Comments on: Leaked DHS internet watchlist lists msthirteen.com, skeevy German site about 13yo girls as MS-13 gang news http://boingboing.net/2012/01/11/homeland-security-internet-mon.html Brain candy for Happy Mutants Sat, 25 May 2013 18:17:00 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.4.1 By: James Penrose http://boingboing.net/2012/01/11/homeland-security-internet-mon.html#comment-1318613 James Penrose Fri, 13 Jan 2012 02:10:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=138524#comment-1318613 Agents and intelligence types have a very strong tendency to operate on a "if the name looks evil, it *is* evil" on the theory that the bad guys are not smart enough to choose innocuous names. They use the same approach to porn:  Simple key word searches for naughty words.  That's why there's been a push on and off for years to have anything that claims to be kiddie porn classed the same as real kiddie porn since that will make things a lot easier since they can bust almost every adult site in the universe as most of them claim to have "hot young teens" and such like even if they feature washed out forty year old crack hookers. I spent years trying to teach some of them this doesn't work for spit.  Some learned, those are the good ones. Agents and intelligence types have a very strong tendency to operate on a “if the name looks evil, it *is* evil” on the theory that the bad guys are not smart enough to choose innocuous names.

They use the same approach to porn:  Simple key word searches for naughty words.  That’s why there’s been a push on and off for years to have anything that claims to be kiddie porn classed the same as real kiddie porn since that will make things a lot easier since they can bust almost every adult site in the universe as most of them claim to have “hot young teens” and such like even if they feature washed out forty year old crack hookers.

I spent years trying to teach some of them this doesn’t work for spit.  Some learned, those are the good ones.

]]> By: travtastic http://boingboing.net/2012/01/11/homeland-security-internet-mon.html#comment-1318458 travtastic Thu, 12 Jan 2012 22:53:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=138524#comment-1318458 No, you only use steganography on cute cat pictures. Also, cute stegosaurus pictures. No, you only use steganography on cute cat pictures. Also, cute stegosaurus pictures.

]]> By: EH http://boingboing.net/2012/01/11/homeland-security-internet-mon.html#comment-1318030 EH Thu, 12 Jan 2012 19:14:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=138524#comment-1318030 well yeah, but that means the story is not that the site was categorized as such, but that the process of categorization is so broken. this being a "leak" obscures the real story. well yeah, but that means the story is not that the site was categorized as such, but that the process of categorization is so broken. this being a “leak” obscures the real story.

]]> By: Xeni Jardin http://boingboing.net/2012/01/11/homeland-security-internet-mon.html#comment-1317702 Xeni Jardin Thu, 12 Jan 2012 14:47:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=138524#comment-1317702 The 2012 version isn't available publicly yet, but was leaked to a Reuters reporter. And I'll clarify the earlier link to the older doc on Cryptome. The 2012 version isn’t available publicly yet, but was leaked to a Reuters reporter. And I’ll clarify the earlier link to the older doc on Cryptome.

]]> By: Xeni Jardin http://boingboing.net/2012/01/11/homeland-security-internet-mon.html#comment-1317700 Xeni Jardin Thu, 12 Jan 2012 14:46:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=138524#comment-1317700 The published list at Cryptome is a year old; the Reuters article that ran yesterday references a new version we haven't seen. Post updated! The published list at Cryptome is a year old; the Reuters article that ran yesterday references a new version we haven’t seen. Post updated!

]]> By: howaboutthisdangit http://boingboing.net/2012/01/11/homeland-security-internet-mon.html#comment-1317665 howaboutthisdangit Thu, 12 Jan 2012 13:08:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=138524#comment-1317665 (Looks around.  Checks watch.) (Looks around.  Checks watch.)

]]> By: Rob Gehrke http://boingboing.net/2012/01/11/homeland-security-internet-mon.html#comment-1317658 Rob Gehrke Thu, 12 Jan 2012 12:45:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=138524#comment-1317658 Winner ! Though it's more fun to think that DHS is a bunch of bumbling, incompetent cavemen. Winner !
Though it’s more fun to think that DHS is a bunch of bumbling, incompetent cavemen.

