If It Walks Like A Duck and Talks Like a Duck Dept: The McCain-Palin Mob

The things that has always alarmed me most about the right wing Republican/conservative/FOX News-watching types is how they wear their own IGNORANCE as a badge of honor! I can't get my head around the notion of how unashamed they are of their own ignorance. It used to be that abject stupidity was something to be embarrassed about. Is it somehow now HIP these days to be a total dumbass? Did I miss the memo?

It's even worse when Republican politicians stoop to cultivate the least intelligent amongst us. Why is it that the Republican party seems to consist solely of the top 5% of America's wealth holders and the lower third of the IQ spectrum with NO ONE in between?

Here is what Blogger Interrupted saw at a McCain-Palin rally in Strongsville, Ohio:


The fact that my videos of McCain-Palin supporters are blowing up online tells me a lot.

First, the media should be ashamed of themselves for not covering this until now. The McCain-Palin supporters in my videos are not new, they are not exceptional, they are not hiding. This is who they are. It has been brewing for months, and not one mainstream media outlet has taken the time to expose them. Not one. And that is dangerous. If America is about to decide on its president based on this level of hate and ignorance, without a single question being asked as to why, then America is in for a rude awakening.

There are some seriously ignorant people on display in these videos (and no, not just the governor of Alaska). These people are clearly SO DUMB that they'd believe any darn thing you told them! Be afraid, be very afraid... McCain-Palin Mob in Ohio (video) part 1 | McCain-Palin Mob in Ohio (video)part 2

(Richard Metzger is a guestblogger)

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  1. Kind of old news, because this was the same mob for Bush in 2000 and 2004. Probably similar to the mob for Reagan, best I can tell.

  2. Stuff like this always disturbs me. The only difference this and the sort of ignorance the Democrats breed is that it is ‘hip’ to only pick on the failings of the Republican party.

    Frag both main parties.

  3. Sad, stupid, scared people.

    We could probably eliminate the deficit by turning FOX into a pay per view channel for the duration of the Obama administration. Make ’em pay for their hate fix.

  4. I didn’t really see all that much ignorance in that video. I saw some possible racism and some people who were Republican and not Democrat. The people talking about his name aside I didn’t really see much to get worked up about. The guy with the camera was asking which they felt they knew better and I’m not sure that question is really valid or what it is supposed to imply. Palin was the one saying that “we” don’t know about Obama not the people in that video. Wouldn’t a better question be a comparison between Palin and Biden? Even the woman who said she saw more interviews with Palin than Obama in the last month and a half is probably correct.

  5. Kind of old news, because this was the same mob for Bush in 2000 and 2004.

    Actually, it was the same mob in Republican Rome. The predator cozens the prey.

  6. It used to be that abject stupidity was something to be embarrassed about. Is it somehow now HIP these days to be a total dumbass? Did I miss the memo?

    This is not specific to republicans or conservatives. The anti-intellectual movement has been sweeping the globe for over a decade. They usually portray themselves as being “people-centred” or “inclusive” or “humanist”, and then oppose thinking because it’s too complicated for “real people” to understand. You can usually find them dumbing something down to the point where it is worthless.

  7. Ack, that’s Southpark Mall!

    Just like to say not everyone in the area is like that. (In fact, Obama is leading in Ohio now, yes?)

    Not only is there a good-sized Muslim population in the area. that as far as I know everyone gets along fine with.

    There’s also a nice college about a half hour away (which Obama spoke at).

    Not to mention a lot of former conservatives who are tired of their kids getting blown up. (We’ve suffered pretty high casualties in Iraq)

  8. I been thinkin’ that the palin mobs probably behave similarly to the average political gathering near the end of the Weimar Republic, all anger, with no place to put it. All blame laid at the convenient feet of the ‘other.’

  9. The only difference this and the sort of ignorance the Democrats breed is that it is ‘hip’ to only pick on the failings of the Republican party.

    The claim that McCain sold out fellow prisoners during captivity would be an equivalent of the idiocy in this video. You really think you could go to an Obama rally and not only easily find plenty of people who offer that garbage up, but also hear the meme being advanced on stage by the candidates themselves?

    And if picking on racism and hateful ignorance is done only because it’s “hip”, hey, maybe the United States of American Idol still has a chance to save itself.

  10. I think this is the problem with presidential politics. Republicans are too good at getting dumb people to vote for them. Democrats tends to try to attract voters with intelligent messages. Clearly that doesn’t work. If the democrats are going to win, they’re going to need to get in touch with their inner stupid.

  11. For some reason, the American mythos associates intellectuality with femininity, and also sees the feminine as something negative. Stupidity is felt as being more powerful.

  12. God that’s depressing. I have to share a country with these people?
    Technically, no. I could always move I suppose.

  13. The best was the guy who said, “Don’t answer his questions unless he submits them to you in writing”… in the year 2008, everyone’s a publicist!

  14. Hartscov, Goebbels once said that what their [The Nazi’s] enemies did not understand was that to defeat them [the Nazis], the enemy would have to become them [ie become themselves Nazis].
    Alternative: Resist not evil, break the cycle.
    Empower not stupidity, thou varlet.

  15. …Palin was the one saying that “we” don’t know about Obama not the people in that video. Wouldn’t a better question be a comparison between Palin and Biden?

    It’s a relevant question because Palin is trying to frame Obama as the unknown quantity when she herself is less well known by her own supporters.

    As for comparing him to Biden, he has been vetted far more thoroughly by the press and the public during 35 years in the Senate and two Presidential campaigns.

  16. Consider the alternative: would you prefer that these people to be in *your* political party or events?

    US out of California!!

  17. Actually, the first guy comes across pretty well. He expresses some vague anti-Muslim nonsense, and then when asked bluntly if he thinks Obama is a terrorist he says correctly “You want a sound byte” and waves off the camera.

    When the camera returns he says, “I think he’s a one-man terrorist cell.” He’s just baiting the cameraman.

  18. Eric, perhaps that mythos confuses insensibility (to pain, hardship, difficulties in reaching a goal) with stupidity.
    Perhaps it also conflates sensitivity and intelligence.
    Either would be a mistake IMO.

  19. “t sd t b tht bjct stpdty ws smthng t b mbrrssd bt. s t smhw nw HP ths dys t b ttl dmbss? Dd mss th mm?”

    Ys, t s hp nw t b ttl dmbss. Th mm ws clld “Th Plyby Phlsphy”, whch ld ppl t sbsttt sx fr pblc mrlty. Thn cm “wmn’s lbrtn” nd “ql pprtnty”, whch rwrt th lws t rqr nsnty nd stpdty. bt th sm tm ws n vnt clld “bsng” whch svrd lmst ll prntl nflnc vr pblc dctn. W nw hv n whl gnrtn tht hs bn tght t b stpd.

    Ths thngs r nrml symptms f cllpsng cltr. Thy hv bn sn n vry cltrl cllps n hstry. nd vry cltr n hstry hs cllpsd, sm svrl tms. Y cn rd fll dscrptn f t t http://drkg2007.blgspt.cm/ Clck th Mnscrpt lnk n th rght t dwnld th bk.

