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	<title>Comments on: The Golden&#160;Dawn</title>
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		<title>By: Preston Sturges</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/10/01/the-golden-dawn.html#comment-1550108</link>
		<dc:creator>Preston Sturges</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Oct 2012 22:10:00 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>My Mauser would work just as well against Nazis as it probably did against Jews. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My Mauser would work just as well against Nazis as it probably did against Jews. </p>
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		<title>By: Angelos TSIRIMOKOS</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/10/01/the-golden-dawn.html#comment-1549641</link>
		<dc:creator>Angelos TSIRIMOKOS</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Oct 2012 11:25:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=183357#comment-1549641</guid>
		<description>Sadly, yes, it&#039;s all true -- and there is no end in sight; things in Greece will keep getting worse and no one knows when they will get better, or even how they could possibly get better,,,</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sadly, yes, it&#8217;s all true &#8212; and there is no end in sight; things in Greece will keep getting worse and no one knows when they will get better, or even how they could possibly get better,,,</p>
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		<title>By: Vishy Moghan</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/10/01/the-golden-dawn.html#comment-1549624</link>
		<dc:creator>Vishy Moghan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Oct 2012 10:25:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=183357#comment-1549624</guid>
		<description>The major problem with this kind of obfuscation is the simple and unfortunate fact that most people, it seems to me, have a very ahistorical  view of politics, the fabled short memory of the general public. Or worse still what they call selective amnesia. This leads our societies again and again into making the exact same mistakes, and falling into the exact same dead ends. 

I know older people here who have told me horrific stories about the time of the occupation by the Germans, how they watched their men folk marched off to the SS headquarters never to be seen again. The massacres of whole villages, the tortures and so on. And then so soon after the end of the war the civil war and then shortly after that the Junta, the awful reign of terror by the Colonels. This last well within living memory.

And yet all Golden Dawn needed was the media hysteria over the collapse of the system and the crimes (mostly fictitious) of the immigrants to run the population straight back into the arms of Fascism. The degree to which normal people have accepted the violence against innocent people is unbelievable.

The de-humanising process against immigrants started when the government got wind of the oncoming tide of the crisis, it was their get out of gaol free card. OOPS they said we&#039;ve been caught with our hands in the cookie jar and we have no plan, so let&#039;s make it all the fault of immigrants. Forget the fact that the politicians had been draining the blood out of this country for years, moneys being siphoned off to foreign private accounts, forget the collusion of church and police in perpetuating the corruption, forget the tax dodging and lies throughout every level of socio-economic activity, the back handers and so forth. The loans that the banks callously gave out like it was free, and the stupidity of the trap of free money. No it is the immigrants who brought us to this, get rid of them and all will be right again with Greece. Shamelessly using the immigration issue, manipulating the media to bring it centre stage, smoke and mirrors to distract the public from political crimes committed against them. Add to that the natural jingoism and patriotic fervour so endemic to Europe, we had the exact recipe for another classic mess.

It is hard to see once more the real criminals getting away with crimes for which they should have been hung by their heels in public, and worse still, return to government as if they were the most honest of people while the poor, the politically disaffected, the refugees, those with alternative life styles and so on get the axe and the blame for everything. And shocked as some may be, no one is doing anything to counter this wash of horror, to put a stop to it. 