]]> By: Jon in Notts http://boingboing.net/2012/01/11/homeland-security-internet-mon.html#comment-1317622 Jon in Notts Thu, 12 Jan 2012 09:19:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=138524#comment-1317622 I was about to make the wayback machine comment, but Technocrat beat me. It took me less time to find out that this leaked list is a bit out of date but was accurate (in this case) than it did to write this comment. I was about to make the wayback machine comment, but Technocrat beat me. It took me less time to find out that this leaked list is a bit out of date but was accurate (in this case) than it did to write this comment.

]]> By: david mowers http://boingboing.net/2012/01/11/homeland-security-internet-mon.html#comment-1317613 david mowers Thu, 12 Jan 2012 08:37:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=138524#comment-1317613 Nothing. The article's author didn't bother to do what any real journalist should, copy and paste the content of the website's page in Google translate. The site is about dealing with changes in teen behavior due to puberty and peer pressure. It does however show how awful U.S. intelligence is and what a waste of money it is to "troll" the internet seeking criminal intelligence for law enforcement or military purposes. Anyone can put anything for any reason on the internet but here in the States of Disillusion we pay $65,000.00 a year to an army of federal agents to surf the web while jerking off. Nothing. The article’s author didn’t bother to do what any real journalist should, copy and paste the content of the website’s page in Google translate. The site is about dealing with changes in teen behavior due to puberty and peer pressure. It does however show how awful U.S. intelligence is and what a waste of money it is to “troll” the internet seeking criminal intelligence for law enforcement or military purposes. Anyone can put anything for any reason on the internet but here in the States of Disillusion we pay $65,000.00 a year to an army of federal agents to surf the web while jerking off.

]]> By: sigdrifa http://boingboing.net/2012/01/11/homeland-security-internet-mon.html#comment-1317609 sigdrifa Thu, 12 Jan 2012 07:51:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=138524#comment-1317609 In defense of us Germans, I have *never* heard of this site. Not that I'm a thirteen year old, but popular sites directed at kids and teenagers usually make the mainstream news at some time. And the fact that there's only four posts on the whole site, written between Oct. 23rd and Nov. 1st, 2011, also shows that this is not exactly an active, popular community site. Not that I have read more than 10 percent of it; as retepslluerb already pointed out, it's all bull anyway. In defense of us Germans, I have *never* heard of this site. Not that I’m a thirteen year old, but popular sites directed at kids and teenagers usually make the mainstream news at some time. And the fact that there’s only four posts on the whole site, written between Oct. 23rd and Nov. 1st, 2011, also shows that this is not exactly an active, popular community site. Not that I have read more than 10 percent of it; as retepslluerb already pointed out, it’s all bull anyway.

]]> By: retepslluerb http://boingboing.net/2012/01/11/homeland-security-internet-mon.html#comment-1317603 retepslluerb Thu, 12 Jan 2012 07:21:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=138524#comment-1317603 Curse you for doing actual research! That's not what the internet is for! Curse you for doing actual research!

That’s not what the internet is for!

]]> By: retepslluerb http://boingboing.net/2012/01/11/homeland-security-internet-mon.html#comment-1317602 retepslluerb Thu, 12 Jan 2012 07:20:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=138524#comment-1317602 I'd think that adding suffixes is a way to Germanify  it.  Also, we didn't borrow it, because you ain't gonna get it back.  You can keep the angst, though - Germans themselves never got the difference between that and Furcht  (fear). I’d think that adding suffixes is a way to Germanify  it. 

Also, we didn’t borrow it, because you ain’t gonna get it back.  You can keep the angst, though – Germans themselves never got the difference between that and Furcht  (fear).

