Discuss

25 Responses to “Julian Assange on WikiLeaks, Bradley Manning, and new Julian Assange book”

  1. AlveKatt says:

    I am really wondering. The accusation against Assange is valid as an accusation according to Swedish law, it warrants a trial. A no is a no, period, and you don’t get off the hook just because you initiate something when the other party was sleeping. If the accusations are true Assange at the least took advantage of the other parties half awake state, and that’s not ok.

    I don’t think Assange would be extradited to the USA if he was sent here to Sweden. I am quite sure that’s a thing that would poke straight through the Swedish populations’ lethargy and make the mass speak up.

    Regardless, my point is that at the very least the crime he is accused of is a real crime, not something that was made up just for Assange.

  2. Xploder says:

    I couldn’t care less if he gets extradited to America or not. He should be held accountable for any and all crimes he committed including the rape. Hiding in an Embassy and writing a book which he will make money off of is disgusting. He did the crimes, let him do the time in whatever country that convicts him. Personally, I do NOT want him to be sent here to America as sure as shit, it would cause a huge ass media frenzy and he would end up in a prison for, most likely, the rest of his life. That’s needless. He needs to be sent back to face the rape charges and be dealt with there.

    Sorry if I seem incoherent today, I’m trying to make it on no sleep for three days so far.

    • ZikZak says:

      He should face the sexual assault charges in court, and, if found guilty, be punished for the crime.  But the US is making that impossible, because they have guaranteed that if Assange tries to face his charges, he will be extradited to the US where his rights will not be respected and he could easily be put to death.

      Death is not a reasonable sentence for sexual assault – especially sexual assault which has not yet been proven.  Therefore it’s unreasonable to expect Assange to go face his charges, because what you are actually asking is for him to go face death.

      If you want Assange to face his charges, demand that the US formally commit to not extradite him.

      • ChicagoD says:

        No. That’s not how this works. The Swedes can decide that they will not extradite him, but he doesn’t get a free pass on rape because he broke other laws as well.

        Besides, if you think he’s voluntarily going to Sweden to face these charges, you’re crazy. The U.S. is his current excuse.

      • Xploder says:

        Like I said, the last thing that should happen to Assange is extradition to the United States. I don’t think that he could “easily be put to death” but he COULD be dumped into a prison for the rest of his life and I don’t think that should happen. If he is brought before a court anywhere than it should NOT be in the U.S.

        Also, I am editing this to say that the only place in the U.S. that he could possibly be “easily put to death” would be in Texas. They really like their death penalties.

      • iCowboy says:

        ‘He should face the sexual assault charges in court, and, if found guilty, be punished for the crime.  But the US is making that impossible, because they have guaranteed that if Assange tries to face his charges, he will be extradited to the US where his rights will not be respected and he could easily be put to death.’
        The Americans have not said they will ask for Assange’s extradition. If they wanted him extradited they would have a better chance asking the UK whose extradition treaty with the US demands a much lower standard of proof than that of Sweden.

        Sweden cannot extradite Assange to the US if he faced the death sentence, like the UK it is a signatory of the European Convention on Human Rights which considers the death penalty to be a barbaric relic. Sweden could only consider an extradition if the US waived all prospect of seeking a death sentence.

    • Cowicide says:

      He should be held accountable for any and all crimes he committed including the rape … He did the crimes

      Are you judge and jury?  He hasn’t been proven to have committed any crime.  But you’re definitely in the running for defamation.

  3. Daedalus says:

    If justice for the women that were allegedly the targets of sexual abuse was actually the concern, I don’t see why the Sweedish government wouldn’t agree not to extradite him to the US. Rather, these women, regardless of the veracity of their claims, are being used as pawns in an international manhunt for a man provably guilty so far only of exposing the dirty side of politics and war for what it was. That’s a problem. These women deserve to have justice done, and Sweden is refusing to allow justice to be done, by not offering assurances that they won’t try any extralegal stunts to apprehend him for other issues. If you want justice for what he’s done, tell Sweden to agree not to extradite him.

    • ChicagoD says:

      “These women deserve to have justice done, and Sweden is refusing to allow justice to be done”

      Victim blaming.

      • Daedalus says:

        Sweden’s the victim? Then let them cry out for justice, too. At the moment, they’re just standing in the way.

        • ChicagoD says:

          Disgusting. There are (alleged) victims here, and you are willing to let them stew because this guy released a ton of unreviewed materials on the internet. Blaming Sweden just means you’re completely in bed with Assange on this (careful there . . .)