Nazism has a way of becoming viral, and to jump host with great ease. And the more we all look away from it, the more we make light of its proponents the more easily it spreads. A tragedy has unfolded in this country and no one is paying any attention to it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The major problem with this kind of obfuscation is the simple and unfortunate fact that most people, it seems to me, have a very ahistorical  view of politics, the fabled short memory of the general public. Or worse still what they call selective amnesia. This leads our societies again and again into making the exact same mistakes, and falling into the exact same dead ends. </p>
<p>I know older people here who have told me horrific stories about the time of the occupation by the Germans, how they watched their men folk marched off to the SS headquarters never to be seen again. The massacres of whole villages, the tortures and so on. And then so soon after the end of the war the civil war and then shortly after that the Junta, the awful reign of terror by the Colonels. This last well within living memory.</p>
<p>And yet all Golden Dawn needed was the media hysteria over the collapse of the system and the crimes (mostly fictitious) of the immigrants to run the population straight back into the arms of Fascism. The degree to which normal people have accepted the violence against innocent people is unbelievable.</p>
<p>The de-humanising process against immigrants started when the government got wind of the oncoming tide of the crisis, it was their get out of gaol free card. OOPS they said we&#8217;ve been caught with our hands in the cookie jar and we have no plan, so let&#8217;s make it all the fault of immigrants. Forget the fact that the politicians had been draining the blood out of this country for years, moneys being siphoned off to foreign private accounts, forget the collusion of church and police in perpetuating the corruption, forget the tax dodging and lies throughout every level of socio-economic activity, the back handers and so forth. The loans that the banks callously gave out like it was free, and the stupidity of the trap of free money. No it is the immigrants who brought us to this, get rid of them and all will be right again with Greece. Shamelessly using the immigration issue, manipulating the media to bring it centre stage, smoke and mirrors to distract the public from political crimes committed against them. Add to that the natural jingoism and patriotic fervour so endemic to Europe, we had the exact recipe for another classic mess.</p>
<p>It is hard to see once more the real criminals getting away with crimes for which they should have been hung by their heels in public, and worse still, return to government as if they were the most honest of people while the poor, the politically disaffected, the refugees, those with alternative life styles and so on get the axe and the blame for everything. And shocked as some may be, no one is doing anything to counter this wash of horror, to put a stop to it. </p>
<p>Nazism has a way of becoming viral, and to jump host with great ease. And the more we all look away from it, the more we make light of its proponents the more easily it spreads. A tragedy has unfolded in this country and no one is paying any attention to it.</p>
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		<title>By: Antonis Pappas</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/10/01/the-golden-dawn.html#comment-1549599</link>
		<dc:creator>Antonis Pappas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Oct 2012 08:31:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=183357#comment-1549599</guid>
		<description>Because in Greece all news is Fox News.

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Because in Greece all news is Fox News.</p>
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		<title>By: iburl</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/10/01/the-golden-dawn.html#comment-1549413</link>
		<dc:creator>iburl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Oct 2012 01:14:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=183357#comment-1549413</guid>
		<description>Rush Limpballs has been flogging this theory for years.... but what would you expect from a right wing Nazi?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rush Limpballs has been flogging this theory for years&#8230;. but what would you expect from a right wing Nazi?</p>
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		<title>By: iburl</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/10/01/the-golden-dawn.html#comment-1549411</link>
		<dc:creator>iburl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Oct 2012 01:13:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=183357#comment-1549411</guid>
		<description>You are a total idiot if you really believe that Fascism is a left-wing philosophy. You have been brainwashed by right wing toads like Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, and Glenn Beck.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You are a total idiot if you really believe that Fascism is a left-wing philosophy. You have been brainwashed by right wing toads like Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, and Glenn Beck.</p>
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		<title>By: Preston Sturges</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/10/01/the-golden-dawn.html#comment-1549357</link>
		<dc:creator>Preston Sturges</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Oct 2012 23:42:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=183357#comment-1549357</guid>
		<description>&gt;&gt;&gt;I was also surprised by those here who try to argue for the blurring of boundaries between left and right

This is a technique for recruiting Hitler core constituency, the people who will believe anything.  Tell them &quot;Nazis were leftists,&quot; then feed material straight from Mein Kampf, but they will think they are being antifascists since they are conservatives.

This is just a variation on the original Nazi Big Lie - that it was the Jews who were the genocidal racist monsters that were going to enslave people.  Of course it was Hitler with that plan, but he accused the Jews. 