]]> By: retepslluerb http://boingboing.net/2012/01/11/homeland-security-internet-mon.html#comment-1317598 retepslluerb Thu, 12 Jan 2012 07:15:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=138524#comment-1317598 Well, the general age of sexual consent in Germany is 14.  And yes, it's almost certainly SEO.   It's a mess of stock phrases ranging from the sensible to the mind-boggling, when deconstructed.  This was written for machines, not people. Edit: stock, not stuck. Damn, I gotta turn off that autocorrect. Well, the general age of sexual consent in Germany is 14. 

And yes, it’s almost certainly SEO.   It’s a mess of stock phrases ranging from the sensible to the mind-boggling, when deconstructed. 

This was written for machines, not people.

Edit: stock, not stuck. Damn, I gotta turn off that autocorrect.

]]> By: retepslluerb http://boingboing.net/2012/01/11/homeland-security-internet-mon.html#comment-1317592 retepslluerb Thu, 12 Jan 2012 07:05:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=138524#comment-1317592 You are absolutely right.   They use English *words* because it's the “In” thing to do, but they do not use English. „Wildgewordene Teeanger/Jugendliche“ is a stock expression describing the shift to the “rebellious” phase.  You are absolutely right.   They use English *words* because it’s the “In” thing to do, but they do not use English. „Wildgewordene Teeanger/Jugendliche“ is a stock expression describing the shift to the “rebellious” phase. 

]]> By: retepslluerb http://boingboing.net/2012/01/11/homeland-security-internet-mon.html#comment-1317589 retepslluerb Thu, 12 Jan 2012 07:01:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=138524#comment-1317589 No, it isn't.   The phrase doesn't mean the same as it would when this were an American website. No, it isn’t.   The phrase doesn’t mean the same as it would when this were an American website.

]]> By: Technocrat http://boingboing.net/2012/01/11/homeland-security-internet-mon.html#comment-1317561 Technocrat Thu, 12 Jan 2012 05:38:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=138524#comment-1317561 Additionally, I didn't know it was possible to "leak" a public report that was released by the DHS on its own website. Here is the June 2011 version... http://www.dhs.gov/xlibrary/assets/privacy/privacy_pia_ops_publiclyavailablesocialmedia.pdf Additionally, I didn’t know it was possible to “leak” a public report that was released by the DHS on its own website. Here is the June 2011 version…

http://www.dhs.gov/xlibrary/assets/privacy/privacy_pia_ops_publiclyavailablesocialmedia.pdf

]]> By: Technocrat http://boingboing.net/2012/01/11/homeland-security-internet-mon.html#comment-1317559 Technocrat Thu, 12 Jan 2012 05:35:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=138524#comment-1317559 I believe it is important to remember that content of domains / sites can change over time. The DHS report referenced in this article was created in Jan 2011. According to DNS Stuff, the current msthirteen.com domain was created in Sep 2011 - http://www.dnsstuff.com/tools/whois/?tool_id=66&token=&toolhandler_redirect=0&ip=msthirteen.com According to the WayBackMachine, the site was about MS-13 on Feb 2010. http://web.archive.org/web/20100210185433/http://www.msthirteen.com/ I believe it is important to remember that content of domains / sites can change over time. The DHS report referenced in this article was created in Jan 2011.

According to DNS Stuff, the current msthirteen.com domain was created in Sep 2011 - http://www.dnsstuff.com/tools/whois/?tool_id=66&token=&toolhandler_redirect=0&ip=msthirteen.com

According to the WayBackMachine, the site was about MS-13 on Feb 2010.
http://web.archive.org/web/20100210185433/http://www.msthirteen.com/

]]> By: Marc Mielke http://boingboing.net/2012/01/11/homeland-security-internet-mon.html#comment-1317540 Marc Mielke Thu, 12 Jan 2012 04:52:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=138524#comment-1317540 Wait...an algorithm can spontaneously create a site like this? Does this mean we have emergent AI, and the emergent AI is a paedo? Shit...I thought SKYNET was scary... Wait…an algorithm can spontaneously create a site like this? Does this mean we have emergent AI, and the emergent AI is a paedo? Shit…I thought SKYNET was scary…

