Comments on: Armenian political rally ends in tragedy when political hydrogen balloons burst into flames

By: Sean Nelson

Sean Nelson — Thu, 10 May 2012 16:10:00 +0000

You really sparked a punny thread here.

By: Sean Nelson

Sean Nelson — Thu, 10 May 2012 16:09:00 +0000

Also, kids, check your HCl percentage on the label. The Works with the blue cap is at least twice the concentration of any of the competitors I could find in my local department store.

By: Sean Nelson

Sean Nelson — Thu, 10 May 2012 16:06:00 +0000

Geeze, BombBlastLightningWaltz, what a downer. I prefer the big loopy helix idea.

By: Seth Gallmeyer

Seth Gallmeyer — Wed, 09 May 2012 14:28:00 +0000

Yes, but the stockpiles are running out and much of the supply of helium is being diverted to the LHC. Helium is getting stupid expensive right now.

By: IsaacR

IsaacR — Mon, 07 May 2012 17:32:00 +0000

Hindenburg was filled with hydrogen because the only Helium available in the world was located in America. The defense industry put an embargo on it since it was necessary to fill America’s rigid airships of the time(Not blimps. The Hindenburg isn’t a blimp either. It’s a zeppelin). At that point in time helium was so scarce that most of it could actually be found stored in the rigid airships themselves. The second airship ever to be filled with helium actually had to use helium siphoned off another helium filled airship. And yes, the aircraft dope which was used on the Hindenburg was in fact very flammable.

Second, doesn’t hydrogen burn at a fairly low temperature? It is my understanding that it cannot burn you, at least that’s what I’ve been told. I’m no scientist here. It would be the latex that burns you.

By: Guest

Guest — Mon, 07 May 2012 12:47:00 +0000

Why would that matter? Either side can “arrange” some balloons.

By: Kimmo

Kimmo — Mon, 07 May 2012 05:04:00 +0000

Although a fairly decent rule of thumb, too many folks heeding it are apt to let a great deal of malice go unanswered.

Plus, it’s a blurry line; what’s altruism if not enlightened self-interest?

By: Kimmo

Kimmo — Mon, 07 May 2012 05:01:00 +0000

I’d be inclined to concur if it wasn’t a rally for the incumbent.

By: Kimmo

Kimmo — Mon, 07 May 2012 04:58:00 +0000

My favourite scifi flick in quite a while.

Currently experiencing goosebumps remembering it. The music was bloody excellent.

By: IRMO

IRMO — Mon, 07 May 2012 02:33:00 +0000

A careful mix of helium and nitrogen will give your balloon enough bouyancy without the risk.

That said, I WOULD prefer to use hydrogen since balloons are an incredibly frivolous use of helium. But, if you go that route, you do need to keep the balloons high enough not to burn people. Even so, this incident doesn’t look all that bad.

By: John Harrison

John Harrison — Mon, 07 May 2012 00:25:00 +0000

It floats just fine. In the correct ratio it is still one third hydrogen. And yes, you see a big flash. A balloon of pure hydrogen on the other hand produces an orange fireball in my experience.

By: John Harrison

John Harrison — Mon, 07 May 2012 00:21:00 +0000

If you have a flame the oxygen in the atmosphere will be enough to sustain complete combustion of a balloon full of hydrogen.

We used to fill balloons up with pure hydrogen all the time in high school physics class and light them indoors. Not a big deal. You get a big WHOOSH and that is it. Large orange fireball and then nothing.

Now if you fill a balloon with some hydrogen and then add oxygen you can get a big bang. We filled a giant (4 foot diameter) balloon with oxygen in high school, took it out to the parking lot, attached a fuse, lit it and let go. The thing took off into the air and twenty seconds later there was a huge BOOM. That could have done some damage had it been near something.

By: Jan Angevine

Jan Angevine — Sun, 06 May 2012 21:35:00 +0000

The Armenians are an unlucky lot.

By: Michael R. Johnston

Michael R. Johnston — Sun, 06 May 2012 19:11:00 +0000

I recall watching a documentary on the Hindenberg where they managed to get some of the original fabric from the same lot used on the Hindenburg that had been treated, but not put on the airframe, or something. It was placed in a frame and ignited with a spark, and burned like gasoline.

By: DevinC

DevinC — Sun, 06 May 2012 17:52:00 +0000

Do not ascribe to malice what can be adequately explained by stupidity.