This fellow called it correctly:

&quot;When and if fascism comes to America...it will not even be called &#039;fascism&#039;; it will be called, of course, &#039;Americanism&#039;&quot; --Professor Halford E. Luccock of Yale Divinity School; New York Times article from September 12, 1938, page 15

And in the US we have Glenn Beck who worships Hitler but praises Jesus.  And the pitch is to the elderly, which in the US is the Tea Party.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&gt;&gt;&gt;I was also surprised by those here who try to argue for the blurring of boundaries between left and right</p>
<p>This is a technique for recruiting Hitler core constituency, the people who will believe anything.  Tell them &#8220;Nazis were leftists,&#8221; then feed material straight from Mein Kampf, but they will think they are being antifascists since they are conservatives.</p>
<p>This is just a variation on the original Nazi Big Lie &#8211; that it was the Jews who were the genocidal racist monsters that were going to enslave people.  Of course it was Hitler with that plan, but he accused the Jews. </p>
<p>This fellow called it correctly:</p>
<p>&#8220;When and if fascism comes to America&#8230;it will not even be called &#8216;fascism&#8217;; it will be called, of course, &#8216;Americanism&#8217;&#8221; &#8211;Professor Halford E. Luccock of Yale Divinity School; New York Times article from September 12, 1938, page 15</p>
<p>And in the US we have Glenn Beck who worships Hitler but praises Jesus.  And the pitch is to the elderly, which in the US is the Tea Party.</p>
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		<title>By: Vishy Moghan</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/10/01/the-golden-dawn.html#comment-1549058</link>
		<dc:creator>Vishy Moghan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Oct 2012 19:39:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=183357#comment-1549058</guid>
		<description>As a British citizen of Iranian origin living and working in Greece for  the last eighteen years, I would like to first send a heartfelt thanks to the authors of this article, and secondly ask with full emphasis that they not stop pressing and campaigning for the world to sit up and take notice of the absolute, real and present danger of the situation in this country.

I read here various arguments for the whys and wherefores of this tragedy. And yes we know full well that historically desperate people turn to desperate solutions. But I can not emphasise enough the radical turn this country has taken towards the extreme right.

I was also surprised by those here who try to argue for the blurring of boundaries between left and right and throwing blame both ways. But in all honesty as the article points out in no uncertain terms, there is no grey area here. Golden Dawn are Nazis with the full weight of that title. They intend, and have made it abundantly clear that they plan to, bring about a holocaust for those of foreign extract regardless of whether they are legal or illegal. Several attacks have already taken place on Greeks who happen to be gay or different. Including (as light as this may seem compared to murder) for example the public shaving of a Greek youth sporting dreadlocks, in broad daylight in one of the busiest shopping streets of Athens. The police are not simply in collusion with Golden Dawn, they are actually referring citizens who call them for help to the so called party&#039;s offices, literally giving callers the phone number to make their complaint to GD and for them to send their thugs around to &quot;help&quot; the citizen with their problem.

My family escaped Iran to get away from the rule of Muslim dictators. Being of the so called intellectual classes of that country there was no room for my family there. I left Iran as a child, and now in my fifties to be facing the growing daily spectre of attacks, beatings, stabbings, threats, humiliation and even murder committed against foreigners is beyond shocking. I, you could justifiably say have a choice. I can indeed return to Britain and keep myself and my wife and child safe, where those poor immigrants do not have the option. But Nazism is not an ethos that likes to stay where it is. Its aim is and has always been to spread its poison far and wide.

And this is the most surprising aspect of the nearly blanket silence in the world media on the subject.

How short sighted is it that no one in Europe seems to be taking even a cursory notice of the situation, let alone stepping back in absolute horror and demanding intervention. It is my belief that right now as things stand we are a very short step from a return to genocide in this part of the world.

Please understand that Golden Dawn are actually building caches of arms as I write. Their cadres are openly training for combat alongside the police force, if the reports that we get are to be believed.

I am a photographer and graphic designer, and many of my associates are photojournalists who every day see and record their crimes yet most of their very graphically illustrative photographs are not making it into the media.

Anyway this is getting long winded. All I really wanted to point out is that the seriousness of this situation and its potential consequences for Greece and indeed the rest of Europe can not be over emphasised.