  20. yuck, those mccain supporters from ohio sure are gly nd stpd nd white. They’re racists! But let’s be honest, does supporting mccain make you a stpd, gly white racist or does living in ohio? I propose the latter. Go to a mccain rally in Orange or San Diego County and get a completely different picture. For that matter go interview Obama rally-goers in New Orleans, I’ll bet what you’ll see are a bunch of stpd gly black people syng cmpltly gnrnt thngs

    Just what is this video supposed to prove? It’s certainly not journalism.

  21. Be careful. You’re missing a big segment in between stupid and rich: the military comes immediately to mind.

  22. I have to admit, that is a great strategy for the wealthy and powerful to cater to and appeal to the lowest common denominator whom they prey on. Very frustrating for the rest of us, and ultimately and evil trick.

  23. T b fr, n cld *sly* crt smlr vd tsd n bm rlly:

    “Grg Bsh *prsnlly* crshd *bth* rplns nt th Wrld Trd Cntr! Bt nly ftr rlsng mnd-cntrl chmtrls nd rgn-hrnssng stllts vr NYC!”

    Slctv dtng s th prpgndst’s frnd.

  24. I totally agree with #5 jccalhoun, and anti-intellectualism has been far better documented on countless other videos, I am certain. There were a few nuggets too be sure (“it’s in his blood”), but this video is getting far too much hype for its content.

    On anti-intellectualism in America, apparently its been on the march since the 50’s, when Adlai Stevenson was ridiculed for being too smart (see Richard Hofstadter’s classic book aptly titled, “Anti-Intellectualism in America”, from around 1960). Hofstadter dates it back to Evangelical Protestant revivals in the 1800’s (and is actually pretty sympathetic to Evangelical Protestants for some of their acheivements).

    Also, I recommend Wikipedia’s article on Anti-Intellectualism as a good first stop.

  25. Actually I make mistakles too.
    “Confuses insensibility and stupidity…conflates sensitivity with intelligence”, rather than what I wrote above.

  26. I said it before and I’ll say it again:

    Why, oh why does it always have to happen in Ohio!?!! Bwaaahhh!!! Dear sweet Buddha, it’s so bleak here!!!!

    Creation Museum
    Kent State Student Shooting
    Jeffrey Dahmer
    Cuyahoga River
    Bob Taft
    Diebold and their electronic voting machines
    Jerry Springer
    Ernest Angley
    Cornhole
    Cowgirl
    McCain/Palin’s Ignorance is Bliss Fan Club

    Why can’t it be New Jersey!?!!

    Hillary Clinton said, “As Ohio goes, so goes the nation.” Let’s hope she didn’t mean it…

  27. Bad teachers blame lack of learning on the stupidity of their students. Good teachers realize that there’s a huge variation in native ability, and realize that they, the teachers, are responsible for making sure learning happens.

    You have to teach to all levels – not just the intellectual elite. Having a low IQ is not a moral failing. People with low IQ are just as much citizens as people with high IQ. I’d say the Democratic Party has a duty to tailor its message to reach all levels. No, not to dumb it down, just to teach in different ways.

  28. It’s been a part of the Republican playbook for years to set working-class white people against working-class black people. They rely on stoking the fires of xenophobia.

  29. “the right wing Republican/conservative/FOX News-watching types”

    How very ‘x-ist’ of you. I didn’t realize BoingBoing was only for “left wing Democratic/Socialist/PBS-watching types”

  30. Hey HCovitz I think those Evangelical Movements in the 1800s were actually formed as a response to the worldwide economic crash of the 1874-1879 period.
    A time eerily similar in economic terms to today, only with the real-estate bubble starting at that time in the Hapsburg Empire of Central Europe, before spreading in the form of a financial collapse, throughout the world.
    Singularly enough a lot of the economists in the ascendant since say 1976 until today trace their ideas to thinkers (the Austrian School) who left what was once the Hapsburg Empire during the 20’s and 30’s of the 20th C., fifty years after the creash of 1874.
    Are we coming into some weirdo replay of the 1880’s, economically and socially?

  31. Meh. Brutalized people strike out.
    Politicians screw people over with bad leadership, people strike out, and they get even worse leadership. A vicious cycle, well known to history.

  32. What a silly hat-trick.

    People are ignorant. You corner some ignorant twits into saying Obama’s a terrorist, you intersperse some clips of dumb people not knowing how to respond to “Who did you hear of first?” and you have yourself a video? Blogger Interrupted should be ashamed of themselves.

    Ignorance is rampant, on the left and on the right, and this sort of response to it is close-minded and counterproductive. You too, boingboing– when we see ignorance in the world, is this how we respond to it? Finger-pointing and belittling? Way to rise above, guys. Not only is it petty and misleading– its not even in your best interest. All clips like this do is galvanize the people in them, and the people who watch them, to take sides and stick to them. You’re not opening doors. You’re not educating anyone. You’re just calling your enemy names. This is ridiculous.

    As an avid fan, and as an Obama-supporter, I just lost some respect for you, boingboing.

  33. VVelox @2:

    What kind of ignorance do the Democrats breed?
    How do they do it?
    When did you first become aware of it?

    How do you know that it’s “hip” to only pick on the failings of the Republican party?

    What failings of the Democratic party should be picked on more than they are?

    Why should both parties be fragged?
    What do you imagine would take their place?

    Answer now.

  34. @chrisbloom7

    There really isn’t a conservative analog to PBS- the liberal analog of fox news would probably be comedy central, which really says a lot about fox news. And, to be picky- the opposite of conservative is liberal, which doesn’t neccessarily imply socialist.

    All that aside, there really is a predilection to both conspiracy theory and uncritical group-think on both sides of the fence, especially among the type of people who get energized/fanatical enough to attend rallies. This video seemed much less a celebration of stupidity than the article earlier today on how pronouncing a country’s name correctly was irritating (and somehow unamerican).

    The Obama as muslim terrorist meme is pernicious though- it seems to be code for “he’s black”, much in the same way that “won’t legislate from the bench” seems to mean “will not allow gay marriage or support roe vs wade).

  35. Whoa whoa WHOA there Hatofedshu #28:

    Cornhole is a great game.

    I agree with some of the other posters here, the problem is not the ignorance of McCain-Palin folks, the problem is the ignorance of the American populace in general.

    Let’s see, it’s an election year, whom do we blame . . .

    I spin the dial and blame the media, the markets, the military industrial complex, and Pauly Shore.

  36. The US had a widespread political movement called the Know Nothings in the 1850s. Plus ça change.

  37. This country would be in a lot better shape if citizens had to pass an IQ test in order to vote. Stir.

  38. I think people are desperate for some type of affiliation. Religion provides that for many, and so does politics. The people drawn to this event are looking to satisy some need for meaning and understanding to try to make sense of their lives. It doesn’t matter if the worldview they’ve adopted is totally erroneous. They will hold fast to it…. those clingers…. because it makes them feel more secure. It is not an intelligence issue…. it is emotional/spiritual.