By: DevinC

DevinC — Sun, 06 May 2012 17:50:00 +0000

I collect sweeping generalizations, and these are some of the biggest and most grand I have seen of recent. May I add them to my collection? I promise to take good care of them.

By: DevinC

DevinC — Sun, 06 May 2012 17:47:00 +0000

Mythbusters did an experiment on this, using a mini-Hindenburg filled with hydrogen (but no iron/aluminium doping), another filled with helium (with iron/aluminium coating) and a third with both hydrogen and iron/aluminium coating.

Seeing as their sample size was one in each case, the results may be somewhat suspect. But the Miniberg filled with helium burned far, far too slow. The Miniberg filled with hydrogen burned much quicker, with the last burning slightly quicker than the hydrogen-no-coating version.

What struck me most, however, was that the last simulation included a sparking effect, where the coating ignited and sometimes drifted away, very similar to that seen in the actual footage of the disaster. The conclusion I took away was that the coating played only a very small role in the disaster, though it did add interesting visuals.

1st Miniberg: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CpF9NlpkMrQ
2nd Miniberg: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SVup80IabHU
3rd Miniberg: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qos90wGlEXk

By: Roland

Roland — Sun, 06 May 2012 16:11:00 +0000

LMAO, I thought Armenians were supposed to be an intelligent people. You’d think all of the chess playing and the political lobbying in the U.S. would’ve prepared their minds to comprehend the risk of draping pure hydrogen balloons immediately above the heads of people at a political rally.

By: chrisspurgeon

chrisspurgeon — Sun, 06 May 2012 13:39:00 +0000

To conserve helium, I imagine you could mix it with some hydrogen, couldn’t you? What would be the highest hydrogen/helium ration you’d want to use where there would still be no danger of combustion?

By: Shawn H Corey

Shawn H Corey — Sun, 06 May 2012 12:30:00 +0000

Modern dirigibles use helium. Pre-war Germany used hydrogen because the US wouldn’t sell the the helium.

By: Shawn H Corey

Shawn H Corey — Sun, 06 May 2012 12:28:00 +0000

Most likely. Hydrogen burns with an almost-invisible flame. Those orange-coloured flames you see in the video are caused by burning carbon, from the balloons themselves.

By: Warren_Terra

Warren_Terra — Sun, 06 May 2012 11:44:00 +0000

Halloween_Jack, you may have missed a reference there.

In completely unrelated news, Moon is a fun movie.

By: Ultan

Ultan — Sun, 06 May 2012 09:01:00 +0000

There isn’t any blue flame visible in either, both are yellow, with some hints of red that might actually be violet. It would look quite different in a spectrogram, no doubt.

By: Genre Slur

Genre Slur — Sun, 06 May 2012 07:31:00 +0000

If this were a film, everyone would be pointing out the ‘goof’/revealing mistake of seeing a vehicle marked ‘Ambulance’. Though Armenia probably uses english words on their civic vehicles.

By: BBNinja

BBNinja — Sun, 06 May 2012 06:16:00 +0000

Good lord, that’s awful! Doesn’t Armenia have access to clowns with helium tanks?!

By: Bill Beaty

Bill Beaty — Sun, 06 May 2012 05:12:00 +0000

Lecture demo people know not to inflate/store hydrogen balloons. You must make them on site as needed, since the slightest electrostatic discharge will make them explode.

It’s possible to do H2 balloons safely by eliminating the static electric danger: by spraying them with detergent-water.

Rubbing balloons on your hair, or even letting them brush against your clothing …that’s only safe if your balloons are always inflated with helium.

By: D Wyatt

D Wyatt — Sun, 06 May 2012 04:48:00 +0000

Nope youre all wrong, H blew up and left, He flew away, and Li oxidized into nothing.

By: Joseph Francis

Joseph Francis — Sun, 06 May 2012 04:25:00 +0000

That reminds me…

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K-sUkPCEtEQ

By: nem0fazer

nem0fazer — Sun, 06 May 2012 04:01:00 +0000

Also in the 70s we scattered it around the stage before an evening performance of a school play we were involved in. I’d forgotten until this moment. A rare happy moment in a miserable school life in a UK public (private) school.

By: BombBlastLightingWaltz

BombBlastLightingWaltz — Sun, 06 May 2012 03:45:00 +0000

Or float away due to lost ambient attraction. The lack of gas matter extracted could lessens the moon’s whole mass, allowing it to drifts off, very slowly. Eventually, the waters would never tide with ebb and flow.