]]> By: Jonathan Roberts http://boingboing.net/2012/01/11/homeland-security-internet-mon.html#comment-1317531 Jonathan Roberts Thu, 12 Jan 2012 04:35:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=138524#comment-1317531 If it's anything at all like China, expect a lot more of the same. The kind of random stuff that has no political or adult content but gets blocked anyway is unbelievable. It shouldn't be so obvious with SOPA  if you speak English though, I expect the automation will used much more in other languages. If it’s anything at all like China, expect a lot more of the same. The kind of random stuff that has no political or adult content but gets blocked anyway is unbelievable. It shouldn’t be so obvious with SOPA  if you speak English though, I expect the automation will used much more in other languages.

]]> By: Incipient Madness http://boingboing.net/2012/01/11/homeland-security-internet-mon.html#comment-1317493 Incipient Madness Thu, 12 Jan 2012 03:35:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=138524#comment-1317493 I think that the current state of the drug war in Mexico has made MS-13 a thing of the past. There never was really that much of a threat, it was mostly "fear of the day" media hype. Free agents like the Zetas, and the old Golfo and Sinaloa cartels are the big players, with the Juarez cartel hanging in there. At least that's how things are on the east coast of the US/Mexico border. Don't know much about the west coast. Mara Salvatrucha was mostly hype and wannabes.  I think that the current state of the drug war in Mexico has made MS-13 a thing of the past. There never was really that much of a threat, it was mostly “fear of the day” media hype. Free agents like the Zetas, and the old Golfo and Sinaloa cartels are the big players, with the Juarez cartel hanging in there. At least that’s how things are on the east coast of the US/Mexico border. Don’t know much about the west coast.

Mara Salvatrucha was mostly hype and wannabes. 

]]> By: ComradeQuestions http://boingboing.net/2012/01/11/homeland-security-internet-mon.html#comment-1317473 ComradeQuestions Thu, 12 Jan 2012 02:55:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=138524#comment-1317473 Gee, thanks for making these screenshots show up in my browser's cache.  That'll be tough to explain when the Feds come knocking down my door. Gee, thanks for making these screenshots show up in my browser’s cache.  That’ll be tough to explain when the Feds come knocking down my door.

]]> By: Jonathan Roberts http://boingboing.net/2012/01/11/homeland-security-internet-mon.html#comment-1317457 Jonathan Roberts Thu, 12 Jan 2012 02:34:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=138524#comment-1317457 I think it's it's just another example of someone using a 'cool' English expression without understanding what it actually means. They're probably using it to mean edgy and different, while using English to suggest that the website is international. In China quite a few magazines do this, everything is in Chinese apart from the titles and some of the subheadings. I think it’s it’s just another example of someone using a ‘cool’ English expression without understanding what it actually means. They’re probably using it to mean edgy and different, while using English to suggest that the website is international. In China quite a few magazines do this, everything is in Chinese apart from the titles and some of the subheadings.

]]> By: David http://boingboing.net/2012/01/11/homeland-security-internet-mon.html#comment-1317435 David Thu, 12 Jan 2012 02:02:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=138524#comment-1317435 What's worse is yet another English word (thirteen, teenager) that was borrowed by the Germans with no effort to germanify it.  Add oddly inappropriate sounding suffixes and its just WRONG!!! What’s worse is yet another English word (thirteen, teenager) that was borrowed by the Germans with no effort to germanify it.  Add oddly inappropriate sounding suffixes and its just WRONG!!!

