it since communicating with the worker would require speaking in Hillbillyese and I have difficulty decreasing my mental and emotional age to around a 4th-grade level.

Within the shanty the TV is attached to not-quite-rabbit-ears-type antennae.

Instead, one of those new-fangled high-falutin’ types for that dern’ new-type TV that was likely a city-slicker plot to infest the citizen-sheep’s brainlets with even more propaganda.

Local broadcast TV at no charge other than the disgusting, perverted propaganda/advertising that supposedly allows “free TV” but is actually passed along via the cost of ALL goods and services sold so that the end consumer is the ones who pay ALL taxes, pay-outs to over-paid athletes, entertainers, high-level corporate scum and figurehead lackey lap-dog scum, vile, putrid anti-freedom politicians.

Late at night every once-in-awhile I awaken from my semi-comatose condition upon the used recliner the kinfolk a few hollers over gave me to go away and not return and notice a movie being shown.

Not the usual repeated endlessly one but a new-to-me movie.

One was “Ghost World.”

I really liked it.

I have always enjoyed the teen-age coming-of-age genre as long as it was not too goofy and aimed at a too-immature mind.

The “Dude, where’s my car” movie disgusted me. Yuck.

“The Breakfast Club” was good and “Fast Times at Ridgemont High” was another goody.

I still sit in my shanty, my humble hovel, and shake my noggin’ in wonderment at all those silly sacks of cellular reproduction who lambaste one of the great movies of all; “The Postman.”

Time to mosey off.

Y’all have a Hippy New year and remember, as my Mennonite buddy who visits when he and Betsy are plowing their south 60 (she will be glad when they can afford a mule to plow the plow) , don’t drink or drive.

The Disgruntled Old Coot
Ed Pegg

My local library has 240 of the IMDB Top 250 rated movies of all time. Not surprisingly, most of these movies have been quite good. I saw Requiem for a Dream from a library rental last night. Someone else may have seen it from a download.

I saw Ace in the Hole a few days ago. A Billy Wilder movie from 1951. Back then, big media had a tendency to glom onto a story and milk it for all it was worth, even to the point of ludicrousness, and even if the end result was death. That was 60 years ago. Have we learned much since then?

Movies are failing because the Promotional method is failing. Because of the many ways people have of getting information now, it’s easier to avoid bad material.

I did go and see Mission Impossible: Ghost Protocol at the theatre. It promised real film-making (not special effects) and stunts on the tallest building in the world. That is the sort of thing I want to see on the big screen.

Norma Desmond:
I *am* big. It’s the *pictures* that got small.

The studios are self-deluded, and everyone around them knows it.