Comments on: Anti-Westboro Baptist Church petition smashes White House records http://boingboing.net/2012/12/27/anti-westboro-baptist-church-p.html Brain candy for Happy Mutants Sat, 25 May 2013 02:22:00 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.4.1 By: Antinous / Moderator http://boingboing.net/2012/12/27/anti-westboro-baptist-church-p.html#comment-1616724 Antinous / Moderator Fri, 28 Dec 2012 21:35:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=202939#comment-1616724 That's not even vaguely true. Harassment doesn't have to carry a threat of physical injury, although in California, threat of injury gets you out of having to pay the filing fee. That’s not even vaguely true. Harassment doesn’t have to carry a threat of physical injury, although in California, threat of injury gets you out of having to pay the filing fee.

]]> By: C W http://boingboing.net/2012/12/27/anti-westboro-baptist-church-p.html#comment-1616438 C W Fri, 28 Dec 2012 16:40:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=202939#comment-1616438 They wouldn't be top-notch if they would take on so many losing cases. They wouldn’t be top-notch if they would take on so many losing cases.

]]> By: C W http://boingboing.net/2012/12/27/anti-westboro-baptist-church-p.html#comment-1616436 C W Fri, 28 Dec 2012 16:39:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=202939#comment-1616436 "please explain why the whole raft of laws and regulations used against normal protesters don't get used against the WBC" Because they are not challenging Capitalist entities. “please explain why the whole raft of laws and regulations used against normal protesters don’t get used against the WBC”

Because they are not challenging Capitalist entities.

]]> By: C W http://boingboing.net/2012/12/27/anti-westboro-baptist-church-p.html#comment-1616433 C W Fri, 28 Dec 2012 16:36:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=202939#comment-1616433 http://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2012/11/its-time-to-stop-using-the-fire-in-a-crowded-theater-quote/264449/ http://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2012/11/its-time-to-stop-using-the-fire-in-a-crowded-theater-quote/264449/

]]> By: C W http://boingboing.net/2012/12/27/anti-westboro-baptist-church-p.html#comment-1616431 C W Fri, 28 Dec 2012 16:34:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=202939#comment-1616431 "In the USA, there is an official, Government-maintained list of "hate groups" that the President can unilaterally add to?  Really?" No, not really. “In the USA, there is an official, Government-maintained list of “hate groups” that the President can unilaterally add to?  Really?”

No, not really.

]]> By: C W http://boingboing.net/2012/12/27/anti-westboro-baptist-church-p.html#comment-1616426 C W Fri, 28 Dec 2012 16:32:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=202939#comment-1616426 "Follow the exact letter of the law" And when the Supremes determine that your free speech is not free through "designated protest zones", what then? “Follow the exact letter of the law”

And when the Supremes determine that your free speech is not free through “designated protest zones”, what then?

]]> By: C W http://boingboing.net/2012/12/27/anti-westboro-baptist-church-p.html#comment-1616425 C W Fri, 28 Dec 2012 16:31:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=202939#comment-1616425 Legitimate religions don't do well when they actively protest against entrenched systems either. WBC isn't challenging anything of significance. Legitimate religions don’t do well when they actively protest against entrenched systems either. WBC isn’t challenging anything of significance.

]]> By: C W http://boingboing.net/2012/12/27/anti-westboro-baptist-church-p.html#comment-1616397 C W Fri, 28 Dec 2012 15:20:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=202939#comment-1616397 If you're in no physical danger and no threats are made, you're not going to get a restraining order simply because your feelings were hurt. If you’re in no physical danger and no threats are made, you’re not going to get a restraining order simply because your feelings were hurt.

]]> By: C W http://boingboing.net/2012/12/27/anti-westboro-baptist-church-p.html#comment-1616396 C W Fri, 28 Dec 2012 15:19:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=202939#comment-1616396 Fred Phelps is that "Pope" Fred Phelps is that “Pope”

]]> By: C W http://boingboing.net/2012/12/27/anti-westboro-baptist-church-p.html#comment-1616395 C W Fri, 28 Dec 2012 15:18:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=202939#comment-1616395 Why? Everybody knows they're assholes. Why? Everybody knows they’re assholes.

]]> By: C W http://boingboing.net/2012/12/27/anti-westboro-baptist-church-p.html#comment-1616390 C W Fri, 28 Dec 2012 15:13:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=202939#comment-1616390 The results of confronting the victims of physical and mental abuse are pretty predictable. The results of confronting the victims of physical and mental abuse are pretty predictable.

]]> By: C W http://boingboing.net/2012/12/27/anti-westboro-baptist-church-p.html#comment-1616388 C W Fri, 28 Dec 2012 15:10:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=202939#comment-1616388 They do hold regular services, though. They do hold regular services, though.

]]> By: C W http://boingboing.net/2012/12/27/anti-westboro-baptist-church-p.html#comment-1616387 C W Fri, 28 Dec 2012 15:08:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=202939#comment-1616387 It's not specious. They're certainly more sincere about their beliefs than any megachurch out there. It’s not specious. They’re certainly more sincere about their beliefs than any megachurch out there.