Take heed and try not to let this be ignored any longer, not just for the sake of Greece but perhaps for all people.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As a British citizen of Iranian origin living and working in Greece for  the last eighteen years, I would like to first send a heartfelt thanks to the authors of this article, and secondly ask with full emphasis that they not stop pressing and campaigning for the world to sit up and take notice of the absolute, real and present danger of the situation in this country.</p>
<p>I read here various arguments for the whys and wherefores of this tragedy. And yes we know full well that historically desperate people turn to desperate solutions. But I can not emphasise enough the radical turn this country has taken towards the extreme right.</p>
<p>I was also surprised by those here who try to argue for the blurring of boundaries between left and right and throwing blame both ways. But in all honesty as the article points out in no uncertain terms, there is no grey area here. Golden Dawn are Nazis with the full weight of that title. They intend, and have made it abundantly clear that they plan to, bring about a holocaust for those of foreign extract regardless of whether they are legal or illegal. Several attacks have already taken place on Greeks who happen to be gay or different. Including (as light as this may seem compared to murder) for example the public shaving of a Greek youth sporting dreadlocks, in broad daylight in one of the busiest shopping streets of Athens. The police are not simply in collusion with Golden Dawn, they are actually referring citizens who call them for help to the so called party&#8217;s offices, literally giving callers the phone number to make their complaint to GD and for them to send their thugs around to &#8220;help&#8221; the citizen with their problem.</p>
<p>My family escaped Iran to get away from the rule of Muslim dictators. Being of the so called intellectual classes of that country there was no room for my family there. I left Iran as a child, and now in my fifties to be facing the growing daily spectre of attacks, beatings, stabbings, threats, humiliation and even murder committed against foreigners is beyond shocking. I, you could justifiably say have a choice. I can indeed return to Britain and keep myself and my wife and child safe, where those poor immigrants do not have the option. But Nazism is not an ethos that likes to stay where it is. Its aim is and has always been to spread its poison far and wide.</p>
<p>And this is the most surprising aspect of the nearly blanket silence in the world media on the subject.</p>
<p>How short sighted is it that no one in Europe seems to be taking even a cursory notice of the situation, let alone stepping back in absolute horror and demanding intervention. It is my belief that right now as things stand we are a very short step from a return to genocide in this part of the world.</p>
<p>Please understand that Golden Dawn are actually building caches of arms as I write. Their cadres are openly training for combat alongside the police force, if the reports that we get are to be believed.</p>
<p>I am a photographer and graphic designer, and many of my associates are photojournalists who every day see and record their crimes yet most of their very graphically illustrative photographs are not making it into the media.</p>
<p>Anyway this is getting long winded. All I really wanted to point out is that the seriousness of this situation and its potential consequences for Greece and indeed the rest of Europe can not be over emphasised.</p>
<p>Take heed and try not to let this be ignored any longer, not just for the sake of Greece but perhaps for all people.</p>
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		<title>By: Ldude893</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/10/01/the-golden-dawn.html#comment-1548676</link>
		<dc:creator>Ldude893</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Oct 2012 04:48:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=183357#comment-1548676</guid>
		<description>Nazis.
People in Europe, supporting Nazis in political power, in the 21st Century. And said Nazis are actually getting more powerful.

Jebus Christ, it&#039;s that bad.  

Just wait, a couple more years and they&#039;re going to bring back Ghettos for immigrants. One of two years after that, concentration camps will make a comeback. 
People never change, do they? In their most desperate moment, they&#039;ll turn towards a party that&#039;s explicitly shown as supporting an ideology that killed millions of people. I guess it&#039;s not completely the people&#039;s fault. With the Greek government absolutely useless, people have no choice but to turn towards the party that could actually benefit them the most, regardless of how twisted the group&#039;s ideology.

It&#039;s a terrible state of affairs. I wish the best for the Greeks who do have common sense and choose not to support this party.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nazis.<br />
People in Europe, supporting Nazis in political power, in the 21st Century. And said Nazis are actually getting more powerful.</p>
<p>Jebus Christ, it&#8217;s that bad.  </p>
<p>Just wait, a couple more years and they&#8217;re going to bring back Ghettos for immigrants. One of two years after that, concentration camps will make a comeback.<br />
People never change, do they? In their most desperate moment, they&#8217;ll turn towards a party that&#8217;s explicitly shown as supporting an ideology that killed millions of people. I guess it&#8217;s not completely the people&#8217;s fault. With the Greek government absolutely useless, people have no choice but to turn towards the party that could actually benefit them the most, regardless of how twisted the group&#8217;s ideology.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s a terrible state of affairs. I wish the best for the Greeks who do have common sense and choose not to support this party.</p>
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		<title>By: Ashley Yakeley</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/10/01/the-golden-dawn.html#comment-1547484</link>
		<dc:creator>Ashley Yakeley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Oct 2012 02:43:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=183357#comment-1547484</guid>
		<description>Why is this? Why do so many Greeks share this opinion?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Why is this? Why do so many Greeks share this opinion?</p>
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		<title>By: Preston Sturges</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/10/01/the-golden-dawn.html#comment-1546995</link>
		<dc:creator>Preston Sturges</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Oct 2012 20:32:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=183357#comment-1546995</guid>
		<description>&gt;&gt;Tu quoque only proves your side is as bad as the other.  