]]> By: corydodt http://boingboing.net/2012/01/11/homeland-security-internet-mon.html#comment-1317414 corydodt Thu, 12 Jan 2012 01:39:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=138524#comment-1317414 I think Xeni nailed it with the SEO observation. Let's look at the facts: * Contains english phrases, and is named with an English phrase, and the domain is an english phrase. * No comments anywhere * No photos of the creator of the site, or any photos that aren't stock * Exactly enough articles to fill one page, and no more. * One of the categories is "teenie," ffs. It basically has no personality whatsoever, no evidence that a person who cares about the wellbeing of teens had a hand in its creation. This was a site created by a robot, or a domain-squatting mass production process of some kind. Those kinds of sites are ugly enough on their own, but then add in the subject matter and it really goes off the rails of decency. An algorithm decided these would be good terms to have on a web page where ads for products might be displayed, and we don't have to guess why these terms worked well in the algorithm. Frankly if homeland security wants to shut this one down, I have no objections. I think Xeni nailed it with the SEO observation. Let’s look at the facts:

* Contains english phrases, and is named with an English phrase, and the domain is an english phrase.
* No comments anywhere
* No photos of the creator of the site, or any photos that aren’t stock
* Exactly enough articles to fill one page, and no more.
* One of the categories is “teenie,” ffs.

It basically has no personality whatsoever, no evidence that a person who cares about the wellbeing of teens had a hand in its creation. This was a site created by a robot, or a domain-squatting mass production process of some kind. Those kinds of sites are ugly enough on their own, but then add in the subject matter and it really goes off the rails of decency. An algorithm decided these would be good terms to have on a web page where ads for products might be displayed, and we don’t have to guess why these terms worked well in the algorithm.

Frankly if homeland security wants to shut this one down, I have no objections.

]]> By: jaytkay http://boingboing.net/2012/01/11/homeland-security-internet-mon.html#comment-1317405 jaytkay Thu, 12 Jan 2012 01:34:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=138524#comment-1317405 Hey, it's a war out there and there's gonna be some collateral damage. Or. in this case. collateral benefit. Hey, it’s a war out there and there’s gonna be some collateral damage. Or. in this case. collateral benefit.

]]> By: jerwin http://boingboing.net/2012/01/11/homeland-security-internet-mon.html#comment-1317391 jerwin Thu, 12 Jan 2012 01:21:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=138524#comment-1317391 Perhaps MS-13 does control the site, and the "stock photography" is steganographic.   Perhaps MS-13 does control the site, and the “stock photography” is steganographic.
 

]]> By: Ipo http://boingboing.net/2012/01/11/homeland-security-internet-mon.html#comment-1317385 Ipo Thu, 12 Jan 2012 01:10:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=138524#comment-1317385 By trepanation or in the eye socket?  By trepanation or in the eye socket? 

]]> By: Ipo http://boingboing.net/2012/01/11/homeland-security-internet-mon.html#comment-1317380 Ipo Thu, 12 Jan 2012 01:06:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=138524#comment-1317380 It seems to be a site for parents of 13 year old girls that have gone wild with the onset of hormonal changes.  It talks of problems raising girls during puberty.  I bet the makers of the site have never seen any "girls gone wild" vids, and no idea.  Not quite sure what "skeevy" means to you, but it doesn't seem skeevy to me.  It seems to be a site for parents of 13 year old girls that have gone wild with the onset of hormonal changes.  It talks of problems raising girls during puberty. 
I bet the makers of the site have never seen any “girls gone wild” vids, and no idea. 
Not quite sure what “skeevy” means to you, but it doesn’t seem skeevy to me. 

]]> By: sugarsails http://boingboing.net/2012/01/11/homeland-security-internet-mon.html#comment-1317361 sugarsails Thu, 12 Jan 2012 00:36:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=138524#comment-1317361 properly squicked by this properly squicked by this

]]> By: CharredBarn http://boingboing.net/2012/01/11/homeland-security-internet-mon.html#comment-1317350 CharredBarn Thu, 12 Jan 2012 00:19:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=138524#comment-1317350 Even the catchphrase "teenies gone wild" is enough to make it skeevy. Perhaps we should take some comfort in the fact that, although our DHS isn't checking purported terror websites very closely, they also aren't spending work time at sites that promise "teenies gone wild."  Even the catchphrase “teenies gone wild” is enough to make it skeevy. Perhaps we should take some comfort in the fact that, although our DHS isn’t checking purported terror websites very closely, they also aren’t spending work time at sites that promise “teenies gone wild.” 

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