    There is something in the Republican brand that speaks to a very primal need in some people. For some maybe that is order, or strength, or protection. They can (or cant’) tell you why they like McCain and don’t like Obama, but it won’t be anything they perceive with their conscious minds anyway. They are responding to code that has most likely been placed by professional “persuaders,” like Karl Rove and the rest of the evil genius contingent.

    P.S. The Persuaders is a very good doc. about advertising and it touches on politics as well. I think Douglas Rushkoff produced this(?) It explained well why certain things appeal to us, in the absence of a rational reason, but simply because they activate this reptilian brain center.

    Or maybe that is just my way of calling Republicans a bunch of unevolved slithering lizards.

  39. I feel like I’ve known those people my whole life. The first time I ran into people like this was in the eighth grade. I distinctly remember moving to a new school and having to watch what I said, for fear of being picked on for not speaking in monosyllables.

    Most of my working life was spent in a blue-collar world, where one is in danger of not being accepted as one of the guys for the same reason. Most of these people voted Repulican, whereas the engineers I worked with in R&D, more often voted Democratic. Anyone who has read my posts, knows I’m no intellectual, but even I have had to watch what I said and how I said it, if I wanted to hang with the guys.

    One of the field service engineers, came back from Mexico and started to tell us about a redneck he met at one of the plants down there. Well, you should have heard the uproar this started, when the *real* rednecks jumped his shit, “You stupid fuck, there ain’t no rednecks in Mexico, there ain’t nuthin’ but sp–s in Mexico. What a dumbass.” Needless to say, that engineer didn’t spend much time with us after that.

  40. It looks a lot less like stupidity than just plain-old American hate, which I guess could be distilled down to racism.

  41. Notice, how I’m totally avoiding this one. It would be fun to post a video of some dumb Obama supporters but I’m not gonna do it…wouldn’t be prudent at this juncture.

  42. JCCalhoun @5, did you really not pick up on the depth of ignorance there?

    ASuffield @7, can you give me any examples of that?

    GrimC @11, I have to disagree with you. Many of the dumber opinions you encounter on the right were manufactured and spoon-fed to them. I tell you honestly, there is no equivalent simple-meme-distributing operation on the left.

    Hartscov @12, I’ll agree that the Democrats could stand to get better at talking about simple issues.

    Jewels Vern @21, if you want to advertise your nutbar book, buy an ad.

    Buzz Graphics @22, you know-it-all, do you actually believe there are throngs of black McCain supporters in New Orleans?

    Coldspell @25, I just lost my patience with unthinking assertions of parity. I’ve been running a center-by-center-left sometimes-political weblog for seven years now, and what you’re saying simply isn’t true. I don’t think a day has gone by here at Boing Boing for weeks now when I haven’t seen one or two dozen lazy assertions that things are the same on both sides.

    They aren’t.

    Did you catch Antinous, some while back, explaining that we’re not enforcing a party line at Boing Boing, and it’s not our fault that worst of the fuggheads almost all come from the same end of the political spectrum? The far right has been cultivating the dumb-and-resentful segments of the population for many years now. I honestly feel sorry for the intelligent, thoughtful conservatives whose political neighborhoods have filled up with yahoos.

    Hatofedshu @28, I had no idea that Ohio was to blame for Ernest Angley. That man was something else again.

    ChrisBloom7, calm down and untwist. You’re welcome here.

    QuickasFoxes @34, stuff it. Vigorously. You’re not creating a better world either. You’re just playing holier-than-thou.

    Foetusnail @41, what the bleep do you mean, you’re not an intellectual? You could have fooled me.

  43. Heard clips from this on Air America today. Here’s a similar video from a rally in Bethlehem, PA yesterday featuring McCain supporters shouting invective at Obama supporters as they wait to get into the rally:

    Especially love when one of the McCain supporters calls Obama a “commie fag.” Personally, I think the more extreme his supporters act the better. It will only serve to push the more moderate voters toward a less dangerous ticket.

  44. “You really think you could go to an Obama rally and not only easily find plenty of people who offer that garbage up, but also hear the meme being advanced on stage by the candidates themselves?”

    Fake balance, completely fake balance. McCains ads are 100% negative, Obamas 30%.

    Is there ANY video of Obama or Biden inciting their crowd to hatred of the other side? Remember this is the campaign that was constantly accused of being to reconciliatory with the other guys. The point of the video is not that there are stupid people voting for McCain, there are stupid people voting for Obama as well. THe point is that Palin and McCain are explicitly firing them up with nonsensical, racially loaded charges.

    How the fuck are you supposed to interpret “Who is pallin-around-with-Terrorists-Obama really?” coming from “I’ve only been at this for 5 weeks” Palin? There is NOTHING comparable from Obamas side. The video is important because to high information people its sometimes unclear what exactly they achieve with this blatantly transparent nonsense, and why it is important to fight it.

  45. Teresa Nielsen Hayden / Moderator — No, I don’t see the stuff about his name which seems to be veiled racism/xenophobia to be about ignorance. I don’t see answers to “Who did you hear about first” as being about ignorance. There are a lot of things in that video, some are pretty ugly, and I don’t think I agree with them politically on much but that doesn’t mean they are ignorant and I am so smart. If someone could enlighten me — make me less ignorant if you will — that would be great.

    I just see this as being more about the person who made the video than anything. It strongly reminds me of the “zombie” videos and pictures that Little Green Footballs posts where they take a handful of people at an anti-war rally and take them out of context without telling us about how many people were there, how long they had to be there before they could find enough people for the video or anything much else.

  46. This country would be in a lot better shape if citizens had to pass an IQ test in order to vote.

    Given the IQ test’s extremely sketchy past in US immigration policy and Jim Crow, I think we can be really sure it wouldn’t.

    Even setting aside that it’s unclear what IQ tests actually measure, it’s quite difficult to construct a test that doesn’t penalize testees for differences in culture from the tester. Now picture the question selection process being turned into a political scrum between Republican and Democrat.

  47. Teresa: “I honestly feel sorry for the intelligent, thoughtful conservatives whose political neighborhoods have filled up with yahoos.”

    There are a lot of conservatives shaking their heads at the idiocy of the McCain/Palin ticket: George Will, David Brooks, Kathleen Parker, and others. These are conservatives worth listening to because they are being honest, unlike Hannity, Rush, O’Reilly, and Coulter who would vigorously support slime mold if it were running on the Republican ticket.

  48. @28 HatOfEdshu:

    Sorry, you don’t get to claim Dahmer. He’s clearly Wisconsin: born there, commited his crimes there. Going to University in Ohio doesn’t count.

  49. here’s joe six pack for ya… these people actually exist! they live next to the parents of a friend of mine. eeeesh!

    (warning… offensive language)

  50. The whole “stupid is cool” thing isn’t new. When I was in middle school (grades 6-8) I purposefully dumbed myself down in order to remain in with the cool kids. The fact that I was smart but didn’t show it put me above my main rival, a guy who relished showing off any chance he got. I have heard similar stories from friends on the Canadian West Coast who said that raising your hand in class when a teacher asked a question would put you immediately on a social blacklist.

