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	<title>Comments on: Absurd &quot;academic publishing racket&quot; is past its sell-by&#160;date</title>
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	<description>Brain candy for Happy Mutants</description>
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		<title>By: Hiring Librarians</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/04/22/absurd-academic-publishing-r.html#comment-1407021</link>
		<dc:creator>Hiring Librarians</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Apr 2012 05:45:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=155935#comment-1407021</guid>
		<description>In my experience with publishing for library sciences, professors hire students to hunt those commas.  No cost to the publisher.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In my experience with publishing for library sciences, professors hire students to hunt those commas.  No cost to the publisher.</p>
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		<title>By: Edmund Charles Davis-Quinn</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/04/22/absurd-academic-publishing-r.html#comment-1404454</link>
		<dc:creator>Edmund Charles Davis-Quinn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Apr 2012 05:13:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=155935#comment-1404454</guid>
		<description>I guess I was thinking of textbooks.  Which are absurdly expensive and frankly unfocused.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I guess I was thinking of textbooks.  Which are absurdly expensive and frankly unfocused.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark Lomas</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/04/22/absurd-academic-publishing-r.html#comment-1403922</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Lomas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Apr 2012 19:26:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=155935#comment-1403922</guid>
		<description>Back in the 1980s I sought a publisher for some workshop proceedings. My own university, despite owning a major publishing house and hosting the workshop, declined to publish the proceedings as it thought they would not be profitable. By contrast, Springer Verlag accepted the proceedings, sight unseen, and continues to publish for this workshop some two decades later.

They took a risk so I don&#039;t begrudge them a profit.

When estimating publishers&#039; profits don&#039;t forget to take into account the many conferences and workshops that are subsidised by this business model.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Back in the 1980s I sought a publisher for some workshop proceedings. My own university, despite owning a major publishing house and hosting the workshop, declined to publish the proceedings as it thought they would not be profitable. By contrast, Springer Verlag accepted the proceedings, sight unseen, and continues to publish for this workshop some two decades later.</p>
<p>They took a risk so I don&#8217;t begrudge them a profit.</p>
<p>When estimating publishers&#8217; profits don&#8217;t forget to take into account the many conferences and workshops that are subsidised by this business model.</p>
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		<title>By: Magnus Ramage</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/04/22/absurd-academic-publishing-r.html#comment-1403401</link>
		<dc:creator>Magnus Ramage</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Apr 2012 09:23:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=155935#comment-1403401</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m an academic at the Open University in the UK. I&#039;ve just checked my contract. The copyright for the works I produce as course material belongs to the university, and in that sense follows the sharecropper model. The OU (which is primarily distance-learning) makes most of the its money from providing these course materials (and the tuition and assessment connected with them) to students, so that&#039;s fair enough. 

However, the contract explicitly states that the copyright in academic works (in the sense of books, journal articles and the like) belong to the individual academics as authors and not the university. 

Perhaps other institutions vary (and the OU is, for the most part, a very good employer), but here&#039;s an example of an institution for whom copyright matters a great deal but doesn&#039;t apply it to research works.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m an academic at the Open University in the UK. I&#8217;ve just checked my contract. The copyright for the works I produce as course material belongs to the university, and in that sense follows the sharecropper model. The OU (which is primarily distance-learning) makes most of the its money from providing these course materials (and the tuition and assessment connected with them) to students, so that&#8217;s fair enough. </p>
<p>However, the contract explicitly states that the copyright in academic works (in the sense of books, journal articles and the like) belong to the individual academics as authors and not the university. </p>
<p>Perhaps other institutions vary (and the OU is, for the most part, a very good employer), but here&#8217;s an example of an institution for whom copyright matters a great deal but doesn&#8217;t apply it to research works.</p>
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		<title>By: Charlie B</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/04/22/absurd-academic-publishing-r.html#comment-1403072</link>
		<dc:creator>Charlie B</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Apr 2012 22:44:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=155935#comment-1403072</guid>
		<description> I&#039;ve heard your circular reasoning before, and am well aware of how willingly you misrepresent history.  No need to run the loop again.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p> I&#8217;ve heard your circular reasoning before, and am well aware of how willingly you misrepresent history.  No need to run the loop again.</p>
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		<title>By: Substance McGravitas</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/04/22/absurd-academic-publishing-r.html#comment-1402819</link>
		<dc:creator>Substance McGravitas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Apr 2012 18:33:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=155935#comment-1402819</guid>
		<description>This from Harvard seems relevant here:

