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	<title>Comments on: Google’s driver-less cars and robot&#160;morality</title>
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	<description>Brain candy for Happy Mutants</description>
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		<title>By: Bad Juju</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/11/27/googles-driver-less-cars-an.html#comment-1594370</link>
		<dc:creator>Bad Juju</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Nov 2012 07:17:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=196574#comment-1594370</guid>
		<description>Sorry, it&#039;s not very exciting. Think &#039;pylons&#039;: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZF8N9NItHI</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry, it&#8217;s not very exciting. Think &#8216;pylons&#8217;: <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZF8N9NItHI" rel="nofollow">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZF8N9NItHI</a></p>
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		<title>By: jandrese</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/11/27/googles-driver-less-cars-an.html#comment-1593957</link>
		<dc:creator>jandrese</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Nov 2012 20:30:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=196574#comment-1593957</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t think they&#039;re going to outlaw human vehicle operation in my lifetime, even if robotic cars become the norm.  There are just too many entrenched interests (and lawmakers are old nostalgic people) for it to happen.  Maybe in 100 years when the people making the laws have only known robotic cars and most of what they know about human driven ones are that they make the news when they cause some terrible accident and people like to run them around racetracks still.  Plus, given how long people hold on to cars it would be hard to be even majority robot controlled by 2040, especially if the robotic controls are expensive (they will be).  

Look at the road today.  There are still lots and lots of cars from the 90s out there, and a good number from the 80s.  With the improvements in rust proofing and paint that were made in the 90s, in addition to better manufacturing of engines and transmissions, those 90s cars are likely to be around for many years still.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t think they&#8217;re going to outlaw human vehicle operation in my lifetime, even if robotic cars become the norm.  There are just too many entrenched interests (and lawmakers are old nostalgic people) for it to happen.  Maybe in 100 years when the people making the laws have only known robotic cars and most of what they know about human driven ones are that they make the news when they cause some terrible accident and people like to run them around racetracks still.  Plus, given how long people hold on to cars it would be hard to be even majority robot controlled by 2040, especially if the robotic controls are expensive (they will be).  </p>
<p>Look at the road today.  There are still lots and lots of cars from the 90s out there, and a good number from the 80s.  With the improvements in rust proofing and paint that were made in the 90s, in addition to better manufacturing of engines and transmissions, those 90s cars are likely to be around for many years still.</p>
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		<title>By: ChickieD</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/11/27/googles-driver-less-cars-an.html#comment-1593716</link>
		<dc:creator>ChickieD</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Nov 2012 17:24:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=196574#comment-1593716</guid>
		<description>I agree with all the above comments that these do not pose any ethical problems.

I am a huge fan of this technology. Where I live, there are a ton of older people on the road who should not be driving, and these robot cars are a game changer - I would prefer to be driving behind a robot car than an elderly person with poor vision and poor reflexes. I think the roads will be a million times safer when we all have robot cars. 

Many years ago when the DC Metro system was launched, it had driverless trains. There was such an outcry about it that they had to add drivers into the system. I am worried that when the Google cars go to market, there will be a similar backlash, totally undermining all the benefits of automating cars.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with all the above comments that these do not pose any ethical problems.</p>
<p>I am a huge fan of this technology. Where I live, there are a ton of older people on the road who should not be driving, and these robot cars are a game changer &#8211; I would prefer to be driving behind a robot car than an elderly person with poor vision and poor reflexes. I think the roads will be a million times safer when we all have robot cars. </p>
<p>Many years ago when the DC Metro system was launched, it had driverless trains. There was such an outcry about it that they had to add drivers into the system. I am worried that when the Google cars go to market, there will be a similar backlash, totally undermining all the benefits of automating cars.</p>
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		<title>By: AlexG55</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/11/27/googles-driver-less-cars-an.html#comment-1593462</link>
		<dc:creator>AlexG55</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Nov 2012 11:27:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=196574#comment-1593462</guid>
		<description>I think the Swedish Road Safety Administration have built one...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think the Swedish Road Safety Administration have built one&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: NelC</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/11/27/googles-driver-less-cars-an.html#comment-1593429</link>
		<dc:creator>NelC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Nov 2012 09:34:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=196574#comment-1593429</guid>
		<description>Now I&#039;m imagining a crash-test moose dummy....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Now I&#8217;m imagining a crash-test moose dummy&#8230;.</p>
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		<title>By: Jonathan Roberts</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/11/27/googles-driver-less-cars-an.html#comment-1593408</link>
		<dc:creator>Jonathan Roberts</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Nov 2012 07:52:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=196574#comment-1593408</guid>
		<description>Or perhaps not properly maintaining it. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Or perhaps not properly maintaining it. </p>
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		<title>By: tom digenti</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/11/27/googles-driver-less-cars-an.html#comment-1593237</link>
		<dc:creator>tom digenti</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Nov 2012 02:51:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=196574#comment-1593237</guid>
		<description>cant compare a bird to a bunch load of kids</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>cant compare a bird to a bunch load of kids</p>
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		<title>By: traalfaz</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/11/27/googles-driver-less-cars-an.html#comment-1593236</link>
		<dc:creator>traalfaz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Nov 2012 02:50:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=196574#comment-1593236</guid>
		<description>Robots can not have morality. The people who program them have morality (or not) and are limited to what they can think of ahead of time. There have been systems that have been capable of programmatically saving or killing people for years now.

