“32 million is a small percentage of the population? Gore and Bush were within a half million votes in 2000″
We aren’t talking election numbers here Antinous. We are talking population totals and the potential number of persons who cannot afford to obtain the documentation necessary to get an ID and the costs involved in providing the same. The problem with the motor voter laws is the burden placed on the indigent and the fact that it pretty much limits your voters to drivers. Giving away a free ID is a fine idea but you still have the burden on the indigent that needs to be addressed.

Finally, and this is critical, we would only need to provide voter IDs to those who register to vote (currently about 65% of citizens are registered). If that percentage stays consistent -and I believe it’s lower – then we are talking about 32 million we need to get ID’s to) And that, Antinous, is a rather small percentage of the population and a workable cost.

First of all, motor voter was the best idea that anyone’s come up with to get people to register. Rather than providing IDs to registered voters, we should provide free IDs so that people will come in and register to vote when they get that ID. The only objection to that is if you don’t want people to register and vote. Second, 32 million is a small percentage of the population? Gore and Bush were within a half million votes in 2000.

“Is there free housing so that you can provide an address?”
General delivery is available at any post office. But, I would say that whatever state employee/office that processes the voter registration could receive the documentation needed and provide the ID back to the person. No physical address should be needed. In fact, I would discourage the use of addresses, SSN, or any other information other than name, state of residence, and a photo.

The financial barriers are mostly imagined. We have about 50 mil living in poverty in the US. We can process a drivers license for less than $20. If we supply these voter IDs to those in poverty for free every 10 years, we are talking about a national budget increase of $100 mill per year. Or, $2 million per year per state. With a $3.6 trillion per year federal budget, I think we can find the cash to cover the expense.

Finally, and this is critical, we would only need to provide voter IDs to those who register to vote (currently about 65% of citizens are registered). If that percentage stays consistent -and I believe it’s lower – then we are talking about 32 million we need to get ID’s to) And that, Antinous, is a rather small percentage of the population and a workable cost.

That’s painfully close to FUD. Proving you are a citizen is not at all like allowing only land owners to vote.

Are driver’s licenses free? Are copies of birth certificates free? Is there free housing so that you can provide an address? These are all financial barriers to allowing the poor to participate in the electoral system.

What you may not realize is that we have organizations like Lulac which are heavily populated by LaRaza and and Aztlan movements. I know, from personal experience, that non-documented workers quite often vote in our local elections. I can’t see a reason this would not take place in a national election.

There is almost zero chance of being caught for voting illegally. There is no mechanism in place to prevent it. The reported numbers are meaningless. There is no way to know if a vote is legitimate or not without a voter ID system. In Texas, you simply fill out a form saying you are a citizen and that you have not been issued an ID or SSN. Put in an address of the area you want to cast your vote and mail it in. When voting day comes, you go to your chosen voting location, state your name, and vote. Anyone can do this. It’s not just undocumented and/or illegal immigrants who can benefit. Anyone wanting to swing an election can simply make up a few thousand fake (or real) names, register them all, and send people from voting location to voting location to place votes under those names.

I can also tell you that, for the most part, the Hispanic vote is a largely block vote – just not a party vote. However, and to all the partisans – hispanics (in my area) tend to vote on issue and not along party lines. It’s the idea that Hispanics always vote democrat that seems to be the myth. Hispanics are not stupid, despite what the Republicans and Democrats believe as evidenced by the childish way in which the Hispanic vote is treated.

Power entails an anti-democratic moral stance. I may have harped on this before, but check out The Iron Law of Institutions for more on this aspect of the American political condition.

sdmikev:
How much left wing voter suppression targeting right wing people have you seen in the last 40 years? Answer, zero.

Not Breitbarty enough?

Well played, sir!

Registered voters as it stands may be challenged by government but in this instance people are taking umbrage because the manner too strongly implies a political intent that makes the challenge illegitimate, and thus an illegitimate & illegal attempt to disenfranchise a citizen. Especially ignoring the Voting Rights Act.

If a polling official on the ground at a station only challenged predominantly Hispanic or persons the official knew or thought would vote a certain way, would you stand there and chuckle at the indignation of the voter just because they were able to prove themselves and vote? I didn’t think so. This is precisely the same on a grand scale.

The onus I mean is on the accuser to do so legitimately, whether the accusation would stand or not is beside the point.

But when the brand new shiny complex voting machines don’t have all the parts to work on election day (in the inner-city neighborhoods) but work just fine out in the white suburbs, or when you get to the polls and find you’ve been stricken from the rolls as an alleged felon, by some third-party contractor, you’ve met the quieter but more efficient Republican flavors of voter fraud.

There really are much more effective ways to rig an election than the traditional approaches of giving whiskey to bums in exchange for their vote or sending them to vote in the names of now-dead registered voters.  (Of course, in Florida, the zombie population may be a bit more frisky than in Chicago.)

You want the franchise? Get in the system.

That’s painfully close to only allowing property owners to vote.

Let us say that someone is not legally a resident of this country. How would a government go about proving such? It’s an impossible bar. To the government, the only “proof” of citizenship that they require is that you’re not listed in the appropriate database/records system. You want the franchise? Get in the system.

You may not like the outcomes or implication based on your social point of view or your desired political outcomes, but you won’t be allowed to play ball if you’re not in the club.

Yes, that policy does make the word convenience mean fake-convenience-why-don’t-I-just-renew-in-person-it-is-faster.

Back on point, those lists are not potential non-citizens any more than a complete list of all persons who had or have a license prior to 2010 or have not renewed since prior to 2010. That list is many millions of people. 

So their method is totally flawed, yet somehow they procured a much shorter list of mostly hispanic and Democrat voters with a large number of un-updated addresses among these, to send letters demanding proof of citizenship to. 

And doing what they are doing at this time, with unapproved, and decidedly flawed methodology, is a dual violation of the Voting Rights Act.

I understand how you wouldn’t want anyone to concern themselves with that, especially a vet who got caught up in a voter suppression campaign. 

There is no hope that these actions are not willful on the part of Florida officials. They’ve even been called out, yet they continue.

Nothing to see here folks, because it was all a big mistake and none of this should concern you because you are being needlessly inflamed by a biased sumbitch who could not have possibly learned anything more than 5 minutes of Google by me!