http://isites.harvard.edu/icb/icb.do?keyword=k77982&amp;tabgroupid=icb.tabgroup143448
&lt;blockquote&gt;We write to communicate an untenable situation facing the Harvard Library. Many large journal publishers have made the scholarly communication environment fiscally unsustainable and academically restrictive. This situation is exacerbated by efforts of certain publishers (called “providers”) to acquire, bundle, and increase the pricing on journals.&lt;/blockquote&gt; </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This from Harvard seems relevant here:</p>
<p><a href="http://isites.harvard.edu/icb/icb.do?keyword=k77982&#038;tabgroupid=icb.tabgroup143448" rel="nofollow">http://isites.harvard.edu/icb/icb.do?keyword=k77982&#038;tabgroupid=icb.tabgroup143448</a></p>
<blockquote><p>We write to communicate an untenable situation facing the Harvard Library. Many large journal publishers have made the scholarly communication environment fiscally unsustainable and academically restrictive. This situation is exacerbated by efforts of certain publishers (called “providers”) to acquire, bundle, and increase the pricing on journals.</p></blockquote>
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		<title>By: Ito Kagehisa</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/04/22/absurd-academic-publishing-r.html#comment-1402718</link>
		<dc:creator>Ito Kagehisa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Apr 2012 17:05:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=155935#comment-1402718</guid>
		<description> What?  Academic journals don&#039;t do &quot;factchecking&quot; - that&#039;s part of what peer reviewers are supposed to do.

Hmmm... I see you&#039;re talking about humanities, though - my experience is in hard sciences.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p> What?  Academic journals don&#8217;t do &#8220;factchecking&#8221; &#8211; that&#8217;s part of what peer reviewers are supposed to do.</p>
<p>Hmmm&#8230; I see you&#8217;re talking about humanities, though &#8211; my experience is in hard sciences.</p>
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		<title>By: eeyore</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/04/22/absurd-academic-publishing-r.html#comment-1402599</link>
		<dc:creator>eeyore</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Apr 2012 15:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=155935#comment-1402599</guid>
		<description>Ummmm, allocate money for that expense in your grant request?  Problem solved.    You spend no un-budgeted money, and still get to feel all warm and fuzzy for contributing to the betterment of humanity and the sum total of human knowledge available to those of us who live and work OUTSIDE the hallowed halls of academia.  

As for a &quot;top tier venue&quot;, I&#039;m a bit confused.  Are you saying that your colleagues don&#039;t read open access journals?  Are you somehow prevented from &quot;getting points&quot; because of it?  Is your field really so archaic that articles don&#039;t get read unless they are in the dead tree version in the faculty bathroom?  

I&#039;m being sarcastic, but I would like to understand how it is that you would get fewer or lower quality readers because of it.  Are reputable open access journals exempt from peer review?  Is there some misperception ( or accurate perception ) that they contain lower quality research?  How, exactly, does a smaller audience for your work benefit you in any way other than &quot;Published in XX journal&quot; on your CV at conferences?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ummmm, allocate money for that expense in your grant request?  Problem solved.    You spend no un-budgeted money, and still get to feel all warm and fuzzy for contributing to the betterment of humanity and the sum total of human knowledge available to those of us who live and work OUTSIDE the hallowed halls of academia.  </p>
<p>As for a &#8220;top tier venue&#8221;, I&#8217;m a bit confused.  Are you saying that your colleagues don&#8217;t read open access journals?  Are you somehow prevented from &#8220;getting points&#8221; because of it?  Is your field really so archaic that articles don&#8217;t get read unless they are in the dead tree version in the faculty bathroom?  </p>
<p>I&#8217;m being sarcastic, but I would like to understand how it is that you would get fewer or lower quality readers because of it.  Are reputable open access journals exempt from peer review?  Is there some misperception ( or accurate perception ) that they contain lower quality research?  How, exactly, does a smaller audience for your work benefit you in any way other than &#8220;Published in XX journal&#8221; on your CV at conferences?</p>
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		<title>By: Kimmo</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/04/22/absurd-academic-publishing-r.html#comment-1402560</link>
		<dc:creator>Kimmo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Apr 2012 13:46:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=155935#comment-1402560</guid>
		<description>Sounds like a job for a decent socialist government.

Heil five!

http://28.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lg0wgbJ2NW1qaa4h7o1_r3_500.gif</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sounds like a job for a decent socialist government.</p>
<p>Heil five!</p>
<p><a href="http://28.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lg0wgbJ2NW1qaa4h7o1_r3_500.gif" rel="nofollow">http://28.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lg0wgbJ2NW1qaa4h7o1_r3_500.gif</a></p>
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		<title>By: Kimmo</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/04/22/absurd-academic-publishing-r.html#comment-1402559</link>
		<dc:creator>Kimmo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Apr 2012 13:44:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=155935#comment-1402559</guid>
		<description> Surely wide distribution at a trivial cost would result in a few papers making a lot more money than everything distrubuted narrowly at a high cost.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p> Surely wide distribution at a trivial cost would result in a few papers making a lot more money than everything distrubuted narrowly at a high cost.</p>
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		<title>By: Timothy Krause</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/04/22/absurd-academic-publishing-r.html#comment-1402542</link>
		<dc:creator>Timothy Krause</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Apr 2012 12:59:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=155935#comment-1402542</guid>
		<description>Um, there are nonprofit academic publishers. At least, that&#039;s what they put on their websites. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Um, there are nonprofit academic publishers. At least, that&#8217;s what they put on their websites. </p>
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		<title>By: Timothy Krause</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/04/22/absurd-academic-publishing-r.html#comment-1402541</link>
		<dc:creator>Timothy Krause</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Apr 2012 12:57:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=155935#comment-1402541</guid>
		<description>Actually, none of that labor is free. I&#039;m talking about factchecking, copyediting, proofreading, rights clearance assistance, etc. Generally, authors&#039; don&#039;t sign off on their work as editors of that work, at least not at the journals where I&#039;ve worked. A second or third look is needed, and that&#039;s generally left to an editorial type. Scholarship, jurying, etc. are done as you describe. Believe me, tenured humanities professors aren&#039;t going to spend hours playing &quot;hunt the spurious comma.&quot;