The reality is that even if a robotic car makes the wrong choice and kills people, that&#039;s regrettable, but it&#039;s almost impossible to argue that robotic cars won&#039;t save far more lives than they will cost. The average driver is so bad that it&#039;s just going to be better. Heck, it already is. I read earlier this week that Googles cars have now amassed hundreds of thousands of miles and have been involved with exactly one accident, which was deemed to be completely the fault of the other (human) driver.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Robots can not have morality. The people who program them have morality (or not) and are limited to what they can think of ahead of time. There have been systems that have been capable of programmatically saving or killing people for years now.</p>
<p>The reality is that even if a robotic car makes the wrong choice and kills people, that&#8217;s regrettable, but it&#8217;s almost impossible to argue that robotic cars won&#8217;t save far more lives than they will cost. The average driver is so bad that it&#8217;s just going to be better. Heck, it already is. I read earlier this week that Googles cars have now amassed hundreds of thousands of miles and have been involved with exactly one accident, which was deemed to be completely the fault of the other (human) driver.</p>
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		<title>By: AlexG55</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/11/27/googles-driver-less-cars-an.html#comment-1593206</link>
		<dc:creator>AlexG55</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Nov 2012 02:10:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=196574#comment-1593206</guid>
		<description>An airliner still has to have a licensed pilot alert and sitting at the controls at all times, even if the autopilot is actually flying it. The Google car wouldn&#039;t have this (it would be fairly pointless if it did).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>An airliner still has to have a licensed pilot alert and sitting at the controls at all times, even if the autopilot is actually flying it. The Google car wouldn&#8217;t have this (it would be fairly pointless if it did).</p>
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		<title>By: AlexG55</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/11/27/googles-driver-less-cars-an.html#comment-1593205</link>
		<dc:creator>AlexG55</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Nov 2012 02:09:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=196574#comment-1593205</guid>
		<description>Sweden is moose country, which is why they have the &quot;moose test&quot;- all new cars sold there have to be able to remain stable while swerving at high speeds without braking. Even a Volvo won&#039;t survive hitting a moose.

You just have to hope the oncoming lane is empty for you to swerve into...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sweden is moose country, which is why they have the &#8220;moose test&#8221;- all new cars sold there have to be able to remain stable while swerving at high speeds without braking. Even a Volvo won&#8217;t survive hitting a moose.</p>
<p>You just have to hope the oncoming lane is empty for you to swerve into&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Ignatz Homenez</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/11/27/googles-driver-less-cars-an.html#comment-1593190</link>
		<dc:creator>Ignatz Homenez</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Nov 2012 01:50:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=196574#comment-1593190</guid>
		<description>I think we should separate the legal from the ethical from the moral.  Only the law would really be at play other than in the minds of the people involved or in the media, community, etc.  The law would come into play in a couple of ways potentially.  The first is whether a criminal statute was breached.  Was the driver (regardless of swerve and miss, hit, attempt to swerve and fail to miss, et cetera) criminally negligent?  Or vehicular homicide or whatever criminal laws are in effect in the jurisdiction.  If so, then the state may prosecute someone, whether that is the driver, the programmer, a company and so on, i.e. the criminally-responsible party.  Not much changes, though it may be much harder to prove that a team of Google and Ford programmers was criminally responsible for an accident.