    The fact that Obama is intelligent and articulate even makes me cringe a little bit from this childhood indoctrination.

  51. #47 “5000” posted:

    That clip is amazing, too. Someone should do a follow-up to “Heavy Metal Parking Lot” and call it “Republican Parking Lot”!

    Richard

  52. Please keep in mind that there are ignorant, idiotic people who support Obama, too. And I’m sure the blogger came across some intelligent people who support McCain-Palin and didn’t include it in the video. It’s called bias.

  53. #55 – beloved late David Foster Wallace argued that children who speak like adults (e.g., himself and probably most of us as children) should be treated as having a sort of language disability – not as an extra ability, since it means they’re unable to interact normally with other children. It’s not clear he was joking. It begs the question of the purpose of everything in an interesting way.

  54. Actually I rate the intelligence of the interviewees more highly than the intelligence of the guy asking the questions. I was especially impressed with the interviewee who walked away in disgust, saying “You just want a sound bite.”

    Precisely! The interviewer had an agenda: To make people look stupid with one-liners, making no attempt to understand anyone’s point of view if it differed from his own.

    The self-righteousness is overwhelming.

    Plus, of course, the interviewer has completely bought into the concept of a two-party system in which trivial differences are over-emphasized in an effort to conceal the fact that the important policies (in areas such as defense and finance, for instance) are almost identical.

  55. Well by definition nobody is too dumb to participate in democracy. It’d be something else if it excluded those folks. Some would call it a failing I guess.

    Most people in the video didn’t come off too bad, if a bit unable to elaborate their thoughts with a camera shoved in their face. Heck, I’d probably have a hard time making cogent rational statements knowing that untold strangers would be watching it.

    That blond woman that kept popping back into frame was really disturbing though. She didn’t strike me as dumb or even fanatical, just plain old ~crazy~. She had crazy soulless eyes. *shivers*

  56. KNOW NOTHINGS?

    The movement originated in New York in 1843 as the American Republican Party. It spread to other states as the Native American Party and became a national party in 1845. In 1855 it renamed itself the American Party. The origin of the “Know Nothing” term was in the semi-secret organization of the party. When a member was asked about its activities, he was supposed to reply, “I know nothing.” [They merged with the Republicans to elect Lincoln in 1860.]

    ref. Wikkipedia

    They never boasted of their ignorance. That was a slander.

    I find it amusing, however, that the “No Nothings” were the xenophobic, anti-Catholic, anti-immigrant forerunners of the modern GOP.

    Perhaps the term should be resurrected?

  57. No, I don’t see the stuff about his name which seems to be veiled racism/xenophobia to be about ignorance.

    Really? Racism/xenophobia is, like, the epitome of ignorance. Saying that someone with the name Hussein has “the bloodlines” to be a terrorist is not only racist. It also just doesn’t make any damn sense. The reason it doesn’t make any damn sense is because it is ignorant.

    For some reason, the American mythos associates intellectuality with femininity

    Then why, precisely, have I spent my whole life being told that I can’t do math and science as well as men? Or that I did well in Quiz Bowl tournaments “for a girl”? There is perhaps a stereotype that associates maturity with femininity, but I’m afraid I’ve missed out on the one about intellectuality.

  58. It’s never hard–and never wise–to find a moron who disagrees with you, point at them and say, “Now there’s a prime example.” The morons don’t need your help proving that they are morons, and it just makes you look like a dick.

    Almost four years ago, I wrote a piece called It’s the Derision, Stupid based on my experiences among Kerry-Edwards supporters.

    This video (sadly) inspired me to republish it.

  59. Meh. The interviewer was kind of a douche bag. ‘Why stand with Obama, then?” was an irrelevant question. There’s a part two to this video, and it severely pisses me off when he’s asks an African-American man at the rally why he’s voting for McCain when he’s black…ignorance, much interviewer?

  60. I’m pretty sure that if a stranger pushed a camera in my face I would have some things to say that, when viewed later, would seem quite stupid. That interviewer was harassing people. Those people deserve to be disillusioned and to have their ideas thrown into doubt and perhaps to see that the America of the 21st century is not what they want it to be and that they better re-think some of their ideas, but they perhaps do not deserve to be harassed by some annoying guy with a camera, especially if they tell him “I do not want to be filmed.” Did those people sign wavers? I would not want footage of me on the street to wind up on some blog, especially if explicitly told them not to film me, like that one guy did.

  61. “I tell you honestly, there is no equivalent simple-meme-distributing operation on the left.”

    C’mon Theresa, that’s simply not true. Just taking one direct example, Obama’s own campaign ran a Spanish language ad insinuating that McCain is an anti-immigrant racist through pure guilt by association with dickwad nativists like Limbaugh. When in fact McCain bucked Limbaugh and his party to craft an immigration reform bill with Kennedy.

    http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/sparring_in_spanish.html

    Announcer: They want us to forget the insults we’ve endured.

    Text on Screen: “…Mexicans stupid and unqualified.” -Rush Limbaugh

    Announcer: The intolerance! They made us feel marginalized in this country we love so much.

    Text on Screen: “Shut up, or get out!” -Rush Limbaugh

    Announcer: John McCain and his Republican friends have two faces. One of them lies to get our votes. And the other one’s worse, following the failed politics of George Bush, putting the interests of powerful lobbies above those of working families. John McCain, more of the same Republican deception.

  62. NICKD, Shame on you! Presuming all military members are the same is no different from saying all men or all blacks or all Canadians or all residents of New York City are the same! Frankly, it’s as ignorant as saying Obama’s a terrorist because “Well, look at his name.”

    I’m former military myself, grew up in a military family, and believe you me, they have ALL kinds in the military! Bikers, vegans, Log Cabin Republicans, hippies, gun nuts, workout nuts, volunteers for animal shelters and Habitat for Humanity…and almost across the board, folks who drop everything to help out other folks who’ve been hit by volcanoes, hurricanes, blizzards, forest fires, floods…you name it, our armed forces are there in official and unofficial capacities, HELPING.

  63. Why is it:

    ♥ That every commenter claiming to have read BoingBoing since the Stone Age is a first-time commenter?

    ♥ That every commenter claiming to have read BoingBoing since the Stone Age makes their first comment in a thread involving US party politics?

    ♥ That every commenter claiming to have read BoingBoing since the Stone Age starts out by announcing that they’re a flaming liberal or an Obama supporter?

    Why?

  64. ASuffield @7, can you give me any examples of that?

    For an American, the most familiar example of populist anti-intellectualism would probably be O’Reilly (sorry, I don’t follow US popular gibberish closely enough to pick out an equivalent from the other side of the fence). As somebody noted earlier, Wikipedia has a collection of resources on this subject.

    We have the same problem here in the UK with attitudes about education (particularly in relation to the transformation of universities into degree mills rather than centers of learning), and generally about the presence of thinking outside the world of academics. The corporations are also quick to jump on the bandwagon when it suits them. We don’t have flag-waving political pundits using it to push an agenda, but then we don’t really have flag-waving political pundits at all (nobody gets excited about major-party politics in Britain, the election of our prime ministers attracts maybe a week of news coverage).