It&#039;s possible, of course, to crowdsource even these remaining things. But I don&#039;t think that&#039;s currently standard editorial practice. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Actually, none of that labor is free. I&#8217;m talking about factchecking, copyediting, proofreading, rights clearance assistance, etc. Generally, authors&#8217; don&#8217;t sign off on their work as editors of that work, at least not at the journals where I&#8217;ve worked. A second or third look is needed, and that&#8217;s generally left to an editorial type. Scholarship, jurying, etc. are done as you describe. Believe me, tenured humanities professors aren&#8217;t going to spend hours playing &#8220;hunt the spurious comma.&#8221;</p>
<p>It&#8217;s possible, of course, to crowdsource even these remaining things. But I don&#8217;t think that&#8217;s currently standard editorial practice. </p>
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		<title>By: johnmitchell1963</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/04/22/absurd-academic-publishing-r.html#comment-1402500</link>
		<dc:creator>johnmitchell1963</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Apr 2012 09:09:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=155935#comment-1402500</guid>
		<description>Academic publishing is far worse than the trades, and both have to worry these days. Peer Review digital sites are becoming more popular, and shall gain cache after a time. 

I watched hardcover &amp; paperback prices steadily rise through the &#039;80s &amp; &#039;90s. Inflation, production costs, editorial salaries all had a play to this. Now digital takes away quite a bit of that -- even editorial salaries, if authors chose to hire from outside the establishment. Meanwhile, the authors have finally gotten their chance to make money off of their work. I&#039;m not talking about the blockbuster darlings of fiction &amp; nonfiction. The vast majority of writers get a miserly contract from the traditional publishers, and then get zero marketing/ promotional help for their books. No wonder these don&#039;t sell well. 

Book prices now and in the future, as digital products, will move up and down depending on the value readers place on their favorite authors&#039; new or backlisted books. Hurray for the writers! Meanwhile, the book publishers are basically getting what they deserve, for all their greediness (treating writers as employees and oftentimes far worse) and for their poor business acumen.

Mark Beyer
Author of &quot;The Village Wit&quot;
and &quot;What Beauty&quot; (June 2012)
blogs at www.bibliogrind.com </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Academic publishing is far worse than the trades, and both have to worry these days. Peer Review digital sites are becoming more popular, and shall gain cache after a time. </p>
<p>I watched hardcover &amp; paperback prices steadily rise through the &#8217;80s &amp; &#8217;90s. Inflation, production costs, editorial salaries all had a play to this. Now digital takes away quite a bit of that &#8212; even editorial salaries, if authors chose to hire from outside the establishment. Meanwhile, the authors have finally gotten their chance to make money off of their work. I&#8217;m not talking about the blockbuster darlings of fiction &amp; nonfiction. The vast majority of writers get a miserly contract from the traditional publishers, and then get zero marketing/ promotional help for their books. No wonder these don&#8217;t sell well. </p>
<p>Book prices now and in the future, as digital products, will move up and down depending on the value readers place on their favorite authors&#8217; new or backlisted books. Hurray for the writers! Meanwhile, the book publishers are basically getting what they deserve, for all their greediness (treating writers as employees and oftentimes far worse) and for their poor business acumen.</p>
<p>Mark Beyer<br />
Author of &#8220;The Village Wit&#8221;<br />
and &#8220;What Beauty&#8221; (June 2012)<br />
blogs at <a href="http://www.bibliogrind.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.bibliogrind.com</a> </p>
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		<title>By: Jan Velterop</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/04/22/absurd-academic-publishing-r.html#comment-1402478</link>
		<dc:creator>Jan Velterop</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Apr 2012 07:37:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=155935#comment-1402478</guid>
		<description>Academic publishers, particularly journal publishers, are not really in the business of publishing, ironically enough. The business they are in is one of furthering scientific careers. The communication of scientific results can easily take place without the publishers or journals (see arXiv.org, for instance). But survival in the academic &#039;ego-system&#039; is very hard without the formal publication in  journals, preferably those with high &#039;impact factors&#039;. The key to change is in the hands of the scientific community and its subculture and mores. The &#039;publishers&#039; (they should be called &#039;formalisers&#039; of scientific literature) are just picking up the money that the scientific community throws in front of them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Academic publishers, particularly journal publishers, are not really in the business of publishing, ironically enough. The business they are in is one of furthering scientific careers. The communication of scientific results can easily take place without the publishers or journals (see arXiv.org, for instance). But survival in the academic &#8216;ego-system&#8217; is very hard without the formal publication in  journals, preferably those with high &#8216;impact factors&#8217;. The key to change is in the hands of the scientific community and its subculture and mores. The &#8216;publishers&#8217; (they should be called &#8216;formalisers&#8217; of scientific literature) are just picking up the money that the scientific community throws in front of them.</p>
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		<title>By: Marc45</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/04/22/absurd-academic-publishing-r.html#comment-1402433</link>
		<dc:creator>Marc45</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Apr 2012 04:58:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=155935#comment-1402433</guid>
		<description> This kind of publishing should be done by non-profits with oversight and public accountability.   They could pay their employees reasonably and still get the (already paid for) information to the public and everyone would be served well.

