Comments on: Manipulated Outrage and Misplaced Fury: Husain Haqqani on the YouTube outrage

By: wysinwyg

wysinwyg — Mon, 17 Sep 2012 18:06:00 +0000

Remember, we bombed Quadafi.

We were fer ‘im before we were agin’ ‘im.

By: Tynam

Tynam — Sun, 16 Sep 2012 17:35:00 +0000

I thank you for that profound complement, strangefriend. I am at best a mere shodan of snark, and can only aspire one day to reach true mastery, as it is demonstrated by Antinous-sensei.

By: Brad Bell

Brad Bell — Sun, 16 Sep 2012 10:59:00 +0000

It doesn’t seem any more nuanced than the first article. Your comment is more nuanced than either of the articles, which seem to represent a weird, ahistorical, ‘Clash of Civilisations’ view.

Consider this misleading and illogical line from the first article: “Iran’s ayatollahs built an entire revolution around anti-Americanism.” With lines like that, how can we blame people for forgetting BP, the unanimous demand for an extra 5% of oil revenue by the Iranian parliament, the CIA coup of the democratically elected PM of Iran, the US installation of the Shah, decades of kidnapping, torture, murder, and death squads so horrific it ultimately lead the entire country into revolution? How could an Iranian possibly NOT be anti-American?* The American government rebuilt Iran on anti-Americanism. The Iranians then built a revolution on anti-Americanism. Then the Ayatollahs took it over and started shouting death to America.

* (Forcibly changing a person – even for the better – necessarily means they hate you. It’s human nature. Everyone should know this. It also means you are in a relationship. A very angry relationship. The other party is forced to define themselves by the changes you made. It leads to resentment.)

The simple truth is we’re all just the peasants of neoliberalism, divided and conquered.

By: strangefriend

strangefriend — Sat, 15 Sep 2012 17:33:00 +0000

You must have a black belt in snark, Tynam.

By: Saltine

Saltine — Sat, 15 Sep 2012 14:07:00 +0000

I’m here to post a similar and very informative story from Slate. But as I scrolled down I noticed a disappointing trend, so I’ll just go ahead and invite outrage by presenting this thought: when it comes to politics, especially international politics, any statement beginning with “it’s just” or “it’s only” or “the simple truth is” is wrong, stupid, ignorant, and very likely to be jingoistic, chauvinistic, xenophobic, racist or some other -ist that springs from a general desire to cut the world down to the size of the speaker’s vision/intellect.

Anyway, here’s that nuanced, informative article that points out complexities and paradoxes about what’s going on in Egypt: http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/foreigners/2012/09/muslim_world_protests_why_can_t_muslims_remain_calm_when_some_kook_insults_the_prophet_mohammed_.html

By: Tynam

Tynam — Sat, 15 Sep 2012 11:01:00 +0000

Some of this is conservative Arab Spring backlash, actually – particularly in Egypt, it’s a case of the right wing being upset that moderates made some actual progress.

By: Tynam

Tynam — Sat, 15 Sep 2012 10:20:00 +0000

Exactly right.

(I’m just glad that we in the west haven’t had to deal with a leader who preached xenophobic panic about foreigners while talking loudly about God. Or used violence abroad as a distraction from disastrous economic and social failures at home. It must be terrible, living in a country that could put a guy like that in charge.)

By: Lemoutan

Lemoutan — Sat, 15 Sep 2012 07:32:00 +0000

Religious leaders… fuck them all.

I’ll have a large order of those in 25 metre dressed marble – in Latin please. And if you could deliver the monuments to the following cities …

By: Antinous / Moderator

Antinous / Moderator — Sat, 15 Sep 2012 07:23:00 +0000

Isn’t that pretty much what most political and religious leaders do? Keep hyping the rhetoric to stay in power.

By: Sirkowski

Sirkowski — Sat, 15 Sep 2012 06:53:00 +0000

You’re painting all Muslims with the same brush. It’s the religious inbred minority that would rather hate foreigners for perceived slights rather than look at their own flaws. (yes, perceived) Most Muslims in Lebanon don’t give a shit about drone strikes in Pakistan, or even Palestinians. Think Tea Party, but in a Third World country.

By: Sirkowski

Sirkowski — Sat, 15 Sep 2012 06:44:00 +0000

“Islamists almost by definition have a vested interest in continuously fanning the flames of Muslim victimhood. For Islamists, wrath against the West is the basis for their claim to the support of Muslim masses, taking attention away from societal political and economic failures.”

Religious leaders… fuck them all.

By: Mister44

Mister44 — Sat, 15 Sep 2012 05:57:00 +0000

re: ” Isn’t it understandable that people in Egypt and Libya do “not show respect to U.S diplomatic missions”, given that America showed very clear support for their authoritarian regimes just months before they were toppled?”

You have a point with Egypt, but not with Libya. Remember, we bombed Quadafi. And we actually supplied air support for the rebels. AND we didn’t then move in with boots on the ground. Lots of reasons for Libyans to be chill about the US.

It’s also important to note that these people are on the fringe. It isn’t a mass protest like during the Arab Spring with the support of a large faction of people. Just like the “god hates f*gs” and the guy who burned the Korans don’t speak for a vast majority of Christians.

By: nomind

nomind — Sat, 15 Sep 2012 05:23:00 +0000

I agree that the reaction is not really about the video. People in the Middle East know that when Westerners start hating on Muslims, bombs, starvation and torture are soon to follow. Was the Iraq War so long ago? It is convenient for us to ignore it when we discuss that “they hate us for our freedom” or some other bull, but don’t you think it’s a very clear reallity for them? Isn’t it understandable that people in Egypt and Libya do “not show respect to U.S diplomatic missions”, given that America showed very clear support for their authoritarian regimes just months before they were toppled?

By: Antinous / Moderator

Antinous / Moderator — Sat, 15 Sep 2012 05:09:00 +0000

That just gets you the first three sentences.

By: Boomer

Boomer — Sat, 15 Sep 2012 04:50:00 +0000

I read the full article free here: http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10000872396390444017504577647880299665696.html

By: User 100

User 100 — Sat, 15 Sep 2012 03:06:00 +0000

Subscribe to Continue...lost interest...

Just google for the title and the first listed link will bring you to the full article.

By: Mister44

Mister44 — Sat, 15 Sep 2012 02:46:00 +0000

Yeah, seems legit.

By: Bruce Elrick

Bruce Elrick — Sat, 15 Sep 2012 01:53:00 +0000

Blah blah….

Subscribe to Continue…lost interest…

By: forwardourmotto

forwardourmotto — Sat, 15 Sep 2012 01:25:00 +0000

Wah, I want to read the full article but I don’t want to give the WSJ money :(

By: oldtaku

oldtaku — Sat, 15 Sep 2012 00:59:00 +0000

For instance, this video blew up on 9/11/2012, but it’s been out there for months. Pretty convenient, eh?

By: Boundegar

Boundegar — Sat, 15 Sep 2012 00:55:00 +0000

Wow. This is worth repeating.