And Daddy only drinks because you cry. 

Besides your use of &quot;tu quoque&quot; is ironic because you are using it wrong. Tu quoque is a logical fallacy used to dismiss a critic by accusing him of hypocrisy, which in this case would make you the one resorting to the tu quoque logical fallacy against me.

Your reductio ad absurdum reasoning that people who complain about self identified swastika tattooed &quot;Fascists&quot; are as bad as real Fascists was stated most recently by Nordic white supremacist and child murderer Anders Breivik.   So your reasoning is also used by Hitler apologists. 

Go back to SodaHead.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&gt;&gt;Tu quoque only proves your side is as bad as the other.  </p>
<p>And Daddy only drinks because you cry. </p>
<p>Besides your use of &#8220;tu quoque&#8221; is ironic because you are using it wrong. Tu quoque is a logical fallacy used to dismiss a critic by accusing him of hypocrisy, which in this case would make you the one resorting to the tu quoque logical fallacy against me.</p>
<p>Your reductio ad absurdum reasoning that people who complain about self identified swastika tattooed &#8220;Fascists&#8221; are as bad as real Fascists was stated most recently by Nordic white supremacist and child murderer Anders Breivik.   So your reasoning is also used by Hitler apologists. </p>
<p>Go back to SodaHead.</p>
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		<title>By: Preston Sturges</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/10/01/the-golden-dawn.html#comment-1546930</link>
		<dc:creator>Preston Sturges</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Oct 2012 19:54:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=183357#comment-1546930</guid>
		<description>I&gt;&gt;&gt;In other words, stop using the bad deeds of others to justify the bad deeds of people you&#039;d like to think are on the &quot;good&quot; side of history. 
--------------------------------------------
until very recently, conservatives were very proud of how they had supposedly conquered &quot;moral relativism,&quot; but now much of what they do is justified in terms of something someone else allegedly did which is usually also debunked on Snopes.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&gt;&gt;&gt;In other words, stop using the bad deeds of others to justify the bad deeds of people you&#8217;d like to think are on the &#8220;good&#8221; side of history. <br />
&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
until very recently, conservatives were very proud of how they had supposedly conquered &#8220;moral relativism,&#8221; but now much of what they do is justified in terms of something someone else allegedly did which is usually also debunked on Snopes.</p>
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		<title>By: wysinwyg</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/10/01/the-golden-dawn.html#comment-1546709</link>
		<dc:creator>wysinwyg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Oct 2012 18:17:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=183357#comment-1546709</guid>
		<description>@boingboing-e41803c944b3d68e5215c8b9cefb0196:disqus &lt;em&gt;Tu quoque&lt;/em&gt; only proves your side is as bad as the other.  I think the goal is actually to be a little better.  In other words, stop using the bad deeds of others to justify the bad deeds of people you&#039;d like to think are on the &quot;good&quot; side of history.  Bad deeds shouldn&#039;t be justified at all.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@boingboing-e41803c944b3d68e5215c8b9cefb0196:disqus <em>Tu quoque</em> only proves your side is as bad as the other.  I think the goal is actually to be a little better.  In other words, stop using the bad deeds of others to justify the bad deeds of people you&#8217;d like to think are on the &#8220;good&#8221; side of history.  Bad deeds shouldn&#8217;t be justified at all.</p>
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		<title>By: Preston Sturges</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/10/01/the-golden-dawn.html#comment-1546550</link>
		<dc:creator>Preston Sturges</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Oct 2012 17:04:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=183357#comment-1546550</guid>
		<description>Well in contrast the Republicans of that  era were the hard-core Nazi appeasers and many  were convinced that Jews had infiltrated and taken over the US government.