Oh wait, this makes too much sense!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p> This kind of publishing should be done by non-profits with oversight and public accountability.   They could pay their employees reasonably and still get the (already paid for) information to the public and everyone would be served well.</p>
<p>Oh wait, this makes too much sense!</p>
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		<title>By: Cory Doctorow</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/04/22/absurd-academic-publishing-r.html#comment-1402420</link>
		<dc:creator>Cory Doctorow</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Apr 2012 04:42:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=155935#comment-1402420</guid>
		<description> Almost all the labor you describe here is provided, gratis, to the publishers. The scholarship is paid for by institutions. The jurying is done on a volunteer basis.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p> Almost all the labor you describe here is provided, gratis, to the publishers. The scholarship is paid for by institutions. The jurying is done on a volunteer basis.</p>
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		<title>By: Cory Doctorow</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/04/22/absurd-academic-publishing-r.html#comment-1402421</link>
		<dc:creator>Cory Doctorow</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Apr 2012 04:42:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=155935#comment-1402421</guid>
		<description> Indeed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p> Indeed.</p>
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		<title>By: Ale</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/04/22/absurd-academic-publishing-r.html#comment-1402417</link>
		<dc:creator>Ale</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Apr 2012 04:39:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=155935#comment-1402417</guid>
		<description>Indeed, this whole piece hinges on the statement &quot;Many scholars sign work-made-for-hire deals with the universities that employ them&quot; which is not substantiated by any fact or data, or even anecdotal evidence.