    It’s less pronounced in Europe, and more so in Asia. I don’t have links offhand, I do not follow the Asian press very often.

    (Links randomly selected from half-remembered and half-googled sources; some of them may contain factual inaccuracies or otherwise be written by nutballs)

  65. Yes these people are ignorant who say Obama is a terrorist. Clearly, they are not part of the smart crowd. But they are not as reprehensible as those “9-11 was an inside job” idiots who presumably have a better education and should know better.

  66. @teresa
    thanks for the fancy edit job.
    Those people in Ohio are voting for McCain and Palin because they identify with them on a color level. Is that ignorant? Yep. Does McCain/Palin play on it? Yep. And to imply that the opposite is not happening on the democratic ticket is absurd – even the camera man couldn’t figure out why a black guy was at this thing. Oh wait, am i not supposed to acknowledge that people are different colors here? or that it still matters? This video doesn’t prove anything that we shouldn’t have already known, most of the country isn’t as highly evolved as you.

  67. @Anonymous #69

    You are jumping to conclusions. I was talking about ignorant people, not about people in the military. I have two cousins currently in the US Army, one cousin former US Army, an uncle former Green Beret, and my girlfriend’s bother was in the US Air Force and I would love it if they did not make the choice to be put into harms way. I think you are defending people who are both dumb and in the military, please don’t. Dumb is dumb.

  68. This business of kids turning on other kids who dare to show their intelligence has a name. It’s called The Crab Bucket Syndrome.

    Pip (Who wasn’t around during the stone age, but who was reading bOINGbOING back when it was a paper magazine.

  69. I have been reading and posting since gondwanaland, and I must say. Many Americans are so amazingly primitive that they still think digital watches are a pretty neat idea.

    Once again, How we miss the Douglas Adams!

  70. Since when has politics NOT been based on emotions? Are the rantings of the Obama crowd any more rational when they claim McCain is “old” or “just another white guy”? I have friends on both sides- some of them can speak intelligently about the issues, but most go with their gut. What are you expecting, for the American public to use logic? To do research? We wish. I have to wonder if this post highlighting the supposed wealth and/or ignorance of republicans is somewhat biased: I have never seen anything against Obama in this blog, at least recently. It is easy to point out the flaws on the side you oppose and call McCain/Palin supporter sub-intelligent ignoramus. A little bi-partisan respect would be nice.

  71. Hey HatOfEdshu, the Creation Museum is in Kentucky. We’re not THAT unfortunate here in the buckeye state.

  72. I don’t believe for a minute that more than 5% of these meat holes actually believe Obama is a terrorist or poses any type of security threat whatsoever. They do hate that he is an intelligent successful black man and that he is probably going to be president and an international star.
    What they really fear is taking a huge loss in the culture war, which, in spite of the last eight years, they have been steadily losing.
    So they are happy to hoot and grunt and regurgitate whatever talking points the rovian overlords toss them like the good little brownshirts they are.

  73. Scoffing and provoking luddites doesn’t make you better or smarter, it just creates a wider divide. There are idiots everywhere – Republican and Democratic alike. Stupid, reactionary pond scum on both sides.

    It’s harder, more valuable, to create respect than to wreck it. Seeing a situation from the other side helps us survive. Sweeping generalizations destroy us.

    What we find infuriating about the video is the participants’ thoughtlessness, their distrustfulness, the rageful joy of having a clear opponent worth hating. They don’t want to listen, or think. It seems they would rather shut their ears and be angry and prejudiced.

    But your scorn isn’t just for these people, it’s for millions and millions of people all across the country. Your vision is clouded by self-righteous pride. Hypocrisy sandwich-making time. I see the exact same arrogance in you.

    Poorly played, Boing Boing.

  74. why, dear Antinous? Why indeed? Because BoingBoing is a soapbox high enough and wide enough to be used and misused by all and sundry. Let no one here forget that the eyes on these pages surpass most of their local media.

  75. Ok, besides all the political vitriol. Is it bad that I find the reoccurring blonde vaguely attractive in a “holy crap, I’ve never slept with anyone that crazy and want to give it a shot” sort of way?

  76. Those people at the McCain/Palin rallies remind me of the crowds George Wallace used to draw with his racist invective and hippie-baiting taunts; right down to the cries of “Get a job” and “commies,” etc. Downright scary deja vu. I also remember the same sort as counter-demonstraters shouting “traitors” and “treason” at “Ban The Bomb” and anti-war rallies. Such hate-filled screeching is nothing new.

    What is at first surprising is that this hate is directed at a major political party candidate, but upon consideration it becomes obvious that it’s the same racism and ignorance finding another channel in which to flow. One can only hope that their numbers have diminished enough to meet with failure … but I fear for Obama and the other candidates, I really do. The McVeys and the Oswalds and the Rays are still among us. And this sort of vileness inflames them.

    I’m sorry to have to bring it up, but I’d be less than honest to keep silent….

  77. Jaypee, Naaah, every now and then you want to wake up next to someone that’s going to threaten to hump your soon-to-be-empty eyesockets. It’s just part of feeling alive.

  78. Ugly Canuck
    Is stupidity in crisis?
    What’s going on here?

    Yes it is. What you are seeing is white privilege becoming dimly aware the bubble it’s been living in is about to pop. They won’t take it well.

  79. @Jccalhoun: You say you see xenophobia, but not ignorance. I ask you, how can you have xenophobia without ignorance? Xenophobia is fear of the unknown; to be ignorant is to not know something. In order to be xenophobic, you have to be ignorant of what you are afraid of. Thus, all xenophobes are ignorant.

  80. Nasaicournus @57: and since you’re sure it all balances out, even though you’ve never bothered to check, you don’t have to think about it or make any real judgements.

    Wagner James Au @68: I’m not talking about minor single instances. I mean a constant, ongoing, industrial process of opinion formation and distribution.

    Antinous @71, I really like the little hearts.

    Drabheathen @85:

    Your vision is clouded by self-righteous pride. Hypocrisy sandwich-making time. I see the exact same arrogance in you. … Poorly played, Boing Boing.

    Get stuffed, Drabheathen. You’re just playing the holier-than-thou game. It has no moral reality. How can I tell? Because there’s been a huge range of reactions and opinions here, and you’re denouncing them all as though they were uniform.

    Jaypee @90, is this something you do often?

  81. I think that the sort of people who would go to a McCain/Palin rally are the dumbest among us. There are plenty of intelligent conservatives, in the vein of P.J. O’Rourke or William Buckley. Not that I haven’t heard plenty of ignorance on the part of progressives, but you’d have to be blind not to notice the miserable failures of the Bush administration in America.

    The problem is that the neoconservative, American exceptionalist, militaristic, government expansionist side of the party has taken over. The small government libertarians are, for all purposes, dead along with the Bill of Rights.

  82. Th wrld’s wlthst r Dmcrts. nd dmms r bprtsn. Rcgnzng thm sms t b Dmcrt trt. nyn nt n th “Prgrssv” s n th wy. Lbrls r lk Hghlndr… thr cn b nly n. Tht’s why lft-wng lbrlsm nds p n ttltrnsm — f llwd t g t ts lgcl cnclsn.

