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	<title>Comments on: Insane, true energy fact of the&#160;day</title>
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	<description>Brain candy for Happy Mutants</description>
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		<title>By: Charlie B</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/08/31/insane-true-energy-fact-of-th.html#comment-1524998</link>
		<dc:creator>Charlie B</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Sep 2012 02:34:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=178922#comment-1524998</guid>
		<description> I haven&#039;t seen Burners characterized as long-term planners before.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p> I haven&#8217;t seen Burners characterized as long-term planners before.</p>
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		<title>By: Charlie B</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/08/31/insane-true-energy-fact-of-th.html#comment-1524997</link>
		<dc:creator>Charlie B</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Sep 2012 02:33:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=178922#comment-1524997</guid>
		<description>Weeeeellllll... here in &lt;em&gt;my&lt;/em&gt; building, the energy I use to pump water is part of the cost of &quot;powering my building&quot;.     How exactly is providing water different from providing light or TV?  I use electricity to do all three, and since I only need to pump it up about 25 feet it takes less power than my furnace blower.

PS:  California is not equal to the United States.  Just sayin&#039;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Weeeeellllll&#8230; here in <em>my</em> building, the energy I use to pump water is part of the cost of &#8220;powering my building&#8221;.     How exactly is providing water different from providing light or TV?  I use electricity to do all three, and since I only need to pump it up about 25 feet it takes less power than my furnace blower.</p>
<p>PS:  California is not equal to the United States.  Just sayin&#8217;.</p>
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		<title>By: bolamig</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/08/31/insane-true-energy-fact-of-th.html#comment-1524280</link>
		<dc:creator>bolamig</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Sep 2012 07:06:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=178922#comment-1524280</guid>
		<description>I was just at Burning Man where lots of people spent hundreds or thousands of dollars to power their projects from solar panels rather than spending tens of dollars on batteries.  These are the same people who would spend hundreds of dollars on a new exit sign to save tens of dollars in electricity costs.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was just at Burning Man where lots of people spent hundreds or thousands of dollars to power their projects from solar panels rather than spending tens of dollars on batteries.  These are the same people who would spend hundreds of dollars on a new exit sign to save tens of dollars in electricity costs.</p>
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		<title>By: Bill Heffner</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/08/31/insane-true-energy-fact-of-th.html#comment-1523696</link>
		<dc:creator>Bill Heffner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Sep 2012 14:24:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=178922#comment-1523696</guid>
		<description>&quot;In the United States, we use more energy powering our buildings—from the lights, to the heating, to the stuff we plug into the walls—than we use to do anything else. &quot;

False. We use more energy moving water from where nature put it to where we use it. In California, 57% of all energy is consumed pumping water.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;In the United States, we use more energy powering our buildings—from the lights, to the heating, to the stuff we plug into the walls—than we use to do anything else. &#8221;</p>
<p>False. We use more energy moving water from where nature put it to where we use it. In California, 57% of all energy is consumed pumping water.</p>
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		<title>By: Corey S. Vaughn</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/08/31/insane-true-energy-fact-of-th.html#comment-1523608</link>
		<dc:creator>Corey S. Vaughn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 01 Sep 2012 21:22:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=178922#comment-1523608</guid>
		<description>if flames are licking your heels, your already dead from smoke inhalation</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>if flames are licking your heels, your already dead from smoke inhalation</p>
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		<title>By: Charlie B</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/08/31/insane-true-energy-fact-of-th.html#comment-1523606</link>
		<dc:creator>Charlie B</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 01 Sep 2012 21:06:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=178922#comment-1523606</guid>
		<description>Check this out - if everything that has a switch that says &quot;off&quot; really turned off when you flipped that switch, the Texas cartel would have had to shut down &lt;em&gt;an entire extra power plant&lt;/em&gt; to create California&#039;s &lt;a href=&quot;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_electricity_crisis&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;fake energy crisis&lt;/a&gt;.