It _is_ true that generally, any intellectual output created by the employee of an organization that is a product of his job and created on the boss&#039; time, is deemed the intellectual property of the organization rather than of the employee. But to my knowledge that is more grounded in common law than in legislation or employment agreements (which hardly ever touch the subject), and I would argue that a judge would not necessarily consider an academic researcher to be subject to the same copyright considerations as a corporate employee. After all, a researcher is often paid out of project-specific grants provided by another funding agency than the university itself, and that makes it a different type of work relationship.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Indeed, this whole piece hinges on the statement &#8220;Many scholars sign work-made-for-hire deals with the universities that employ them&#8221; which is not substantiated by any fact or data, or even anecdotal evidence.</p>
<p>It _is_ true that generally, any intellectual output created by the employee of an organization that is a product of his job and created on the boss&#8217; time, is deemed the intellectual property of the organization rather than of the employee. But to my knowledge that is more grounded in common law than in legislation or employment agreements (which hardly ever touch the subject), and I would argue that a judge would not necessarily consider an academic researcher to be subject to the same copyright considerations as a corporate employee. After all, a researcher is often paid out of project-specific grants provided by another funding agency than the university itself, and that makes it a different type of work relationship.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Runge</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/04/22/absurd-academic-publishing-r.html#comment-1402377</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Runge</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Apr 2012 02:30:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=155935#comment-1402377</guid>
		<description> The thing to do is get tenure and review policies changed so that impact factor isn&#039;t the sole measure of effectiveness of dissemination. Because it&#039;s actually a pretty crappy measure of that anyway, and adding other measures (such as download counts) would both do a better job measuring influence AND support such things as depositing to university electronic repositories.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p> The thing to do is get tenure and review policies changed so that impact factor isn&#8217;t the sole measure of effectiveness of dissemination. Because it&#8217;s actually a pretty crappy measure of that anyway, and adding other measures (such as download counts) would both do a better job measuring influence AND support such things as depositing to university electronic repositories.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Runge</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/04/22/absurd-academic-publishing-r.html#comment-1402373</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Runge</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Apr 2012 02:26:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=155935#comment-1402373</guid>
		<description>Directory of FREE open access scholarly journals:  http://www.doaj.org/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Directory of FREE open access scholarly journals:  <a href="http://www.doaj.org/" rel="nofollow">http://www.doaj.org/</a></p>
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		<title>By: Steve Runge</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/04/22/absurd-academic-publishing-r.html#comment-1402372</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Runge</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Apr 2012 02:20:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=155935#comment-1402372</guid>
		<description> The fact that academics don&#039;t know what the library pays for journal subscriptions is well-known by librarians. In fact, that&#039;s the basis for shifting the burden of payment to the author/funder, to avoid precisely that moral hazard. Believe me, librarians are working their kiesters off to make OA easier for the laziest of the lazy. It just takes a while to get everyone rowing at the same time and in the same direction. The trouble spots: 1. every journal has a different policy regarding copyright. If we&#039;re going to help lazybones professors put their pre-prints in publicly available electronic repositories, we&#039;ll need either a) unambiguous language inserted forcibly into all publishing contracts giving universities first rights or b) a whonking big updated database of publishers&#039; contract language regarding repositories. 2. Prof&#039;s don&#039;t know, for the most part, how close this system is to collapse, and just how thoroughly publishers have libraries over a barrel. 3. Tenure and promotion review policies that are based almost exclusively on impact factor are basically a sop to Elsevier and other big publishers. If T &amp; P review policies were also to include download counts of repository articles or other measures of dissemination &amp; influence, tenure-track publishing behavior would broaden into open access.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p> The fact that academics don&#8217;t know what the library pays for journal subscriptions is well-known by librarians. In fact, that&#8217;s the basis for shifting the burden of payment to the author/funder, to avoid precisely that moral hazard. Believe me, librarians are working their kiesters off to make OA easier for the laziest of the lazy. It just takes a while to get everyone rowing at the same time and in the same direction. The trouble spots: 1. every journal has a different policy regarding copyright. If we&#8217;re going to help lazybones professors put their pre-prints in publicly available electronic repositories, we&#8217;ll need either a) unambiguous language inserted forcibly into all publishing contracts giving universities first rights or b) a whonking big updated database of publishers&#8217; contract language regarding repositories. 2. Prof&#8217;s don&#8217;t know, for the most part, how close this system is to collapse, and just how thoroughly publishers have libraries over a barrel. 3. Tenure and promotion review policies that are based almost exclusively on impact factor are basically a sop to Elsevier and other big publishers. If T &amp; P review policies were also to include download counts of repository articles or other measures of dissemination &amp; influence, tenure-track publishing behavior would broaden into open access.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Runge</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/04/22/absurd-academic-publishing-r.html#comment-1402364</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Runge</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Apr 2012 01:59:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=155935#comment-1402364</guid>
		<description>Two points: 1. paid open access shifts the cost from reader to *funder* of authors, not simply to authors. Very few authors actually pay out of pocket; it&#039;s coming from grants and from universities. This is at least better than putting the onus on libraries, which have little bargaining power against the rapacious cost increases. Universities and large gov&#039;t granting agencies won&#039;t stand for bearing huge increases in publication fees &amp; have the power to negotiate. 2. the other option for open access is university electronic repositories. These aren&#039;t free, either (the university still has to pay staff to check and input metadata, install and babysit fussy open-source repository software, etc...), and they&#039;re still in early stages, but MIT&#039;s has had millions of downloads since it began less than a decade ago. Quite a few US universities (Including MIT, Harvard, Duke, U. Michigan) have recently created open access mandates, in which the author grants the university first rights to publish pre-print manuscripts, and requires authors to add a rider to that effect to publishing contracts. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Two points: 1. paid open access shifts the cost from reader to *funder* of authors, not simply to authors. Very few authors actually pay out of pocket; it&#8217;s coming from grants and from universities. This is at least better than putting the onus on libraries, which have little bargaining power against the rapacious cost increases. Universities and large gov&#8217;t granting agencies won&#8217;t stand for bearing huge increases in publication fees &amp; have the power to negotiate. 2. the other option for open access is university electronic repositories. These aren&#8217;t free, either (the university still has to pay staff to check and input metadata, install and babysit fussy open-source repository software, etc&#8230;), and they&#8217;re still in early stages, but MIT&#8217;s has had millions of downloads since it began less than a decade ago. Quite a few US universities (Including MIT, Harvard, Duke, U. Michigan) have recently created open access mandates, in which the author grants the university first rights to publish pre-print manuscripts, and requires authors to add a rider to that effect to publishing contracts. </p>
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		<title>By: pjcamp</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/04/22/absurd-academic-publishing-r.html#comment-1402363</link>
		<dc:creator>pjcamp</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Apr 2012 01:49:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=155935#comment-1402363</guid>
		<description>&quot;Here&#039;s an interesting wrinkle I&#039;ve encountered in a few places. Many scholars sign work-made-for-hire deals with the universities that employ them.&quot;

I don&#039;t know where you&#039;ve seen that. I&#039;ve worked at four institutions and never had to sign away copyright.