          • wysinwyg says:

             I’m still confused why Sweden couldn’t either 1) guarantee no extradition or 2) actually charge Assange with a crime.  I don’t think it’s “disgusting” to ask why that is, and I don’t think it trivializes the accusations or the accusers either.

          • ChicagoD says:

            No country will guarantee anything to an alleged criminal like that. You don’t let the alleged rapist dictate the terms of the discussion. That’s not hard to understand.

            Are you honestly demanding that Sweden dispense with its own procedures and charge Assange so that he can come back? How does that work? You think that will make him go to Sweden?

            Would that we could all live by the Assange Rules. Good for thee, not for me.

          • wysinwyg says:

            No country will guarantee anything to an alleged criminal like that.

            That’s bullshit and you know it.  You’ve completely failed to answer my question, incidentally.  A little less self-righteous indignation and a little more coherent explanation may yield better results.

            For example, why couldn’t Assange be charged with a crime? What is the policy that this contradicts and what is the purpose of that policy?

          • iCowboy says:

            ‘ I’m still confused why Sweden couldn’t either 1) guarantee no extradition’
            Sweden can’t guarantee not to extradite Assange because the Americans have not asked for an extradition. The American prosecutors would have to produce the evidence under which they thought an extradition was necessary. A Swedish court would then consider this evidence. 

            Saying no before seeing any evidence, when the Americans *might* have some incontrovertable evidence against Assange would be to deny justice.

          • Daedalus says:

            I’m not asking them to stew. The nation of Sweden is. If justice for what he’s done to those women is important to you, tell Sweden to do whatever it takes to put him on trial for THAT. Their inability to do that should be infuriating for everyone except people who want to use this as an excuse to get him to the US.

            And just because someone is accused of sexual assault doesn’t mean they become inhuman. He’s been pretty up-front about being willing to stand trial, all Sweden has to do is not then turn him over for unrelated issues.

  4. Brad Bell says:

    People seem to have very different opinions, formed by very different information. This ABC doc is pretty interesting, although it seems to provide a very different version of the events than many commenters would recognise, or perhaps want to hear. 
    http://www.abc.net.au/4corners/stories/2012/07/19/3549280.htm

  5. ScottCh says:

    I was kind of surprised to read replies here that talk about Assange as  a rapist.  It certainly seemed like shenanigans to me when the charges against him were dropped by the original prosecutor, then reinstated by another.  Further, according to this article in Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assange#Allegations_of_sexual_assault_and_political_refugee, testimony that was originally recorded by the police was later altered in order to make stronger accusations against him.

    As I see it, there’s considerable evidence that this man has pissed off some very powerful people who want him taken down.  The evidence that he committed rape is dubious.

    My comment to the conservatives crying crocodile tears is that you can play upon the sentiments of the liberal minded by pointing out that those women deserve justice, but you know that it’s very likely that the moment he shows up for that he will be bagged by the USA and tried for…  Something.  

    What rights does a non-citizen have under our constitution?  The right to be dropped into INS purgatory and disappear for a few decades?

  6. douglaslucas says:

    There are no charges, only allegations — and that’s according to the UK Supreme Court! Assange offered multiple times to answer the Swedish Prosecution Authority’s questions by phone or on neutral turf, but Sweden refused, though they’ve questioned others that way. Sweden gave Assange permission to leave after he stuck around for weeks asking “Okay so you’re SURE you don’t have any questions for me, right?” and as soon as Cablegate hit, bam, INTERPOL red notice and the Swedish Prosecution Authority insisting he be put on Swedish soil, where he could be stuck in lengthy detainment and easily extradited to the U.S., where the WikiLeaks grand jury, of unprecedented scope, is still ongoing. Ecuador asked Sweden to ask the questions — Sweden doesn’t care about the questions, it cares about getting Assange on Swedish soil. It would be as simple as a phone call otherwise. More here: http://wlcentral.org/node/2486

  7. Origami_Isopod says:

    Yep. And it’s disgusting how so many on the left, who should be allies to women (ha, yeah, I know… fauxgressive d00ds), defend him and attack his accusers with the most misogynist tropes.

  8. Cowicide says:

    it’s disgusting how so many on the left … attack his accusers with the most misogynist tropes.

    Where are all these hordes of lefties that do this?  [specific citations dearly appreciated]

  9. Antinous / Moderator says:

    You should check out this blog called Boing Boing.

  10. Cowicide says:

    Which posts?

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