]]> By: C W http://boingboing.net/2012/12/27/anti-westboro-baptist-church-p.html#comment-1616379 C W Fri, 28 Dec 2012 14:25:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=202939#comment-1616379 The WBC isn't the sort to incite violent rebellion using the US Military for training, so this would not apply, still. The WBC isn’t the sort to incite violent rebellion using the US Military for training, so this would not apply, still.

]]> By: fuzzyfuzzyfungus http://boingboing.net/2012/12/27/anti-westboro-baptist-church-p.html#comment-1616378 fuzzyfuzzyfungus Fri, 28 Dec 2012 14:24:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=202939#comment-1616378 Unfortunately, it isn't exactly news that the American electorate has a very fuzzy understanding of what The President actually has the power to do. Worse, The President(s) have tended toward a rather <em> vigorous </em> flavor of the same fuzzy understanding... Unfortunately, it isn’t exactly news that the American electorate has a very fuzzy understanding of what The President actually has the power to do.

Worse, The President(s) have tended toward a rather  vigorous  flavor of the same fuzzy understanding…

]]> By: C W http://boingboing.net/2012/12/27/anti-westboro-baptist-church-p.html#comment-1616377 C W Fri, 28 Dec 2012 14:23:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=202939#comment-1616377 Just as ungrounded in reality as people who think there's a federal hate group list. (There is not any such thing as "cult" classification either.) Just as ungrounded in reality as people who think there’s a federal hate group list.

(There is not any such thing as “cult” classification either.)

]]> By: Daemonworks http://boingboing.net/2012/12/27/anti-westboro-baptist-church-p.html#comment-1616365 Daemonworks Fri, 28 Dec 2012 12:13:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=202939#comment-1616365 Same actually. That is, until I manage to figure out how to get myself recognized as a church. Same actually. That is, until I manage to figure out how to get myself recognized as a church.

]]> By: jimmoffet http://boingboing.net/2012/12/27/anti-westboro-baptist-church-p.html#comment-1616315 jimmoffet Fri, 28 Dec 2012 06:02:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=202939#comment-1616315 Try looking up what kind of demonstration of public service it takes these days to keep a lease on publicly-owned electromagnetic spectrum.  It's not any better for demonstrating public service to the IRS. I don't think it's simply a matter of people not being held accountable. I suspect the process for making a determination resides on a dusty index-card, the whereabouts of which passed from knowledge with the death of a withered old bureaucrat sometime before the fall of the Berlin Wall. Try looking up what kind of demonstration of public service it takes these days to keep a lease on publicly-owned electromagnetic spectrum. 

It’s not any better for demonstrating public service to the IRS. I don’t think it’s simply a matter of people not being held accountable. I suspect the process for making a determination resides on a dusty index-card, the whereabouts of which passed from knowledge with the death of a withered old bureaucrat sometime before the fall of the Berlin Wall.

]]> By: Antinous / Moderator http://boingboing.net/2012/12/27/anti-westboro-baptist-church-p.html#comment-1616290 Antinous / Moderator Fri, 28 Dec 2012 04:41:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=202939#comment-1616290 No, we want all religions to be treated like any other type of business. No, we want all religions to be treated like any other type of business.

]]> By: Eli Dickinson http://boingboing.net/2012/12/27/anti-westboro-baptist-church-p.html#comment-1616277 Eli Dickinson Fri, 28 Dec 2012 04:11:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=202939#comment-1616277 It's remarkable how many petitions on the Whitehouse site ask for things that the Whitehouse cannot possibly provide. There is no Whitehouse "hate group" list. I guess Obama could issue a proclamation on nice letterhead that calls them a hate group... but it would carry no force of law. And (thankfully) the Whitehouse also does not have the ability to tax groups differently based on what they believe. It’s remarkable how many petitions on the Whitehouse site ask for things that the Whitehouse cannot possibly provide.

There is no Whitehouse “hate group” list. I guess Obama could issue a proclamation on nice letterhead that calls them a hate group… but it would carry no force of law. And (thankfully) the Whitehouse also does not have the ability to tax groups differently based on what they believe.

]]> By: Eli Dickinson http://boingboing.net/2012/12/27/anti-westboro-baptist-church-p.html#comment-1616274 Eli Dickinson Fri, 28 Dec 2012 04:07:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=202939#comment-1616274 You really want the government deciding dividing religions into "good" and "bad" ? You really want the government deciding dividing religions into “good” and “bad” ?

]]> By: Eli Dickinson http://boingboing.net/2012/12/27/anti-westboro-baptist-church-p.html#comment-1616273 Eli Dickinson Fri, 28 Dec 2012 04:06:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=202939#comment-1616273 The list isn't public so it's entirely possible WBC is already on it. Regardless, it carries no legal weight. It's just a list of groups the FBI is keeping an eye on. The canonical "hate group list" is maintained by the Southern Poverty Law Center, the WBC is already on it, and it definitely has no force of law. The list isn’t public so it’s entirely possible WBC is already on it. Regardless, it carries no legal weight. It’s just a list of groups the FBI is keeping an eye on.