They are, however, very interested in patents. Because that means money and publications don&#039;t.
 </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Here&#8217;s an interesting wrinkle I&#8217;ve encountered in a few places. Many scholars sign work-made-for-hire deals with the universities that employ them.&#8221;</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t know where you&#8217;ve seen that. I&#8217;ve worked at four institutions and never had to sign away copyright.</p>
<p>They are, however, very interested in patents. Because that means money and publications don&#8217;t.</p>
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		<title>By: Jonathan Badger</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/04/22/absurd-academic-publishing-r.html#comment-1402351</link>
		<dc:creator>Jonathan Badger</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Apr 2012 00:53:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=155935#comment-1402351</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s true that the trinity of Science/Nature/Cell (all closed access) has the highest impact factors, but the typical closed access journal doesn&#039;t really have that high of an impact factor. The linked article mentions Elsevier&#039;s &quot;Tetrahedron&quot; as being supposedly a highly ranked journal, yet apparently it only has an an impact factor of 3.011. Even PLoS ONE, an open access journal sometimes unfairly stereotyped as an &quot;anything goes&quot; journal (its policy is to publish sound science regardless of perceived novelty or importance), has an impact factor of 4.3.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s true that the trinity of Science/Nature/Cell (all closed access) has the highest impact factors, but the typical closed access journal doesn&#8217;t really have that high of an impact factor. The linked article mentions Elsevier&#8217;s &#8220;Tetrahedron&#8221; as being supposedly a highly ranked journal, yet apparently it only has an an impact factor of 3.011. Even PLoS ONE, an open access journal sometimes unfairly stereotyped as an &#8220;anything goes&#8221; journal (its policy is to publish sound science regardless of perceived novelty or importance), has an impact factor of 4.3.</p>
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		<title>By: avraamov</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/04/22/absurd-academic-publishing-r.html#comment-1402344</link>
		<dc:creator>avraamov</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Apr 2012 00:34:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=155935#comment-1402344</guid>
		<description>I just had a look at what you post on twitter, and you talk about democracy now, the occupy movement, the US spying on its citizens, etc. What you&#039;re proposing is that the general ebb and flow of culture, politics, aesthetics - that you yourself seem interested in - should just go on unexamined by people that are simply ill-mannered enough to analyse such things on a level above that which you&#039;re comfortable with. And because you&#039;re uncomfortable with it, they definitely shouldn&#039;t communicate those ideas to others for money, which obviously needs to be set aside for activities which occur in some mythical culture-free world.
If you&#039;re unable to imagine even a single mechanism whereby scholarly research into culture has beneficial societal effects, then you really should seek out a place on the planet where such things don&#039;t exist, and so won&#039;t bother you. I certainly won&#039;t be joining you. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I just had a look at what you post on twitter, and you talk about democracy now, the occupy movement, the US spying on its citizens, etc. What you&#8217;re proposing is that the general ebb and flow of culture, politics, aesthetics &#8211; that you yourself seem interested in &#8211; should just go on unexamined by people that are simply ill-mannered enough to analyse such things on a level above that which you&#8217;re comfortable with. And because you&#8217;re uncomfortable with it, they definitely shouldn&#8217;t communicate those ideas to others for money, which obviously needs to be set aside for activities which occur in some mythical culture-free world.<br />
If you&#8217;re unable to imagine even a single mechanism whereby scholarly research into culture has beneficial societal effects, then you really should seek out a place on the planet where such things don&#8217;t exist, and so won&#8217;t bother you. I certainly won&#8217;t be joining you. </p>
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		<title>By: Jonathan Badger</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/04/22/absurd-academic-publishing-r.html#comment-1402342</link>
		<dc:creator>Jonathan Badger</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Apr 2012 00:31:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=155935#comment-1402342</guid>
		<description>There are plenty of open access journals that are peer reviewed. I happen to be an academic editor on two of them. I&#039;m talking about the &quot;common wisdom&quot; that if you don&#039;t publish in closed access journals like Cell or Nature your career is screwed. 