  83. I have to imagine Buzzgraphics sudden appearance suggests he was previously banned? Same on Nasicournus?

    #61 Lincoln spent much time trying to suppress the Know Nothings political philosophy in the new party. They were also known as the Nativists.

    This is what is left of McCain supporters. This is the Republican base. We can call it the religious right so it sounds good, but they are in reality, as we see here twice, purveyors of hate and ignorance. For those that say we could see ignornace like this from Obama supporters, I say prove it. Where is this happening at? You don’t think there are Republicans smart enough to do a film like this? For those that say that they might say something dumb if a microphone is shoved in their face, I say, yes, they said the first thing that came to their minds. Their true, hateful, ignorant thoughts.

    Someone mentioned David Brooks’ comments on Palin. Here they are: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/10/08/david-brooks-sarah-palin_n_133001.html

  84. Thank you, Takuan, you almost helped me answer the question “What happens to a Saitek Eclipse keyboard when you spit tea into it at high pressure?”.

    On topic, all this false equivalency shite is really bugging me. Can anyone honestly say they can find the same quantity of violent outpourings on the left that can be found on the right?

  85. @mikolotus
    nope, not previously banned. Just finally driven to post. I’m from Ohio and I live in Utah, and while I’m voting for Obama, most everyone I know around here publicly supports the Republicans. And these people are intelligent, upper middle class, otherwise normal people. The state of Utah on the whole is college educated middle to upper middle class, yet we’re one of the hardest right leaning states. I believe that alot of really comes down to underlying fear of black people in Utah, but no one EVER says anything like that. However I do hear comments from my wife’s friends that they really like palin because she’s just like them. Don’t get me wrong, it totally grates on my nerves when I hear it, but they’re still entitled to vote as they please. And you know what? Even though I disagree with them politically, I like them – they’re my friends.

    I guess I just took offense to the portrayal of the average McCain supporter. They’re not all ugly stupid racists.

  86. Well said, quickasfoxes (#34).

    Why is it that the Republican party seems to consist solely of the top 5% of America’s wealth holders and the lower third of the IQ spectrum with NO ONE in between?
    Where are you getting this demographic info? Seems like a pretty ignorant thing to say. I know plenty of intelligent middle-class republicans.

  87. I’ll drop my 2 cents in here.

    Anyone that thinks race isn’t an issue is as ignorant as the people in the video.

    If you think gender and mental capacity aren’t an issue, see the race card above.

    I live (and was born/raised) in the South. Race here isn’t exactly the same as black/white/mexican… I think what sums it up here the best is “cultural divide”. I work with a lot of black people (I am white), and we all get along fine. Do I interact the same way with them as other black people, no. I wouldn’t know where to begin….
    Yes this is ignorance being turned into fear and then into anger, but the reality to change that is very, very, VERY hard.

    People always look for the most familiar. Hence, Palin could draw a large white, female vote…(god I hope that’s what they were thinking). Just like Biden could draw the older white vote.

    I still wonder why everyone finds this video so amazing? I think every time I see one of these on TV, who goes to crap like that? Who gives up 3 hours of their life to hoot and yell about nothing? I will pay to go hoot and yell at a concert, but at least I get some level of enjoyment out of that! I grew up with people like this, my whole highschool was people like this. I work with people like this.
    NEWSFLASH. THESE PEOPLE ARE THE MAJORITY.
    Welcome to the hell that is my world.

    BTW, as a side. American politics are worthless. I frankly don’t care who wins, and the credit/mortage crisis proves it. The government had no idea (or at least acknowledged that as a whole they knew). And the rich and greedy got even richer. Thanks, why did I elect you again? Sure the dems will raise my taxes, and pay for people to sit around on their duff. The reps will go start another war and raise my taxes. In the end I will loose freedom, and pay more taxes. Everyone could name at least 3 things wrong with the government, and no one could name how to fix them. That’s the problem, you can’t fix it. It’s like Vista, full of glut and worthless parts. We need Government 2.0

    Oh, and one more thing. Anyone that nitpicks on facts, you’re doing it wrong. Stereotypes are based in fact, that’s why they are usually true. For everyone one person that breaks their mold, I know 10 that don’t. The BoingBoing community, I feel, is general made up of intelligent, creative, resourceful people who have everyone’s best interest in mind. We all want to move everyone forward (I hope that is human nature). It’s a large dream to undertake, especially when we are a very small majority of the nation.

  88. I think BCSizemo has a point: the “hold your nose and vote” Republicans aren’t going to go to an event like this.

  89. Gah! When that blonde woman gets all screechy and excited and starts chasing the camera around, with people going “yeah!” in the background. Nasty. Give her a flaming torch and a pitchfork and she’d be in her element.

  90. Hate to say it, but the ignorant, stupid and unhip have the same right to vote as anyone else. While their opinions (not to mention their “reasoning”) make me shudder, I sure as hell don’t want to deny them their rights.

    I’m constantly amazed how the exploited continue to vote for their exploiters. These are the folks whose votes the ward heelers in machine cities like New York or Chicago used to buy up with a pair of shoes or a flask of cheap booze. Nothing has really changed here, except the fact that now they’re on the INTERNET!

  91. Dd y ctch ntns, sm whl bck, xplnng tht w’r nt nfrcng prty ln t Bng Bng, nd t’s nt r flt tht wrst f th fgghds lmst ll cm frm th sm nd f th pltcl spctrm? Th fr rght hs bn cltvtng th dmb-nd-rsntfl sgmnts f th ppltn fr mny yrs nw. hnstly fl srry fr th ntllgnt, thghtfl cnsrvtvs whs pltcl nghbrhds hv flld p wth yhs.

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    -Wth th blf tht pssv wrtppng s bynd th pl, bt srs txtn s ncssry vl (f nt gd thng)?

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    cld g n. N wng f pltcs hs mnply n vrt, vsn, r gd ds. W ch hv prfrncs f wht w wnt. Pltcl prgrss wll cm whn w bld systm rnd r vls, nstd f tryng t bt r (thr ppl’s) vls dwn t ft th systm.

    1. And those who rebuke us for thinking with our hearts, or using rules of thumb instead of rigor (simply because we don’t have the time or care to make the effort) are limited in their thinking.

      Pretty poignant words from the man who once said that he wants his government to kill a million people to keep him safe. You are a hate troll. The only emotions that you have ever displayed on BoingBoing are rage and disgust and contempt and hatred. You are banned.

  92. I didn’t actually see that much there that was ignorant… Yes, the racist stuff was, and the “terrorist” guys were well-explained by the kid in the white hat who clarified, saying he thought his policies may lead to more terrorism (he’s wrong, of course–nothing turns people into terrorists faster than killing their families for no good goddamned reason).

    I didn’t understand the line of questioning about when people had heard of Obama. The right answer about Obama, as far as I can tell, was 4 years ago. I certainly hadn’t heard of him. I could totally see why someone might not have heard of him until a little over a year ago, however, if they were dyed-in-the-wool Republicans.