It&#039;s true!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Check this out &#8211; if everything that has a switch that says &#8220;off&#8221; really turned off when you flipped that switch, the Texas cartel would have had to shut down <em>an entire extra power plant</em> to create California&#8217;s <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_electricity_crisis" rel="nofollow">fake energy crisis</a>.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s true!</p>
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		<title>By: GyroMagician</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/08/31/insane-true-energy-fact-of-th.html#comment-1523415</link>
		<dc:creator>GyroMagician</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 01 Sep 2012 12:05:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=178922#comment-1523415</guid>
		<description>@ bcsizem - you need to test the battery under load. The voltage drops depending upon how much current is drawn. Maybe your kitchen scales draw much less current than the detector. A good way to test is the measure the battery voltage while it&#039;s connected to the detector - it will be lower than when measured with nothing connected.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ bcsizem &#8211; you need to test the battery under load. The voltage drops depending upon how much current is drawn. Maybe your kitchen scales draw much less current than the detector. A good way to test is the measure the battery voltage while it&#8217;s connected to the detector &#8211; it will be lower than when measured with nothing connected.</p>
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		<title>By: ImmutableMichael</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/08/31/insane-true-energy-fact-of-th.html#comment-1523227</link>
		<dc:creator>ImmutableMichael</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 01 Sep 2012 01:29:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=178922#comment-1523227</guid>
		<description> No</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p> No</p>
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		<title>By: tegrat</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/08/31/insane-true-energy-fact-of-th.html#comment-1523180</link>
		<dc:creator>tegrat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Aug 2012 23:38:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=178922#comment-1523180</guid>
		<description>350 watt per exit sign? that seems awfully high. I suspect the average is closer to 50, and going down as incandescents are being replaced. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>350 watt per exit sign? that seems awfully high. I suspect the average is closer to 50, and going down as incandescents are being replaced. </p>
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		<title>By: travtastic</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/08/31/insane-true-energy-fact-of-th.html#comment-1523035</link>
		<dc:creator>travtastic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Aug 2012 21:03:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=178922#comment-1523035</guid>
		<description>I was told by an OSHA rep that any new signs that need to be installed should also include green signs, and closer to ground level, since a sign above the door is the first thing to get covered up by smoke.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was told by an OSHA rep that any new signs that need to be installed should also include green signs, and closer to ground level, since a sign above the door is the first thing to get covered up by smoke.</p>
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		<title>By: lavardera</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/08/31/insane-true-energy-fact-of-th.html#comment-1522901</link>
		<dc:creator>lavardera</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Aug 2012 19:15:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=178922#comment-1522901</guid>
		<description>I think you are right. If you want it to happen, you structure the program so people can do it with no money down, and the energy savings pay the cost over a reasonable period of time. Then its a no brainer and everybody does it. But it also means it is almost sure to not be a profitable loan for the financier, which is why the government has to be the one to make it happen.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think you are right. If you want it to happen, you structure the program so people can do it with no money down, and the energy savings pay the cost over a reasonable period of time. Then its a no brainer and everybody does it. But it also means it is almost sure to not be a profitable loan for the financier, which is why the government has to be the one to make it happen.</p>
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		<title>By: Jay Yeman</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/08/31/insane-true-energy-fact-of-th.html#comment-1522874</link>
		<dc:creator>Jay Yeman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Aug 2012 19:04:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=178922#comment-1522874</guid>
		<description>...which is a shame because contractors are begging for work and construction prices are low.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8230;which is a shame because contractors are begging for work and construction prices are low.</p>
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		<title>By: arnold</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/08/31/insane-true-energy-fact-of-th.html#comment-1522860</link>
		<dc:creator>arnold</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Aug 2012 18:56:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=178922#comment-1522860</guid>
		<description>the financing aspect is the one area that is missing in the equation.   we do energy audits, show the customer that they will get a payback in 2 years with the power company kicking in a rebate to pay for a big portion of the job.  but the job never goes anywhere because they don&#039;t have the cash to outlay.     I am talking commercial jobs, not residential.   </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>the financing aspect is the one area that is missing in the equation.   we do energy audits, show the customer that they will get a payback in 2 years with the power company kicking in a rebate to pay for a big portion of the job.  but the job never goes anywhere because they don&#8217;t have the cash to outlay.     I am talking commercial jobs, not residential.   </p>
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		<title>By: arnold</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/08/31/insane-true-energy-fact-of-th.html#comment-1522843</link>
		<dc:creator>arnold</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Aug 2012 18:47:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=178922#comment-1522843</guid>
		<description>It depends,  The current programs offered where I am are from incentives from the govt.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It depends,  The current programs offered where I am are from incentives from the govt.</p>
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		<title>By: lavardera</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/08/31/insane-true-energy-fact-of-th.html#comment-1522835</link>
		<dc:creator>lavardera</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Aug 2012 18:44:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=178922#comment-1522835</guid>
		<description>Really folks, these objections are silly.