And in the failed &quot;Bankers Coup,&quot; a group of prominent Republicans actually plotted a Fascist takeover of the United States.  

Also check out videos of the Nazi &quot;German American Bund,&quot; and their rally in Madison Square garden.  Giant American flags and a 30 ft George Washington.  Except for the swastikas, it looked like any other conservative American event. 

Likewise check out Henry Ford&#039;s rabid hatred of the Jews.  He used to get Christmas cards (!!!!) from Hitler.

So don&#039;t pull a muscle saying FDR was &quot;like&quot; a fascist when there were plenty of actual American Fascists in that era, and they pretty much all hated FDR.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well in contrast the Republicans of that  era were the hard-core Nazi appeasers and many  were convinced that Jews had infiltrated and taken over the US government.</p>
<p>And in the failed &#8220;Bankers Coup,&#8221; a group of prominent Republicans actually plotted a Fascist takeover of the United States.  </p>
<p>Also check out videos of the Nazi &#8220;German American Bund,&#8221; and their rally in Madison Square garden.  Giant American flags and a 30 ft George Washington.  Except for the swastikas, it looked like any other conservative American event. </p>
<p>Likewise check out Henry Ford&#8217;s rabid hatred of the Jews.  He used to get Christmas cards (!!!!) from Hitler.</p>
<p>So don&#8217;t pull a muscle saying FDR was &#8220;like&#8221; a fascist when there were plenty of actual American Fascists in that era, and they pretty much all hated FDR.</p>
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		<title>By: Preston Sturges</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/10/01/the-golden-dawn.html#comment-1546514</link>
		<dc:creator>Preston Sturges</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Oct 2012 16:33:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=183357#comment-1546514</guid>
		<description>www.nationalreview.com/liberal-fascism/203851/was-hitler-racist
Goldberg famously said &quot;Was Hitler Racist?  I&#039;m not sold.&quot;

Hows that for being a Nazi apologist? </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://www.nationalreview.com/liberal-fascism/203851/was-hitler-racist" rel="nofollow">http://www.nationalreview.com/liberal-fascism/203851/was-hitler-racist</a><br />
Goldberg famously said &#8220;Was Hitler Racist?  I&#8217;m not sold.&#8221;</p>
<p>Hows that for being a Nazi apologist? </p>
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		<title>By: Preston Sturges</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/10/01/the-golden-dawn.html#comment-1546509</link>
		<dc:creator>Preston Sturges</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Oct 2012 16:26:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=183357#comment-1546509</guid>
		<description>&gt;&gt;nanny state

As opposed to the glory days of killing the natives then using slaves to cultivate the land.  Or child labor, debtors prison, company stores, and companies using the national Guard to machine gun strikers. 

You know that one of the main themes of any Fascist movement is nostalgia, right?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&gt;&gt;nanny state</p>
<p>As opposed to the glory days of killing the natives then using slaves to cultivate the land.  Or child labor, debtors prison, company stores, and companies using the national Guard to machine gun strikers. </p>
<p>You know that one of the main themes of any Fascist movement is nostalgia, right?</p>
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		<title>By: wysinwyg</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/10/01/the-golden-dawn.html#comment-1546510</link>
		<dc:creator>wysinwyg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Oct 2012 16:26:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=183357#comment-1546510</guid>
		<description>Great quote, although Roosevelt did round up Americans and put them in camps and is probably more directly responsible for the creeping authoritarianism of the executive branch than any other US president.  I know this is a liberal heresy but FDR might be my least favorite president.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great quote, although Roosevelt did round up Americans and put them in camps and is probably more directly responsible for the creeping authoritarianism of the executive branch than any other US president.  I know this is a liberal heresy but FDR might be my least favorite president.</p>
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		<title>By: Preston Sturges</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/10/01/the-golden-dawn.html#comment-1546508</link>
		<dc:creator>Preston Sturges</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Oct 2012 16:25:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=183357#comment-1546508</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s also Dialectics, which was all the rage in Germany of that era.  In dialectics, you adopt the enemies talking points and jargon as a way of &quot;winning&quot; the debate by making the debate impossible. Once everything is made meaningless, people are more likely endorse the use of force. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s also Dialectics, which was all the rage in Germany of that era.  In dialectics, you adopt the enemies talking points and jargon as a way of &#8220;winning&#8221; the debate by making the debate impossible. Once everything is made meaningless, people are more likely endorse the use of force. </p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Preston Sturges</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/10/01/the-golden-dawn.html#comment-1546496</link>
		<dc:creator>Preston Sturges</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Oct 2012 16:14:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=183357#comment-1546496</guid>
		<description>Actually, the Mussolini quote is poorly sourced.