Let&#039;s say there is no criminal statute breached, then we&#039;re on to civil liability.  Again, the most likely head of damages is negligence - your action or failure to act caused my injury in a way you could have reasonably avoided.  But again you would have to prove negligence on the part of the programmers, the car, the driver, the bus, or some combination thereof.

I think it&#039;s entirely possible that most accidents which occur might not meet either a criminal or civil standard, leaving no one at fault for the accident.  Good legislation could cure what ambiguity exists - we can readily imagine a social compact in the form of laws which essentially remove liability unless manifest negligence is found.  We already accept that people are injured and die despite the best intentions of the engineers behind other safety mechanism like air bags, so it&#039;s really not that far a stretch to say that autonomous automobiles are themselves akin to this - a very remote risk of injury or death is simply part of the system we accept.

Finally, there are plenty of areas (depending on which jurisdiction you live in) where we accept injury or death without either criminal or civil penalty, e.g. law enforcement, standard error rates in surgeries, etc.  I think we can solve this if the public and political will is there to create the right legal environment, assuming of course the tech is really that foolproof.

TL;DR: morals and ethics aside, only the criminal and civil law will really matter, which is a solvable problem by legislatures.  The barrier is social and political will to a legal problem, not an ethical one.



</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think we should separate the legal from the ethical from the moral.  Only the law would really be at play other than in the minds of the people involved or in the media, community, etc.  The law would come into play in a couple of ways potentially.  The first is whether a criminal statute was breached.  Was the driver (regardless of swerve and miss, hit, attempt to swerve and fail to miss, et cetera) criminally negligent?  Or vehicular homicide or whatever criminal laws are in effect in the jurisdiction.  If so, then the state may prosecute someone, whether that is the driver, the programmer, a company and so on, i.e. the criminally-responsible party.  Not much changes, though it may be much harder to prove that a team of Google and Ford programmers was criminally responsible for an accident.</p>
<p>Let&#8217;s say there is no criminal statute breached, then we&#8217;re on to civil liability.  Again, the most likely head of damages is negligence &#8211; your action or failure to act caused my injury in a way you could have reasonably avoided.  But again you would have to prove negligence on the part of the programmers, the car, the driver, the bus, or some combination thereof.</p>
<p>I think it&#8217;s entirely possible that most accidents which occur might not meet either a criminal or civil standard, leaving no one at fault for the accident.  Good legislation could cure what ambiguity exists &#8211; we can readily imagine a social compact in the form of laws which essentially remove liability unless manifest negligence is found.  We already accept that people are injured and die despite the best intentions of the engineers behind other safety mechanism like air bags, so it&#8217;s really not that far a stretch to say that autonomous automobiles are themselves akin to this &#8211; a very remote risk of injury or death is simply part of the system we accept.</p>
<p>Finally, there are plenty of areas (depending on which jurisdiction you live in) where we accept injury or death without either criminal or civil penalty, e.g. law enforcement, standard error rates in surgeries, etc.  I think we can solve this if the public and political will is there to create the right legal environment, assuming of course the tech is really that foolproof.</p>
<p>TL;DR: morals and ethics aside, only the criminal and civil law will really matter, which is a solvable problem by legislatures.  The barrier is social and political will to a legal problem, not an ethical one.</p>
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		<title>By: tom digenti</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/11/27/googles-driver-less-cars-an.html#comment-1593163</link>
		<dc:creator>tom digenti</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Nov 2012 01:33:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=196574#comment-1593163</guid>
		<description>I think legally, morally, whatever, you have to swerve; don&#039;t you?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think legally, morally, whatever, you have to swerve; don&#8217;t you?</p>
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		<title>By: Mark Dow</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/11/27/googles-driver-less-cars-an.html#comment-1593118</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Dow</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Nov 2012 00:49:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=196574#comment-1593118</guid>
		<description>Perhaps your microwave shares this opinion.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Perhaps your microwave shares this opinion.</p>
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		<title>By: John Fleming</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/11/27/googles-driver-less-cars-an.html#comment-1593114</link>
		<dc:creator>John Fleming</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Nov 2012 00:45:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=196574#comment-1593114</guid>
		<description>IMHO, consciousness is a Thing, a real Thing, that all the mechanistic reductionists in the world cannot explain away. Explanatory Gap 4 Evah!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>IMHO, consciousness is a Thing, a real Thing, that all the mechanistic reductionists in the world cannot explain away. Explanatory Gap 4 Evah!</p>
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		<title>By: Jacob Ewing</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/11/27/googles-driver-less-cars-an.html#comment-1593111</link>
		<dc:creator>Jacob Ewing</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Nov 2012 00:39:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=196574#comment-1593111</guid>
		<description>The problem with this article is that the author seems to have a very science-fiction based concept of how robots work (Clearly demonstrated with his Asimov reference).  The ability to control a vehicle, navigate, and do all of the other countless things that humans do when driving is completely separate from any ethics.