    Furthermore, it is entirely possible for people in the right circles to have heard of crazy-ass Sarah Palin earlier than this summer. I hadn’t, of course, but I’m not in the “right” circles.

    Yeah… I just saw a bunch of middle Americans. If you think that they are ignorant for wearing baseball caps and talking with a Midwestern twang, well, congratulations, you’re a snob.

  93. BUZZ GRAPHICS,

    You’re living among Mormons. It wasn’t too long ago they were a racially exclusive club; what did you expect from Utah, a political tolerance to match their neighborly niceness? They are a reactionary and ignorant band of 19th century refugees better suited for hewing wood and hauling water.

    FLOYDT,

    You sound like a “moran.”

  94. Buzz,

    So your point is, near as I can tell, that not all McCain supporters are ugly uneducated racists, that actually some of them are attractive educated racists.

    There was a time in my life when I tried to compromise, when I would tolerate friendships with people who had one bigotry or another. I was trying to be open minded. I guess that’s an example of when one pushes the whole liberal tolerance thing too far. But you know what? In almost every case it turned out that the friendships were a mistake, that there was an underlying toxicity in the person. Sometimes racism can be simple ignorance. Racism in the educated is something worse.

    I’m older and wiser. Now when I get to know someone and something racist or sexist or homophobic comes out of their mouths, I call them on it and I will not be friends with them.

    Reevaluate your position, and not entirely for the sake of those groups your “friends” are prejudiced against, do it for yourself. Tolerate hate and it will come back and bite you on the ass, every damn time.

  95. click favorites
    select “Boing Boing”
    right click
    select “delete” from drop down menu

    “Are you sure you want to send Boing Boing to the recycle bin?”

    Oh Yeah… I’m done.

    Disemvowelling comments just because they differ from yours, constant one-sided political posts, …

    All that’s fine, ‘cuz its your house, and you can do what you want.

    But this one stoops to new lows. I’m not defending the dorks in the video, mind you. They are clearly idiots. However stating that the Republican party is composed “SOLELY” of idiots and the extremely wealthy is just so ridiculously retarded a proposition that I have to bail on this whole self indulgent fantasy world you’re building.

    I’ll leave you to your leggos.

  96. I have family like this in Nevada. Some of them aren’t very smart, and when confronted with the contradictions in their views (I need a gun to defend my freedom vs. You can’t be gay or abort that foetus) they tend to clam up and shake their heads.

    Some of them are very smart, though, and these are the ones who read right wing blogs, listen to talk radio, and watch Fox news. They seek “sources” to affirm what they know.

    What these people have in common is that they have to live with each other, and they come to agreements about what reality is so that they can get along. That’s how Obama becomes a Muslim, Saddam causes 9/11, and Jr. Bush is a hero.

    These agreements between people go very deep, and they’re reinforced every day by the common social interactions in their communities. We can’t talk them out of it. We can try with their kids, by holding public institutions to a higher standard of truth, so that every interface with school or the law (including cops and courts) or medicine or the larger national and international conversation exposes them to a competing and somewhat less contradictory view of the world.

    We can also look to our own communities, and constantly examine our own assumptions for this anti-intellectual effect. We all make a bargain with ideas that don’t pass the smell test, for the sake of getting along with our neighbors. Intolerance of every sort gets propagated like that, even in the most enlightened communities.

    Cheerio.

  97. @28

    NJ bashing is just another form of anti-intellectualism. We gave you Frank Sinatra and Bruce Springstien. We also gave you the Garden State Parkway which is our little practical joke that we play on people from out-of-state. We don’t actually drive on in.

  98. perhaps the physical laws of nature are catching up with those who hold unreasoned ideas. Life doesn’t automatically include happy endings. Human social ideas and economic activity are bumped up against our resource limits and environmental variability, some of us have caught on – but that doesn’t mean anyone gets to live through it. Perhaps America doesn’t have a high enough ratio of people who use observation and thought over wishful thinking. It is in no way a given that America will survive. Can the world get by without an America?

    The people in this video need to step outside the America they have built in their heads and seriously consider how they will survive when the inevitable arrives.

    I’ve mentioned this before,but long enough ago so I don’t feel I’m being too tedious; Some years ago, Japanese society entertained a useful thought-experiment in a work of fiction called The Sinking of Japan. Catastrophic tectonic forces destroy Japan – all of it. The question emerges: where to go?, who will have us? It provoked soul searching about the reception the Japanese would receive in other countries based on history and recent conduct.

    Perhaps the bitterly partisan in America should consider this too. It might affect their domestic politics.

  99. “Becuase he has the blood lines”….. good god.

    Did anyone else pick up on the barely contained psychic scream of “Run run the n*gger is coming”?

    The veneer of civility has rarely been so thinly stretched over so much unfocused racist hate.

  100. Flaming Phonebook, I’m sure all that practice was good for your typing skills, but you completely missed the point.

    Reluctant Paladin, Richard Metzger is a guest blogger. If you don’t like what he has to say, just wait a while.

    Buddy66, I may have left my original religion and clan, and I may have my own quarrels with them, but I can tell you right now that they’re a lot more complex, human, and surprising than you imagine.

  101. Thank you SBarnes2 @ 83!

    I confused Kentucky’s Creation Museum with Mansfield Ohio’s Biblewalk/Living Bible Museum and Christian Martyr’s Museum, all in glorious wax!

    I just read that Bill Maher popped in at the Creation Museum in 2007 to shoot footage for Religulous. Should be a hoot!

    Ooo! We also have the “One and Only Presidential Museum” in Williamsfield. The curator proves definitively that John Hanson was the first president of the United States. Nice…

  102. Saw the footage of palin silencing a “heckler” by screeching that “My son is over in I-Raq right now fighting for your right to protest sir!” and then standing by grinning as the crowd shouts him down.

    To the Palinista on this thread – if you can’t see the irony of that, or aren’t offended by the blatant crowd manipulation in that trick, then you are truly beyond all hope or pity…

  103. Teresa NH.

    re previous post. I asterisked, I was not being a trouble maker and will go along with what ever you decide apt.

    Just trying to stay withing guide lines and speak my mind.

    All the best.

  104. @buddy66
    you’ve never been to utah have you? I know where I live and wouldn’t trade it for anything.

    @Pipenta
    I’m glad you’ve been so successful at insulating yourself from the average joe. Hv fn t yr nxt lbrl lt clb mtng.

    Man I think hanging around people with the exact same views as me all the time would bore me to death. My friends and neighbors know who I am and they’re cool with it, just as I’m cool with them and their blemishes. Diversity.

  105. The things that has always alarmed me most about the left wing Democrat/Liberal/CNN News-watching types is how they wear their own INTELLIGENCE as a badge of honor! I can’t get my head around the notion of how unashamed they are of their own intelligence.

    They’re so smart, and superior–and smart! And educated! And not condecending at all!

    I wish I could join their club. They seem like such a nice, welcoming bunch. And they’re so SMART!