The canonical “hate group list” is maintained by the Southern Poverty Law Center, the WBC is already on it, and it definitely has no force of law.

]]> By: Eli Dickinson http://boingboing.net/2012/12/27/anti-westboro-baptist-church-p.html#comment-1616272 Eli Dickinson Fri, 28 Dec 2012 04:04:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=202939#comment-1616272 It's ok, because there is no such list. Not that has anything to do with the Whitehouse, anyway. And the President doesn't get to take away groups' tax exempt status because he doesn't like them either. The petition is bogus. It’s ok, because there is no such list. Not that has anything to do with the Whitehouse, anyway. And the President doesn’t get to take away groups’ tax exempt status because he doesn’t like them either. The petition is bogus.

]]> By: matthew731 http://boingboing.net/2012/12/27/anti-westboro-baptist-church-p.html#comment-1616254 matthew731 Fri, 28 Dec 2012 02:58:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=202939#comment-1616254 This has been one of my biggest questions about this effort.  I don't think that there is such a list maintained by the government.  The Southern Poverty Law Center ain't a government entity. This has been one of my biggest questions about this effort.  I don’t think that there is such a list maintained by the government.  The Southern Poverty Law Center ain’t a government entity.

]]> By: nowimnothing http://boingboing.net/2012/12/27/anti-westboro-baptist-church-p.html#comment-1616248 nowimnothing Fri, 28 Dec 2012 02:32:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=202939#comment-1616248 They are very careful to follow laws and regulations. Many of the places they go probably do not have many or very specific laws against public assembly before they get there. They are very careful to follow laws and regulations. Many of the places they go probably do not have many or very specific laws against public assembly before they get there.

]]> By: nowimnothing http://boingboing.net/2012/12/27/anti-westboro-baptist-church-p.html#comment-1616247 nowimnothing Fri, 28 Dec 2012 02:29:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=202939#comment-1616247 How about religions keep their tax exemptions for their soup kitchens but multimillion-dollar mega churches are right out. How about religions keep their tax exemptions for their soup kitchens but multimillion-dollar mega churches are right out.

]]> By: nowimnothing http://boingboing.net/2012/12/27/anti-westboro-baptist-church-p.html#comment-1616246 nowimnothing Fri, 28 Dec 2012 02:26:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=202939#comment-1616246 Send several of your members through law school. Follow the exact letter of the law instead of the intent.  Not too dissimilar from the bath salts phenomenon, where they keep tweaking the ingredient list to avoid new laws. Send several of your members through law school. Follow the exact letter of the law instead of the intent. 
Not too dissimilar from the bath salts phenomenon, where they keep tweaking the ingredient list to avoid new laws.

]]> By: Velocirapt42 http://boingboing.net/2012/12/27/anti-westboro-baptist-church-p.html#comment-1616233 Velocirapt42 Fri, 28 Dec 2012 01:36:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=202939#comment-1616233 Is there a team of top-notch defense lawyers who offer their services pro bono to people who are sued by the Westboro Baptist Church? This seems like the best way to deflate them. I mean, I'm sure they have great lawyers, but I'm also sure there are better ones. If they got less cash coming in from lawsuits, they might have fewer resources allowing them to spread their message of terribleness. Is there a team of top-notch defense lawyers who offer their services pro bono to people who are sued by the Westboro Baptist Church? This seems like the best way to deflate them. I mean, I’m sure they have great lawyers, but I’m also sure there are better ones. If they got less cash coming in from lawsuits, they might have fewer resources allowing them to spread their message of terribleness.

]]> By: relawson http://boingboing.net/2012/12/27/anti-westboro-baptist-church-p.html#comment-1616227 relawson Fri, 28 Dec 2012 01:18:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=202939#comment-1616227 nail jello to the ceiling.  I'm writing that one down. :) you can have "trying to push a mattress through a moonroof" in trade nail jello to the ceiling. 

I’m writing that one down. :)

you can have “trying to push a mattress through a moonroof” in trade

]]> By: fuzzyfuzzyfungus http://boingboing.net/2012/12/27/anti-westboro-baptist-church-p.html#comment-1616222 fuzzyfuzzyfungus Fri, 28 Dec 2012 01:00:00 +0000 http://boingboing.net/?p=202939#comment-1616222 Exactly how could a 'hate speech law' do anything but weaken the 1st amendment? If it isn't written so as to abridge freedom of speech in certain areas, it isn't much of a hate speech law, and if it is written to abridge freedom of speech in certain areas, it's starting to tread on the 1st amendment's toes... Exactly how could a ‘hate speech law’ do anything but weaken the 1st amendment? If it isn’t written so as to abridge freedom of speech in certain areas, it isn’t much of a hate speech law, and if it is written to abridge freedom of speech in certain areas, it’s starting to tread on the 1st amendment’s toes…

]]>