This is akin to saying that the auto-pilot systems used in airliners need to make moral decisions when a bird approaches their jet engines.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The problem with this article is that the author seems to have a very science-fiction based concept of how robots work (Clearly demonstrated with his Asimov reference).  The ability to control a vehicle, navigate, and do all of the other countless things that humans do when driving is completely separate from any ethics.</p>
<p>This is akin to saying that the auto-pilot systems used in airliners need to make moral decisions when a bird approaches their jet engines.</p>
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		<title>By: bkad</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/11/27/googles-driver-less-cars-an.html#comment-1593109</link>
		<dc:creator>bkad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Nov 2012 00:36:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=196574#comment-1593109</guid>
		<description>As others point out, humans in accidents like that described are not likely doing complicated ethical thinking, but are just trying to avoid the accident entirely. And I at least would not judge anyone making a snap decision between two bad outcomes.

As far as legal issues go, don&#039;t many US states already have the concept of &#039;no fault&#039; accidents? [after wiki research: no, only 12 do, and usually only for minor accidents. But these are probably the majority.] These systems basically say, &#039;each insurance company covers its own client; no one even bothers trying to determine responsibility&#039;. Probably driver-less car accidents could be handled by an evolutionary (not a revolutionary) expansion of no-fault insurance law. Some cases would come down to actual owner negligence (e.g., not maintaining brakes) or manufacturer defect (stuck accelerator pedals) but these would be edge cases.

Maybe I&#039;m too optimistic, but thankfully this is not going to be an overnight transformation.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As others point out, humans in accidents like that described are not likely doing complicated ethical thinking, but are just trying to avoid the accident entirely. And I at least would not judge anyone making a snap decision between two bad outcomes.</p>
<p>As far as legal issues go, don&#8217;t many US states already have the concept of &#8216;no fault&#8217; accidents? [after wiki research: no, only 12 do, and usually only for minor accidents. But these are probably the majority.] These systems basically say, &#8216;each insurance company covers its own client; no one even bothers trying to determine responsibility&#8217;. Probably driver-less car accidents could be handled by an evolutionary (not a revolutionary) expansion of no-fault insurance law. Some cases would come down to actual owner negligence (e.g., not maintaining brakes) or manufacturer defect (stuck accelerator pedals) but these would be edge cases.</p>
<p>Maybe I&#8217;m too optimistic, but thankfully this is not going to be an overnight transformation.</p>
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		<title>By: Gilbert Wham</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/11/27/googles-driver-less-cars-an.html#comment-1593094</link>
		<dc:creator>Gilbert Wham</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Nov 2012 00:26:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=196574#comment-1593094</guid>
		<description> Something awful and demented will happen. Probably in Florida.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p> Something awful and demented will happen. Probably in Florida.</p>
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		<title>By: Gilbert Wham</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/11/27/googles-driver-less-cars-an.html#comment-1593092</link>
		<dc:creator>Gilbert Wham</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Nov 2012 00:24:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=196574#comment-1593092</guid>
		<description> So the story goes, a Volvo flack was once asked &#039;Why do you build such strong cars?&#039; The answer was, apparently, &#039;Moose&#039;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p> So the story goes, a Volvo flack was once asked &#8216;Why do you build such strong cars?&#8217; The answer was, apparently, &#8216;Moose&#8217;.</p>
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		<title>By: Gilbert Wham</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/11/27/googles-driver-less-cars-an.html#comment-1593090</link>
		<dc:creator>Gilbert Wham</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Nov 2012 00:22:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=196574#comment-1593090</guid>
		<description> A reflective microwave oven would immediately self-destruct anyway.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p> A reflective microwave oven would immediately self-destruct anyway.</p>
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		<title>By: Boundegar</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/11/27/googles-driver-less-cars-an.html#comment-1593079</link>
		<dc:creator>Boundegar</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Nov 2012 00:15:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=196574#comment-1593079</guid>
		<description>Very good point.  I for one wouldn&#039;t need to calculate the exact number of children my life is worth (it&#039;s 4 or 5.)  I would just say bad words and turn the wheel.