Occupancy sensors used to be expensive, today are a cheap component. You make it a replaceable piece, like the light bulb. Its tested regularly when the light is tested. If its failed, its replaced.

The lights going out while you are on the toilet is a programming question - you don&#039;t design a sensor in an exit light to work the same way as a bathroom. Get it?

Same with range. And I&#039;d say the sensors would be made to be activated by smoke, not defeated by smoke. 

High traffic? Look, if the office building is empty at night, at least they go off.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Really folks, these objections are silly.</p>
<p>Occupancy sensors used to be expensive, today are a cheap component. You make it a replaceable piece, like the light bulb. Its tested regularly when the light is tested. If its failed, its replaced.</p>
<p>The lights going out while you are on the toilet is a programming question &#8211; you don&#8217;t design a sensor in an exit light to work the same way as a bathroom. Get it?</p>
<p>Same with range. And I&#8217;d say the sensors would be made to be activated by smoke, not defeated by smoke. </p>
<p>High traffic? Look, if the office building is empty at night, at least they go off.</p>
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		<title>By: lavardera</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/08/31/insane-true-energy-fact-of-th.html#comment-1522824</link>
		<dc:creator>lavardera</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Aug 2012 18:39:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=178922#comment-1522824</guid>
		<description>Here is the story I&#039;d really like to tell to people here reading about energy efficiency in building. The way we build houses here in the US is crap. We do basically the same thing we did in the 1950s, maybe we are putting a little bit more insulation in today, maybe the wall is a little bit thicker. But its not like the energy performance of our houses grew at the same rate as energy cost did. 

So in the 70s we had ourselves a little oil crisis, anybody old enough to remember that? The shock of waiting in gas lines, buying gas on even and odd days? We panicked for a few years, Jimmy Carter put solar panels on the white house, then we went back to building houses the way we always did. Crappy.

We were not the only place that had an oil crisis then - most of the developed world did. If we look at Sweden, the got slammed too. But they didn&#039;t have their own oil resources (like Norway for instance). When it was over they did not go back to same old same old. Instead, they completely re-invented the way that they build houses. Today their houses outperform ours by a wide margin - it is embarrassing.

Sweden is interesting because like the US, they build wood houses. Most of the rest of the EU its not so - masonry houses are more common. But Sweden has a sizable timber resource (side bar: much better managed than ours) and so they build wood houses - just like we do. In fact up until the 70s oil crisis the US and Sweden built houses in just about the same way. But not today - Sweden spent 40 years improving the wood house, and today they make housing in the US look like an amateur show.

So here&#039;s the thing. Sweden has done all the heavy lifting here. All the hard choices about how to build better performance economically have been made, they&#039;ve broken all the new ground. Its all there for the taking. And in fact in the 1980s was all laid at the feet of the US Housing industry - HERE IS HOW ITS DONE. A ground breaking research project by the late Lee Shipper, and Henry Kelly parsed all this and documented the revolution in Sweden, and delivered it here in a detailed report, and companion book COMING IN FROM THE COLD. These were brilliant researchers who went on to have stellar careers doing important work in Energy. Look them up if you doubt me. I wrote about this here: http://blog.lamidesign.com/2010/11/coming-in-from-cold-story-behind-story.html

