Comments on: Erin Brockovich: the real-life unhappy ending of Hinkley, California, and a tale of science for sale

By: Gyrofrog

Gyrofrog — Mon, 18 Mar 2013 18:11:00 +0000

California’s is the homeopathic dose.

By: TopOc

TopOc — Sun, 17 Mar 2013 02:20:00 +0000

I have a small lab, and I am a bit reckless with the chemicals. I don’t put on gloves to handle the strong acids. I maybe should, but I don’t.

But I wear gloves with hexavalent chromium. I’ve only once open the bottle. That’s how toxic I consider the stuff.

Thus, you can imagine my disgust with stories like that of Hinkley, or more recently of Qatmat Ali:
http://www.alternet.org/water/major-military-contractor-poisons-american-troops-avoids-accountability

Recklessness to the point of sociopathy.

By: JontKopeck

JontKopeck — Sat, 16 Mar 2013 10:52:00 +0000

Did that PG&E rep just say “highly regulated” like it was a bad thing?

By: Antinous / Moderator

Antinous / Moderator — Fri, 15 Mar 2013 21:43:00 +0000

I beg to differ.

By: Jessica Chasko Denning

Jessica Chasko Denning — Fri, 15 Mar 2013 20:35:00 +0000

“In the U.S., we have a Food and Drug Administration to insure that any chemicals we ingest in the form of drugs are safe before they are allowed on the market”
The FDA is proposing genetically engineered salmon that could make our wild salmon extinct, genetically engineered Eucalyptus [watch “Silent Forest” free on Netflix for the implications of a monoculture forest, sterile of all other life, and more of their GMO corn. Even thought half of our traditional corn is now contaminated with unwanted GMO DNA.
The premise is that the GMOs are ‘substantially equivalent’ to traditionals, so require no labeling or FDA testing.
Now you are proposing putting the FDA in charge of water?????FDA: Fails Doing Anything…. useful.

By: Katy Garretson

Katy Garretson — Fri, 15 Mar 2013 19:54:00 +0000

Oh, it’s hardly natural. There are several old oil well sites that were not properly dismantled all over Oklahoma, specifically near Norman, Stilllwater, and many smaller towns in between. The amount of toxins leached into that red clay is staggering.

By: keithrc

keithrc — Fri, 15 Mar 2013 15:25:00 +0000

Unicorns only have one good point.

By: ocker3

ocker3 — Fri, 15 Mar 2013 09:43:00 +0000

People don’t water their lawns or wash their dishes anymore? Mop their tile floors with tap water and detergent?

By: retchdog

retchdog — Fri, 15 Mar 2013 04:03:00 +0000

geostatistics isn’t exactly a new field, and models with spatial correlation are de rigeur these days. there’s more to it than “hurrr, lots of cases! panic! crush capitalism!”

By: bcsizemo

bcsizemo — Fri, 15 Mar 2013 00:22:00 +0000

Well it is also true that depending on what part of the country you live in depends on how well copper pipes hold up. Here in NC they will last decades, from what I’ve read on plenty of plumbing forums certain places will eat through copper in a matter of years. It is certainly plausible that ground water where he lives contains high concentrations of naturally occurring chemicals that are dangerous to us. True they needed a citation or something, but casually call them a wife beater doesn’t seem like the most effective way to go about it.

By: Ben Harris

Ben Harris — Thu, 14 Mar 2013 23:24:00 +0000

Great article, however the use of insure should be ensure.

By: Antinous / Moderator

Antinous / Moderator — Thu, 14 Mar 2013 21:13:00 +0000

Won’t someone think of the property values!

Amity, as you know, means ‘friendship’.

By: rocketpj

rocketpj — Thu, 14 Mar 2013 21:00:00 +0000

Would the steam in a shower with hexavalent chromium contaminated water be an issue? I have no idea, but I do have showers and there is often steam involved. I doubt it reaches a high enough temperature to function as a distiller.

By: Preston Sturges

Preston Sturges — Thu, 14 Mar 2013 20:31:00 +0000

Barring local population differences. One extended family could comprise a cluster of pancreatic or neck cancers based on their genetics.

By: millie fink

millie fink — Thu, 14 Mar 2013 18:34:00 +0000

Sure, but what Joel is also doing is floating an unsubstantiated claim that disputes information which is central to this post, and then floating another hazily remembered claim, thereby implying that it’s up to others to find out whether or not his claims are true. Joel’s move riles me because it recalls so well the pernicious tactic used by purportedly objective news outlets: “Is it true that President Obama got nothing but C’s in college? We’ll find out, right after these messages.”

The question contains a claim that has no basis in reality, but the idea embedded in the claim nevertheless enters mainstream discourse. It’s not that Joel was trying to do the same thing, but the proximity to uselessness of his unsubstantiated claims is all too similar in the effect they have of raising unwarranted doubt.