But Wikipedia has a nice list, 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Definitions_of_fascism
and FDR said this to Congress: 

&quot;.......The first truth is that the liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic state itself. That, in its essence, is fascism — ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power.” — Franklin D. Roosevelt, April 29, 1938. Message to congress.

Sounds pretty current, doesn&#039;t it?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Actually, the Mussolini quote is poorly sourced.</p>
<p>But Wikipedia has a nice list, <br />
<a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Definitions_of_fascism" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Definitions_of_fascism</a><br />
and FDR said this to Congress: </p>
<p>&#8220;&#8230;&#8230;.The first truth is that the liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic state itself. That, in its essence, is fascism — ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power.” — Franklin D. Roosevelt, April 29, 1938. Message to congress.</p>
<p>Sounds pretty current, doesn&#8217;t it?</p>
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		<title>By: tsol</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/10/01/the-golden-dawn.html#comment-1546482</link>
		<dc:creator>tsol</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Oct 2012 15:58:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=183357#comment-1546482</guid>
		<description> As opposed to a confiscatory nanny state.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p> As opposed to a confiscatory nanny state.</p>
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	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: wysinwyg</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/10/01/the-golden-dawn.html#comment-1546448</link>
		<dc:creator>wysinwyg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Oct 2012 15:25:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=183357#comment-1546448</guid>
		<description> Yeah, Occupy Wall Street is all about conformitarianism and the status quo, amirite?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p> Yeah, Occupy Wall Street is all about conformitarianism and the status quo, amirite?</p>
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	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: wysinwyg</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/10/01/the-golden-dawn.html#comment-1546445</link>
		<dc:creator>wysinwyg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Oct 2012 15:23:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=183357#comment-1546445</guid>
		<description> Dubious quote is dubious.  Where did Mussolini say that?

Let me save you some time.  There is no record of Mussolini saying that.  He also probably meant something different by &quot;corporatism&quot; than what we think of.