What did the American Housing Industry do? Abso-fucking-lutely nothing. Buy a new house today and you&#039;ll get 4&quot; of lousy insulation, maybe a few inches more if you are spending. Its really hard to believe the story that America leads the world in technology, when something as ubiquitous as home building is done in such a profoundly incompetent manner, and its born out by our national energy bill. Yeah, we need to fix Exit lights, but the first thing we need to fix is to get over ourselves and start working on this in earnest.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here is the story I&#8217;d really like to tell to people here reading about energy efficiency in building. The way we build houses here in the US is crap. We do basically the same thing we did in the 1950s, maybe we are putting a little bit more insulation in today, maybe the wall is a little bit thicker. But its not like the energy performance of our houses grew at the same rate as energy cost did. </p>
<p>So in the 70s we had ourselves a little oil crisis, anybody old enough to remember that? The shock of waiting in gas lines, buying gas on even and odd days? We panicked for a few years, Jimmy Carter put solar panels on the white house, then we went back to building houses the way we always did. Crappy.</p>
<p>We were not the only place that had an oil crisis then &#8211; most of the developed world did. If we look at Sweden, the got slammed too. But they didn&#8217;t have their own oil resources (like Norway for instance). When it was over they did not go back to same old same old. Instead, they completely re-invented the way that they build houses. Today their houses outperform ours by a wide margin &#8211; it is embarrassing.</p>
<p>Sweden is interesting because like the US, they build wood houses. Most of the rest of the EU its not so &#8211; masonry houses are more common. But Sweden has a sizable timber resource (side bar: much better managed than ours) and so they build wood houses &#8211; just like we do. In fact up until the 70s oil crisis the US and Sweden built houses in just about the same way. But not today &#8211; Sweden spent 40 years improving the wood house, and today they make housing in the US look like an amateur show.</p>
<p>So here&#8217;s the thing. Sweden has done all the heavy lifting here. All the hard choices about how to build better performance economically have been made, they&#8217;ve broken all the new ground. Its all there for the taking. And in fact in the 1980s was all laid at the feet of the US Housing industry &#8211; HERE IS HOW ITS DONE. A ground breaking research project by the late Lee Shipper, and Henry Kelly parsed all this and documented the revolution in Sweden, and delivered it here in a detailed report, and companion book COMING IN FROM THE COLD. These were brilliant researchers who went on to have stellar careers doing important work in Energy. Look them up if you doubt me. I wrote about this here: <a href="http://blog.lamidesign.com/2010/11/coming-in-from-cold-story-behind-story.html" rel="nofollow">http://blog.lamidesign.com/2010/11/coming-in-from-cold-story-behind-story.html</a></p>
<p>What did the American Housing Industry do? Abso-fucking-lutely nothing. Buy a new house today and you&#8217;ll get 4&#8243; of lousy insulation, maybe a few inches more if you are spending. Its really hard to believe the story that America leads the world in technology, when something as ubiquitous as home building is done in such a profoundly incompetent manner, and its born out by our national energy bill. Yeah, we need to fix Exit lights, but the first thing we need to fix is to get over ourselves and start working on this in earnest.</p>
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		<title>By: kenmce</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/08/31/insane-true-energy-fact-of-th.html#comment-1522818</link>
		<dc:creator>kenmce</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Aug 2012 18:38:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=178922#comment-1522818</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;What about LED adoption? Esp. for applications like Exit signs&lt;/i&gt;

I consider LED to be the highest quality exit sign, with electoluminescent as the 2nd. place runner up.  I have almost all my buildings switched over to LED. (i&#039;m just waiting for the last of the incan signs to die)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>What about LED adoption? Esp. for applications like Exit signs</i></p>
<p>I consider LED to be the highest quality exit sign, with electoluminescent as the 2nd. place runner up.  I have almost all my buildings switched over to LED. (i&#8217;m just waiting for the last of the incan signs to die)</p>
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		<title>By: relawson</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/08/31/insane-true-energy-fact-of-th.html#comment-1522814</link>
		<dc:creator>relawson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Aug 2012 18:36:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=178922#comment-1522814</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ll give you a little pass on the point of failure thing, but not on the glowy one.