By: Kimmy84

Kimmy84 — Thu, 14 Mar 2013 17:49:00 +0000

My first reply disappeared. So I’ll try again.

It is widely known that ingested Cr6 is broken down in the human GI tract by gastric juices to non-dangerous Cr3. The question then becomes what is the capacity of a human stomach to process what amount of Cr6? The result seem to suggest a normal stomach is able to handle Cr6 of up to 1 liter of water containing 10.0 mg/liter of Cr6.

That’s a lot of Cr6.

By: Xeni Jardin

Xeni Jardin — Thu, 14 Mar 2013 17:34:00 +0000

It is worth pointing out that hexavalent chromium must be inhaled, not ingested, in order to cause cancer.

We don’t know that yet. Science hasn’t conclusively proven that there isn’t danger in the ingestion of hex-chrom in drinking water.

Watch part 2 tonight.

By: IronEdithKidd

IronEdithKidd — Thu, 14 Mar 2013 17:30:00 +0000

What you just posted needs to be broadcast widely and frequently. Not every state considers soda bottlers to be a “water supply”, so they’re not necessarily conforming with the Clean Water Act requirements for drinking water safety.

By: IronEdithKidd

IronEdithKidd — Thu, 14 Mar 2013 17:26:00 +0000

The filter replacement cost looks really, pleasantly low compared to our functional, but overly expensive Whirlpool RO system. Sadly, there was no Costco near us when our old RO system finally became obsolete, so for now we’re stuck with a pricy one.

By: Little Mouse

Little Mouse — Thu, 14 Mar 2013 17:20:00 +0000

I prefer to think that bottled water comes from magically pure elemental squeezings, for that “elementally pure” taste. Unicorns may have many good points, but squeezings are not one of them.

By: JonS

JonS — Thu, 14 Mar 2013 17:16:00 +0000

Won’t someone think of the property values!

*swoon*

By: DevinC

DevinC — Thu, 14 Mar 2013 17:01:00 +0000

True and duly noted. A truly random cluster of new diagnoses of cancer (as opposed to total diagnoses of cancer) would be highly unlikely, though, to persist over time.

By: DevinC

DevinC — Thu, 14 Mar 2013 16:55:00 +0000

I don’t think that was fair. Joel’s raising a potentially valid objection and acknowledging the shortcomings of an argument based on recollection.

By: Kimmy84

Kimmy84 — Thu, 14 Mar 2013 16:50:00 +0000

It is worth pointing out that hexavalent chromium must be inhaled, not ingested, in order to cause cancer.

There are a lot of studies looking at the potential dangers of it in water supplies, but none have yet to conclusively show any danger.

By: Matthew Bondy

Matthew Bondy — Thu, 14 Mar 2013 16:43:00 +0000

No one else shocked by the passing reference to PG&E now producing so much alfalfa on the contaminated land that they opened a dairy farm? Presumably they feed the cows the alfalfa…

By: DewiMorgan

DewiMorgan — Thu, 14 Mar 2013 16:37:00 +0000

“Magically Pure Unicorn Squeezings™, the refreshing new drink that all the kids love!”
Sometimes I wish I was rich industrialist, just so I could make other people’s great ideas a reality.

By: DewiMorgan

DewiMorgan — Thu, 14 Mar 2013 16:27:00 +0000

Oh no, it’s not! (try clicking it)
[edit (oh yes it is: I needed to refresh)]

By: EH

EH — Thu, 14 Mar 2013 16:23:00 +0000

And the less random cancer incidence is (which is always less than 100%), the more statistically significant clusters become.

But yeah, I see your point. Property values.

By: ryuthrowsstuff

ryuthrowsstuff — Thu, 14 Mar 2013 16:21:00 +0000

I was thinking the same thing. We’re measuring thing in the parts per BILLION here, usually dealing with polution or toxins we talk about parts per MILLION. Its hard to express just how miniscule the amounts of chromium-6 we’re talking about are. Its entirely possible that its just that dangerous, especially since heavy metals tend to build up in the system. But I’d be curious see what the established safe threshold is.

And I’m saying this as some one who grew up on well water in a town where the well water was often not safe to drink. We had heavy infiltration of fertilizers and pesticides into the ground water, and a well established connection between that ground water and our astronomical breast cancer rates. We’re talking the school water fountains had warning signs with dosage reccomendations hanging over them. Town hall had a map of water safety broken down by lot. My house was one of 4 on my street considered safe for human consumption, and the water still developed a noticable chemical film when left standing.

I also don’t see where the “science for sale” from the headlines comes in.

By: s2redux

s2redux — Thu, 14 Mar 2013 16:12:00 +0000

At year's-end 2010 EWG was saying, "The best way to remove chromium-6 from tap water at home is with a reverse osmosis filter."