As for the eugenics question, my point was that quite early on, actual *geneticists* realized that the goal of eliminating supposed undesirable traits by controlling who could reproduce or not was impossible as there would be many carriers that wouldn&#039;t display the trait yet could pass it on. I&#039;m just tired of people blaming geneticists for eugenics when it general it was non-scientists who were the actual proponents of it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There are plenty of open access journals that are peer reviewed. I happen to be an academic editor on two of them. I&#8217;m talking about the &#8220;common wisdom&#8221; that if you don&#8217;t publish in closed access journals like Cell or Nature your career is screwed. </p>
<p>As for the eugenics question, my point was that quite early on, actual *geneticists* realized that the goal of eliminating supposed undesirable traits by controlling who could reproduce or not was impossible as there would be many carriers that wouldn&#8217;t display the trait yet could pass it on. I&#8217;m just tired of people blaming geneticists for eugenics when it general it was non-scientists who were the actual proponents of it.</p>
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		<title>By: Alf Seegert</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/04/22/absurd-academic-publishing-r.html#comment-1402332</link>
		<dc:creator>Alf Seegert</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 22 Apr 2012 23:41:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=155935#comment-1402332</guid>
		<description>&lt;a HREF=&quot;http://tolkienandfantasy.blogspot.com/2012/04/publishing-mordor-style.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Here&#039;s a case study of how good people get badly treated under this system of &quot;Publishing Mordor-Style.&quot;&lt;/A&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a HREF="http://tolkienandfantasy.blogspot.com/2012/04/publishing-mordor-style.html" rel="nofollow">Here&#8217;s a case study of how good people get badly treated under this system of &#8220;Publishing Mordor-Style.&#8221;</a></p>
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		<title>By: takurospirit</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/04/22/absurd-academic-publishing-r.html#comment-1402305</link>
		<dc:creator>takurospirit</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 22 Apr 2012 22:27:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=155935#comment-1402305</guid>
		<description>All I can say, being the self-centered lazy person that I am, that this annoys the crap out of me when I go on one of my googling binges about some disease or psychological condition (I think it&#039;s fun). I always run into a wall because eventually the information requires a paid subscription. And as I&#039;m no academic or medical professional I just sit there swearing at my screen.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>All I can say, being the self-centered lazy person that I am, that this annoys the crap out of me when I go on one of my googling binges about some disease or psychological condition (I think it&#8217;s fun). I always run into a wall because eventually the information requires a paid subscription. And as I&#8217;m no academic or medical professional I just sit there swearing at my screen.</p>
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		<title>By: eeyore</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/04/22/absurd-academic-publishing-r.html#comment-1402302</link>
		<dc:creator>eeyore</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 22 Apr 2012 22:12:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=155935#comment-1402302</guid>
		<description>That makes for a series of interesting questions.  Some of these may be simply due to my ignorance of academia.

1.
Is there a tenure requirement that someone write one or more textbooks?  I was aware of the aggressive journal publication requirements, but have a number of tenured acquaintances that have ( to my knowledge, anyway )never written a text book. 

2.
If there is no tenure track requirement, and it actually costs them money, why do it?  Or at a minimum, why not collaborate across the largest pool of colleagues possible to minimize the negative economic consequence of producing a ( presumably ) better or more useful text?  ( I economic terms, time spent writing a text book is time not spent writing grant proposals, or doing research work that *does* pay, so the difference in &quot;less than minimum wage&quot; and their research rate is money lost ).  

3.
If textbook authoring is so difficult and time consuming and unprofitable, why are they so consistently updated with new editions?  

The economist in me says that because, once the first edition is written, subsequent updates are &lt;b&gt;extremely&lt;/b&gt; economically efficient ( in terms of hours worked to income derived ), as each update kills the secondary market, and forces an entirely new captive audience to buy the book anew, multiplying his hourly rate by at least 1.5-1.7 for each subsequent edition, significantly more if the number of students requiring the text increased for each edition and the new edition contains little new material ( as often seems to be the case ). 
 
--added question--

4.
If textbook authorship is instead driven by non-economic factors - a labor of love or professional duty to advance the field - then why go through a traditional publisher at all unless it is for primary or secondary school students? ( in these markets, selection committees cannot be relied upon to have sufficient command of the material to make sound judgements, so the vetting of an established publisher has value )

Ebook and even vanity/on demand publishing can be had at a fraction of the cost of a textbook publisher, on more favorable terms, and in less time.  These channels do not preclude peer review, and the buying audience - other experts in your same subject matter - are more than qualified to judge the caliber of your work.  

My partner actually had a print management professor that composed a text book on binding and finishing from professional articles he had written across his career, and part of the class grade was binding and finishing their own textbook.   To this day, he regards it as one of the most valuable and useful educational experiences of his entire career, and he still uses it for reference on occasion.   