The reason this will never happen is because the first time there&#039;s an accident, the software company gets sued into oblivion.  The lawyers would never let this proposal come to market.  In fact, driverless cars are very unlikely for the same reason.  They need a driver to blame.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Very good point.  I for one wouldn&#8217;t need to calculate the exact number of children my life is worth (it&#8217;s 4 or 5.)  I would just say bad words and turn the wheel.</p>
<p>The reason this will never happen is because the first time there&#8217;s an accident, the software company gets sued into oblivion.  The lawyers would never let this proposal come to market.  In fact, driverless cars are very unlikely for the same reason.  They need a driver to blame.</p>
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		<title>By: Mathias Frank</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/11/27/googles-driver-less-cars-an.html#comment-1593001</link>
		<dc:creator>Mathias Frank</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Nov 2012 23:13:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=196574#comment-1593001</guid>
		<description>These question if machines can &quot;learn&quot; the concept of ethics is still to be answered. And if that was the case, if they could execute this concept in extreme situations where several values have to be copared and a complex ethcal cosideration has to be made. I am very curious what we will learn about this in the future.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>These question if machines can &#8220;learn&#8221; the concept of ethics is still to be answered. And if that was the case, if they could execute this concept in extreme situations where several values have to be copared and a complex ethcal cosideration has to be made. I am very curious what we will learn about this in the future.</p>
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		<title>By: andygates</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/11/27/googles-driver-less-cars-an.html#comment-1593000</link>
		<dc:creator>andygates</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Nov 2012 23:12:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=196574#comment-1593000</guid>
		<description>It would brake.  Swerving is bad.  Braking might get the car behind you up your arse, but that&#039;s a much safer thing and hey, the computer already knows that car&#039;s proximity and has a hair trigger on the airbags. 

Interesting that this strain of robotics is getting ethical thinking, while army bots get more and more killy.  </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It would brake.  Swerving is bad.  Braking might get the car behind you up your arse, but that&#8217;s a much safer thing and hey, the computer already knows that car&#8217;s proximity and has a hair trigger on the airbags. </p>
<p>Interesting that this strain of robotics is getting ethical thinking, while army bots get more and more killy.  </p>
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		<title>By: ocker3</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/11/27/googles-driver-less-cars-an.html#comment-1592961</link>
		<dc:creator>ocker3</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Nov 2012 22:47:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=196574#comment-1592961</guid>
		<description> I don&#039;t want a robot car so I can sit there ready to take over if it fails, I want a robot car so I can eat, read, watch a movie or grab a quickie during transit</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p> I don&#8217;t want a robot car so I can sit there ready to take over if it fails, I want a robot car so I can eat, read, watch a movie or grab a quickie during transit</p>
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		<title>By: Harvey</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/11/27/googles-driver-less-cars-an.html#comment-1592956</link>
		<dc:creator>Harvey</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Nov 2012 22:41:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=196574#comment-1592956</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s a question of liability, not ethics. If the driver hits the bus, the &quot;errant&quot; bus was at fault. If the driver swerves to miss and hits the other bus that they didn&#039;t see, the driver is 100% liable. Sorry, but the law demands you hit the brakes and possibly the children.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s a question of liability, not ethics. If the driver hits the bus, the &#8220;errant&#8221; bus was at fault. If the driver swerves to miss and hits the other bus that they didn&#8217;t see, the driver is 100% liable. Sorry, but the law demands you hit the brakes and possibly the children.</p>
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		<title>By: Carl Johnson</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/11/27/googles-driver-less-cars-an.html#comment-1592949</link>
		<dc:creator>Carl Johnson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Nov 2012 22:32:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=196574#comment-1592949</guid>
		<description>So there&#039;s one hypothetical, which might happen one time in 10 million. Here&#039;s another one: someone gets behind the wheel after too much drinking/drugging/distracted/whathaveyou. That happens tens of thousands of times a day. Shall we prevent the possible occurrence of the hypothetical, or should we let technology help us address the sad reality that too many people make idiotic choices every day that put ALL of us, not just the 40 kids on that pretend bus, at risk?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So there&#8217;s one hypothetical, which might happen one time in 10 million. Here&#8217;s another one: someone gets behind the wheel after too much drinking/drugging/distracted/whathaveyou. That happens tens of thousands of times a day. Shall we prevent the possible occurrence of the hypothetical, or should we let technology help us address the sad reality that too many people make idiotic choices every day that put ALL of us, not just the 40 kids on that pretend bus, at risk?</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: cdh1971</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/11/27/googles-driver-less-cars-an.html#comment-1592929</link>
		<dc:creator>cdh1971</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Nov 2012 22:16:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=196574#comment-1592929</guid>
		<description>And if there are any witnesses. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And if there are any witnesses. </p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: cdh1971</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/11/27/googles-driver-less-cars-an.html#comment-1592927</link>
		<dc:creator>cdh1971</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Nov 2012 22:14:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=196574#comment-1592927</guid>
		<description>--------&quot;it&#039;s OK to kill Hitler&quot;---------