If a building loses power or something, there&#039;s a pretty good chance that the lights were on just prior to the dark!  Now, of course you&#039;ll need them on all the time in areas that may not have constant illumination.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ll give you a little pass on the point of failure thing, but not on the glowy one.</p>
<p>If a building loses power or something, there&#8217;s a pretty good chance that the lights were on just prior to the dark!  Now, of course you&#8217;ll need them on all the time in areas that may not have constant illumination.</p>
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		<title>By: Jay Yeman</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/08/31/insane-true-energy-fact-of-th.html#comment-1522813</link>
		<dc:creator>Jay Yeman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Aug 2012 18:35:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=178922#comment-1522813</guid>
		<description>I thought the power companies did that on their own with the thought that it&#039;s cheaper to offer incentives and reduce demand than to build a new power plant.  Same reasoning for ice storage - shift demand to off-peak hours.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I thought the power companies did that on their own with the thought that it&#8217;s cheaper to offer incentives and reduce demand than to build a new power plant.  Same reasoning for ice storage &#8211; shift demand to off-peak hours.</p>
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		<title>By: arnold</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/08/31/insane-true-energy-fact-of-th.html#comment-1522808</link>
		<dc:creator>arnold</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Aug 2012 18:33:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=178922#comment-1522808</guid>
		<description>the power company rebates are fueled by the governement.  so, in essence, the govt is providing it.  but i get what you are saying.    </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>the power company rebates are fueled by the governement.  so, in essence, the govt is providing it.  but i get what you are saying.    </p>
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		<title>By: arnold</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/08/31/insane-true-energy-fact-of-th.html#comment-1522798</link>
		<dc:creator>arnold</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Aug 2012 18:31:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=178922#comment-1522798</guid>
		<description>exits signs are for more than just a fire.   what if there was a shooting in the place and you didnt know where the exit was?   if the sign wasnt on, you might not know where to go.  ie, movie theater.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>exits signs are for more than just a fire.   what if there was a shooting in the place and you didnt know where the exit was?   if the sign wasnt on, you might not know where to go.  ie, movie theater.</p>
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		<title>By: arnold</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/08/31/insane-true-energy-fact-of-th.html#comment-1522794</link>
		<dc:creator>arnold</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Aug 2012 18:29:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=178922#comment-1522794</guid>
		<description>occ sensor is good, except in high traffic area, it wont matter.  also, at long range, it might not trigger.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>occ sensor is good, except in high traffic area, it wont matter.  also, at long range, it might not trigger.</p>
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		<title>By: kenmce</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/08/31/insane-true-energy-fact-of-th.html#comment-1522791</link>
		<dc:creator>kenmce</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Aug 2012 18:28:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=178922#comment-1522791</guid>
		<description>&lt;I&gt;What we should have on them is occupancy sensors, so they only light up when there is somebody there to see them. &lt;/I&gt;

Ever been in a bathroom that has these, but you are in the stall for longer than the programmed delay, and it can&#039;t see you in there, so you have to finish up in the *&amp;^! dark?

It sucks.

Imagine that the smoke is starting to get thick, and you know there has to be an exit around here somewhere, but the sensor can&#039;t see through the smoke, so it stays off...

That&#039;d really suck.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>What we should have on them is occupancy sensors, so they only light up when there is somebody there to see them. </i></p>
<p>Ever been in a bathroom that has these, but you are in the stall for longer than the programmed delay, and it can&#8217;t see you in there, so you have to finish up in the *&amp;^! dark?</p>
<p>It sucks.</p>
<p>Imagine that the smoke is starting to get thick, and you know there has to be an exit around here somewhere, but the sensor can&#8217;t see through the smoke, so it stays off&#8230;</p>
<p>That&#8217;d really suck.</p>
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		<title>By: arnold</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/08/31/insane-true-energy-fact-of-th.html#comment-1522788</link>
		<dc:creator>arnold</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Aug 2012 18:27:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=178922#comment-1522788</guid>
		<description>leds have been in use for exit signs for at least 8 years.   i havent sold a new non-led sign in at least that long a period.   that being said, there are still a ton of old signs out there.   the only way i can see anyone changing them is for the following reasons: 1-the sign breaks, 2-they are tired of changing lamps, or 3-they did an energy audit and upgraded the lighting in the building.   if they did the upgrade of lighting, then they would change them.  most likely would get a rebate from the power company too.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>leds have been in use for exit signs for at least 8 years.   i havent sold a new non-led sign in at least that long a period.   that being said, there are still a ton of old signs out there.   the only way i can see anyone changing them is for the following reasons: 1-the sign breaks, 2-they are tired of changing lamps, or 3-they did an energy audit and upgraded the lighting in the building.   if they did the upgrade of lighting, then they would change them.  most likely would get a rebate from the power company too.</p>
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		<title>By: Jay Yeman</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/08/31/insane-true-energy-fact-of-th.html#comment-1522778</link>
		<dc:creator>Jay Yeman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Aug 2012 18:24:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=178922#comment-1522778</guid>
		<description>Agreed that some power companies offer rebates.  Ice storage is a popular one.  I wish there were more incentives, especially from government.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Agreed that some power companies offer rebates.  Ice storage is a popular one.  I wish there were more incentives, especially from government.</p>
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		<title>By: arnold</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/08/31/insane-true-energy-fact-of-th.html#comment-1522773</link>
		<dc:creator>arnold</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Aug 2012 18:23:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=178922#comment-1522773</guid>
		<description>check with the local power company.  i know mine offers rebates.  commercial rebates are bigger than the resi ones.   if varies from place to place.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>check with the local power company.  i know mine offers rebates.  commercial rebates are bigger than the resi ones.   if varies from place to place.</p>
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		<title>By: kenmce</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/08/31/insane-true-energy-fact-of-th.html#comment-1522774</link>
		<dc:creator>kenmce</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Aug 2012 18:23:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=178922#comment-1522774</guid>
		<description>&lt;I&gt;I sure as shooting would not want them on all the time. No reason for that anywhere.  &lt;/I&gt;