This does not begin to touch on the academic text book publishers, but it doesn&#039;t really have to.  I find it exceedingly unlikely that they ended up making minimum wage over the life of their books unless they were substandard, or there were significant other non-economic factors that motivated them.  In the face of non-economic factors, then whether or not they are being exploited by their publishers becomes a completely different question.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That makes for a series of interesting questions.  Some of these may be simply due to my ignorance of academia.</p>
<p>1.<br />
Is there a tenure requirement that someone write one or more textbooks?  I was aware of the aggressive journal publication requirements, but have a number of tenured acquaintances that have ( to my knowledge, anyway )never written a text book. </p>
<p>2.<br />
If there is no tenure track requirement, and it actually costs them money, why do it?  Or at a minimum, why not collaborate across the largest pool of colleagues possible to minimize the negative economic consequence of producing a ( presumably ) better or more useful text?  ( I economic terms, time spent writing a text book is time not spent writing grant proposals, or doing research work that *does* pay, so the difference in &#8220;less than minimum wage&#8221; and their research rate is money lost ).  </p>
<p>3.<br />
If textbook authoring is so difficult and time consuming and unprofitable, why are they so consistently updated with new editions?  </p>
<p>The economist in me says that because, once the first edition is written, subsequent updates are <b>extremely</b> economically efficient ( in terms of hours worked to income derived ), as each update kills the secondary market, and forces an entirely new captive audience to buy the book anew, multiplying his hourly rate by at least 1.5-1.7 for each subsequent edition, significantly more if the number of students requiring the text increased for each edition and the new edition contains little new material ( as often seems to be the case ). </p>
<p>&#8211;added question&#8211;</p>
<p>4.<br />
If textbook authorship is instead driven by non-economic factors &#8211; a labor of love or professional duty to advance the field &#8211; then why go through a traditional publisher at all unless it is for primary or secondary school students? ( in these markets, selection committees cannot be relied upon to have sufficient command of the material to make sound judgements, so the vetting of an established publisher has value )</p>
<p>Ebook and even vanity/on demand publishing can be had at a fraction of the cost of a textbook publisher, on more favorable terms, and in less time.  These channels do not preclude peer review, and the buying audience &#8211; other experts in your same subject matter &#8211; are more than qualified to judge the caliber of your work.  </p>
<p>My partner actually had a print management professor that composed a text book on binding and finishing from professional articles he had written across his career, and part of the class grade was binding and finishing their own textbook.   To this day, he regards it as one of the most valuable and useful educational experiences of his entire career, and he still uses it for reference on occasion.   </p>
<p>This does not begin to touch on the academic text book publishers, but it doesn&#8217;t really have to.  I find it exceedingly unlikely that they ended up making minimum wage over the life of their books unless they were substandard, or there were significant other non-economic factors that motivated them.  In the face of non-economic factors, then whether or not they are being exploited by their publishers becomes a completely different question.</p>
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		<title>By: eeyore</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/04/22/absurd-academic-publishing-r.html#comment-1402291</link>
		<dc:creator>eeyore</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 22 Apr 2012 21:38:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=155935#comment-1402291</guid>
		<description>Free is relative.  The access fees the publishers charge are not based on any unavoidable degree of overhead or direct costs.  The costs that they bear above and beyond any other publisher are primarily the research costs, and the peer review costs - and they pay for neither.

If their printing, indexing, hosting, binding and distribution costs are really that high, then it is because of a failure of the business to remain current with technology and industry norms, NOT because the process is properly, or inherently expensive.  Further, open access provisions do not necessarily require that such things be completely free to all comers, or in all formats.  

Having worked extensively in both printing and as a web monkey, I can tell you for certain that the &quot;costs&quot; associated with producing a PDF from a preflight press file are nearly non-existent, and such a file would meet any of the open access standards in effect today. Ebooks may carry additional overhead, I&#039;ve not dealt with them - but since an open access work has no reason to carry DRM, it really shouldn&#039;t be any more complex than distilling a pdf.  

In terms of hosting and search, there is the cost to set up a decent CMS, but once set up, the &lt;b&gt;additional&lt;/b&gt; overhead of updating and maintaining it would be at most 1-2 employees - and only that if the volume was tremendously high. Once installed and configured, the patching, management and administration a properly implemented CMS should add only trivial overhead to your existing maintenance developers and sys admins.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Free is relative.  The access fees the publishers charge are not based on any unavoidable degree of overhead or direct costs.  The costs that they bear above and beyond any other publisher are primarily the research costs, and the peer review costs &#8211; and they pay for neither.</p>
<p>If their printing, indexing, hosting, binding and distribution costs are really that high, then it is because of a failure of the business to remain current with technology and industry norms, NOT because the process is properly, or inherently expensive.  Further, open access provisions do not necessarily require that such things be completely free to all comers, or in all formats.  </p>
<p>Having worked extensively in both printing and as a web monkey, I can tell you for certain that the &#8220;costs&#8221; associated with producing a PDF from a preflight press file are nearly non-existent, and such a file would meet any of the open access standards in effect today. Ebooks may carry additional overhead, I&#8217;ve not dealt with them &#8211; but since an open access work has no reason to carry DRM, it really shouldn&#8217;t be any more complex than distilling a pdf.  </p>
<p>In terms of hosting and search, there is the cost to set up a decent CMS, but once set up, the <b>additional</b> overhead of updating and maintaining it would be at most 1-2 employees &#8211; and only that if the volume was tremendously high. Once installed and configured, the patching, management and administration a properly implemented CMS should add only trivial overhead to your existing maintenance developers and sys admins.</p>
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