No, no, no. 

It&#039;s _not_ okay to kill Hitler. That would be time tampering and could get you committed to a Federation penal colony for a very, very, long time. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;&#8221;it&#8217;s OK to kill Hitler&#8221;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;</p>
<p>No, no, no. </p>
<p>It&#8217;s _not_ okay to kill Hitler. That would be time tampering and could get you committed to a Federation penal colony for a very, very, long time. </p>
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		<title>By: Mister44</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/11/27/googles-driver-less-cars-an.html#comment-1592918</link>
		<dc:creator>Mister44</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Nov 2012 22:07:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=196574#comment-1592918</guid>
		<description>I wonder if in my life time all cars will be robotically driven. If you want to drive your own car you would have to go to a special closed course for that sort of thing. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I wonder if in my life time all cars will be robotically driven. If you want to drive your own car you would have to go to a special closed course for that sort of thing. </p>
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		<title>By: Edward</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/11/27/googles-driver-less-cars-an.html#comment-1592913</link>
		<dc:creator>Edward</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Nov 2012 22:03:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=196574#comment-1592913</guid>
		<description>having all automated cars far fewer accidents will occur, ethical thinking or not. no drunk drivers no texting drivers, no drivers doing their nails. sounds great.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>having all automated cars far fewer accidents will occur, ethical thinking or not. no drunk drivers no texting drivers, no drivers doing their nails. sounds great.</p>
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		<title>By: fragmuffin</title>
		<link>http://boingboing.net/2012/11/27/googles-driver-less-cars-an.html#comment-1592911</link>
		<dc:creator>fragmuffin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Nov 2012 22:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boingboing.net/?p=196574#comment-1592911</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t think the question of driverless car ethics is going to come up in the foreseeable future. Presumably, we&#039;re a long way off from a comprehensive AI network that coordinates cars to execute a strategy that minimizes human loss.

Instead, we&#039;ll see cars using information from the environment and data from neighboring vehicles, and use a dumb local strategy to avoid hitting things. We can discuss emergent phenomena from that, such as an overall reduction in accidents, but ethical reasoning is not among those phenomena. Think bees protecting the hive, not soldiers protecting a fortress.

Now, it is plausible, without strong AI, for driverless cars to execute non-local strategies, but those decisions would have been made in advance by engineers. Cars would have to coordinate their information, consult a massive and detailed database of no-win scenarios, and execute predetermined strategies based on the ethical choices of the engineers. And since Google will not always hold a monopoly on driverless cars, that database would have to be a cooperative, standardized effort by all manufacturers. Technically, this is possible. Practically, it seems pretty far-fetched.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t think the question of driverless car ethics is going to come up in the foreseeable future. Presumably, we&#8217;re a long way off from a comprehensive AI network that coordinates cars to execute a strategy that minimizes human loss.</p>
<p>Instead, we&#8217;ll see cars using information from the environment and data from neighboring vehicles, and use a dumb local strategy to avoid hitting things. We can discuss emergent phenomena from that, such as an overall reduction in accidents, but ethical reasoning is not among those phenomena. Think bees protecting the hive, not soldiers protecting a fortress.</p>
<p>Now, it is plausible, without strong AI, for driverless cars to execute non-local strategies, but those decisions would have been made in advance by engineers. Cars would have to coordinate their information, consult a massive and detailed database of no-win scenarios, and execute predetermined strategies based on the ethical choices of the engineers. And since Google will not always hold a monopoly on driverless cars, that database would have to be a cooperative, standardized effort by all manufacturers. Technically, this is possible. Practically, it seems pretty far-fetched.</p>
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