I&#039;m on your side, here, but you can only be the good guys by being principled.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p> Dubious quote is dubious.  Where did Mussolini say that?</p>
<p>Let me save you some time.  There is no record of Mussolini saying that.  He also probably meant something different by &#8220;corporatism&#8221; than what we think of.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m on your side, here, but you can only be the good guys by being principled.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: wysinwyg</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/10/01/the-golden-dawn.html#comment-1546440</link>
		<dc:creator>wysinwyg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Oct 2012 15:15:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=183357#comment-1546440</guid>
		<description> I think the point of the response was to say that false equivalence is false.  &quot;Both ends of the spectrum&quot; imply they&#039;re equally as bad, but from the first-hand accounts that doesn&#039;t sound like an accurate description.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p> I think the point of the response was to say that false equivalence is false.  &#8220;Both ends of the spectrum&#8221; imply they&#8217;re equally as bad, but from the first-hand accounts that doesn&#8217;t sound like an accurate description.</p>
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	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: wysinwyg</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/10/01/the-golden-dawn.html#comment-1546437</link>
		<dc:creator>wysinwyg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Oct 2012 15:11:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=183357#comment-1546437</guid>
		<description> You communicate more clearly in English than most Americans, I&#039;m pretty sure.  Thank you for sharing what&#039;s happening in your country.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p> You communicate more clearly in English than most Americans, I&#8217;m pretty sure.  Thank you for sharing what&#8217;s happening in your country.</p>
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		<title>By: Antonis Pappas</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/10/01/the-golden-dawn.html#comment-1546431</link>
		<dc:creator>Antonis Pappas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Oct 2012 14:57:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=183357#comment-1546431</guid>
		<description>Maddeningly your opinion is shared by a sizeable percentage of my compatriots. You couldn&#039;t tell it by their voting record, or that the used to be covertly funded by at least one of the former mainstream parties.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Maddeningly your opinion is shared by a sizeable percentage of my compatriots. You couldn&#8217;t tell it by their voting record, or that the used to be covertly funded by at least one of the former mainstream parties.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Antonis Pappas</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/10/01/the-golden-dawn.html#comment-1546430</link>
		<dc:creator>Antonis Pappas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Oct 2012 14:55:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=183357#comment-1546430</guid>
		<description>They weren&#039;t unintended consequences. And we could also argue about what &quot;unanimity&quot; means in the context of the EU organizations.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>They weren&#8217;t unintended consequences. And we could also argue about what &#8220;unanimity&#8221; means in the context of the EU organizations.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Antonis Pappas</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/10/01/the-golden-dawn.html#comment-1546429</link>
		<dc:creator>Antonis Pappas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Oct 2012 14:51:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=183357#comment-1546429</guid>
		<description>Golden Dawn is by ultra-religious, anti-union and anti-globalization and pretty much a typical specimen of the far-right paranoia that has engulfed the EU.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Golden Dawn is by ultra-religious, anti-union and anti-globalization and pretty much a typical specimen of the far-right paranoia that has engulfed the EU.</p>
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		<title>By: Roanhouse</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/10/01/the-golden-dawn.html#comment-1546334</link>
		<dc:creator>Roanhouse</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Oct 2012 08:22:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=183357#comment-1546334</guid>
		<description>Actually the father of Fascism, Benito Mussolini, said &quot;Fascism should rightly be called Corporatism, as it is the merger of corporate and government power.&quot; Something that is about the privatization of public assets to companies tightly connected to the government in power. Similar to what is happening in Wisconsin under Gov. Walker and what Paul Ryan and the rest on the tea party right are calling for. So in fact Fascism is an Extreme Right Wing nationalistic ideology to promote privatize everything so that no more public transparency can occur. The hiring of for profit prisons, for profit police forces and military are examples of this too.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Actually the father of Fascism, Benito Mussolini, said &#8221;Fascism should rightly be called Corporatism, as it is the merger of corporate and government power.&#8221; Something that is about the privatization of public assets to companies tightly connected to the government in power. Similar to what is happening in Wisconsin under Gov. Walker and what Paul Ryan and the rest on the tea party right are calling for. So in fact Fascism is an Extreme Right Wing nationalistic ideology to promote privatize everything so that no more public transparency can occur. The hiring of for profit prisons, for profit police forces and military are examples of this too.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Preston Sturges</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/10/01/the-golden-dawn.html#comment-1546317</link>
		<dc:creator>Preston Sturges</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Oct 2012 06:40:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=183357#comment-1546317</guid>
		<description>Umberto Eco&#039;s essay about Ur-Fascism is on line,  He grew up under Mussolini, so he&#039;s qualified to discuss Fascisms distinctly right wing characteristics,  He points out the Italian Fascism was at best very loosely defined.

For this reason, modern neofascists point to Italy as the only &quot;real&quot; Fascism, since that allows them to claim the 20 or so variations of Fascism are actually something else, leaving them free to flaunt to their swatikas.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Umberto Eco&#8217;s essay about Ur-Fascism is on line,  He grew up under Mussolini, so he&#8217;s qualified to discuss Fascisms distinctly right wing characteristics,  He points out the Italian Fascism was at best very loosely defined.</p>
<p>For this reason, modern neofascists point to Italy as the only &#8220;real&#8221; Fascism, since that allows them to claim the 20 or so variations of Fascism are actually something else, leaving them free to flaunt to their swatikas.</p>
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		<title>By: Preston Sturges</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/10/01/the-golden-dawn.html#comment-1546315</link>
		<dc:creator>Preston Sturges</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Oct 2012 06:34:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=183357#comment-1546315</guid>
		<description>That was back when &quot;Republican&quot; literally meant to be in favor of a strong federal government.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That was back when &#8220;Republican&#8221; literally meant to be in favor of a strong federal government.</p>
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