Reliability has a higher priority than economy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>I sure as shooting would not want them on all the time. No reason for that anywhere.  </i></p>
<p>Reliability has a higher priority than economy.</p>
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		<title>By: kenmce</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/08/31/insane-true-energy-fact-of-th.html#comment-1522770</link>
		<dc:creator>kenmce</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Aug 2012 18:21:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=178922#comment-1522770</guid>
		<description>&gt;I&#039;ve always thought a photo cell should be used 
&gt;so they only light up whenever its dark 

Adds an unnecessary point of failure to life safety equipment.

&gt; Or, you know, glow-in-the-dark paint 

Mostly useless unless you have a light shining on it all the time.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&gt;I&#8217;ve always thought a photo cell should be used<br />
&gt;so they only light up whenever its dark </p>
<p>Adds an unnecessary point of failure to life safety equipment.</p>
<p>&gt; Or, you know, glow-in-the-dark paint </p>
<p>Mostly useless unless you have a light shining on it all the time.</p>
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		<title>By: arnold</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/08/31/insane-true-energy-fact-of-th.html#comment-1522765</link>
		<dc:creator>arnold</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Aug 2012 18:19:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=178922#comment-1522765</guid>
		<description>The architect may specify a high end sign, but ultimately the owner&#039;s budget dictates what gets used.   that being said, incandescent signs aren&#039;t even sold anymore.  i&#039;ve had led exits as standard items for at least 8 years.  </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The architect may specify a high end sign, but ultimately the owner&#8217;s budget dictates what gets used.   that being said, incandescent signs aren&#8217;t even sold anymore.  i&#8217;ve had led exits as standard items for at least 8 years.  </p>
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		<title>By: lavardera</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/08/31/insane-true-energy-fact-of-th.html#comment-1522762</link>
		<dc:creator>lavardera</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Aug 2012 18:17:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=178922#comment-1522762</guid>
		<description>You know, reforming Exit lights would be good, but reforming the way we build buildings would be better. Incentivizing retrofits to older buildings would be even better.

One of the programs of the recent recovery efforts was low interest loans to do energy retrofits for older homes. It was a great opportunity. However it was limited in several ways - if you already had a second mortgage on your home, guess what - you could not participate in the program. Guess who have second mortgages on their homes, lines of credit or otherwise? The very people that would benefit most from energy retrofits. Programs like this have to be carefully designed, or they don&#039;t help the people that need it most.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You know, reforming Exit lights would be good, but reforming the way we build buildings would be better. Incentivizing retrofits to older buildings would be even better.</p>
<p>One of the programs of the recent recovery efforts was low interest loans to do energy retrofits for older homes. It was a great opportunity. However it was limited in several ways &#8211; if you already had a second mortgage on your home, guess what &#8211; you could not participate in the program. Guess who have second mortgages on their homes, lines of credit or otherwise? The very people that would benefit most from energy retrofits. Programs like this have to be carefully designed, or they don&#8217;t help the people that need it most.</p>
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