  106. Sorry Jaydub, maybe if you tell us your educational background, we will let you in.

    One thing I noticed in the PA video is that all the shouters were over 50 or even 60? And those under 30 had a look on their face of a sheep eating grin. Like yea, we support McCain but this sure is embarrassing that we are standing in line with these adults acting like ignorant children. Maybe it will give them second thoughts.

  107. “….and so, as a populous, the inhabitants of planet Earth continue to bicker and squabble amongst themselves. Perhaps in an attempt to whittle down the human race to just one man and one woman who will then be absolutely right. But more likely just because they enjoyed it immensely. Little did they know that their petty arguments were blindly leading them down the same garden path that had put an end to all the other rashly conceived ideas of society that had come before. Dividing the people of the planet into ever decreasing units until no man or woman feels cabable of connecting with another man or woman…”

    Quote from “Humankind in the 21st Century” by M R Redfjord. First book on the reading list of the course “Society 101” run by the World University in the year 3002.

  108. I think what disgusts most of us about this video is that it shows people who have seemingly wholeheartedly and unquestioningly bought into a narrative which is obviously (to us) a fabrication created by cynical elites.

    These people have enthusiastically accepted the idea that there are two teams, represented by two champions: one good and the other bad. They apply little to no judgment before accepting and repeating the arguments which criticize the bad team, or the arguments which support and justify the good team.

    This video disgusts us, as it should. But it does not represent Republicans, or right-wingers, or Ohioans, or rednecks. All it represents is a few deliberately edited excerpts from footage taken by a member of the other team. Does this mean it’s false, or a trick? No. Obviously those people are real, and are really that deluded.

    But the idea that this is somehow proof of the overall nature of the other team is false. It’s called “anecdotal evidence”, and it’s not really evidence at all. We all know about anecdotal evidence, so why do we buy into this kind of thing? Why are we so ready to see a video like this and go “My god, McCain supporters are dumb!” I think it’s because most of us had already decided that McCain supporters were dumb. I think a lot of us had decided even before this election that, on the whole, Republicans and right-wingers were dumb.

    So this video anecdote isn’t evidence at all when you stop to think about it. And really neither was the last anecdote, or the one before that. The only reason we bought into them is because it confirmed our existing belief – and each time we bought in, our belief seemed less and less like a belief and more like a proven fact.

    I don’t really know if conservatives are dumb, on the whole – in absence of any real evidence, I’m going to assume that they’re not significantly dumber than anyone else. If anyone can provide some non-anecdotal evidence which says otherwise, I’d be interested. Note of course that even if there is such evidence and we happen to be right, that doesn’t let us off the hook for believing without proof – we just made a lucky guess.

    In general, however, I’d recommend trying to avoid falling into the trap in the first place. The “two teams represented by two champions” narrative is the lie, it’s the thing which invites us to create these epic beliefs about the badness of the other team and the goodness of our own. We’re being played very similarly to the way they’re being played. Maybe it’s a different aesthetic, a little higher brow, but it’s the same game.

  109. FPB 110: Oh, gods, are you still here? And btw we know you’re a right-wing loony; you don’t have to keep proving it over and over. We get it. Really.

    Pipenta 113: Sometimes racism can be simple ignorance. Racism in the educated is something worse.

    Amen, aché, hear hear. For the whole comment, not just the line quoted, which I especially liked. And it used to be that the Democrats were the racist party of the United States, but the GOP converted the Dixiecrats, and have firmly (and deliberately) assumed that mantle. So while it’s not 100% accurate that all Republicans are racists, it’s a pretty reasonable rebuttable presumption.

    As for homophobia, I have yet to meet a Republican (aside from people who just vote Republican because they “don’t know anything about politics and don’t want to”) who wasn’t homophobic. And I especially include the Log Cabin Republicans, who are filled with self-hatred and seem to be playing for being kept as pets once the Republicans finally get their “permanent majority” and kill all the rest of us heathen pinko queers.

  110. Stupidity is manufactured by Republicans and conservatives intentionally. It is no accident schools are overcrowded, underfunded and college is priced out of reach. Ignorant people are easy to manipulate into voting against their own interests. The neocons are well known Straussians – the hoi polloi aren’t to be trusted with the facts or the truth. If willful ignorance were a sin these people would burn in hell.

  111. Wht crp.You could go to a democratic rally and ask people if Palin is a religious cult member or if McCain is a Manchurian Candidate and you’d get people who’d say yes. Especially with leading questions like those.

    G hd nd prtnd y’r bg by rprtr f y wnt.

  112. #130, Takuan:

    I mean the top level BB post. Look at the kinds of comments that get disemvowelled – some of them for nothing more than asking questions likely to start arguments. This post is at least as bad.

  113. we are doomed. i was reminded of a quote of george carlin: “have you ever watched the jerry springer show? those are average americans”.

  114. arguments are neutral. People’s conduct can be bad or good. I myself feel I can tell the difference between right and wrong and fight accordingly. There are many levels at play in this thread, but I think there is only one correct direction.

  115. I agree with WURP that this seems like the type of post that, if it were made by a commenter in the comments section, it would be disemvoweled. I realize there are different rules for bloggers vs. commenters, and I’m fine with that. It’s your site, do with it what you want.

    It just seems to me that painting all “right wing Republican/conservative/FOX News-watching types” with the same brush and then asking “Is it somehow now HIP these days to be a total dumbass” is a bit mean-spirited and overly spiteful.

    I’m not a Republican/conservative/FOX News-watching type. And I would agree that most of the people in that video were pretty ignorant or at least somewhat racist. And that many Christian right-wing types hold the same or similar beliefs. But I could probably interview plenty of Obama supporters who would seem extremely ignorant as well. Unfortunately, ignorance doesn’t recognize political, economic, social, or territorial boundaries. It’s everywhere. And just shouting “REPUBLICANS ARE DUMB”…well, the first thing I’m reminded of is some of the World of Warcraft forums that I used to read where there were daily “ALLIANCE ARE STUPID” and “HORDE ARE GHEY” posts.

    I liked BB a lot better when it was at least more clever than 12-year-old WoW forum posters in its ridicule of the obviously ridiculous.

  116. one reason why evil is in ascendancy today is that those who should have opposed it root and branch – even with marginal and self-debasing tactics – did not have the stomach or vision to understand what they faced.

    No more bringing a knife to a gun fight.

  117. The questions were really baiting and obvious partisan. Do you seriously think the GOP has a monopoly on ignorance? Why don’t you take a camera down to inner-city Baltimore and ask how many people would vote for Obama, why, and what his policies are? I’m an Independent and will most likely vote for Obama in November, but it’s elitist liberal bullshit like this that makes me really really really wish Ron Paul had a ticket.

  118. It’s even worse when Republican politicians stoop to cultivate the least intelligent amongst us. Why is it that the Republican party seems to consist solely of the top 5% of America’s wealth holders and the lower third of the IQ spectrum with NO ONE in between?

    Um, the masters and the slaves, obviously. Or, the farmer and the livestock. You choose the metaphor.

    c.f. iron law of oligarchy, Political Parties

  119. Propaganda kills; lie, lie your dead.
    —————-
    Proud ignorance, I clothe myself in thee;
    the winter of truth is upon us.
    —————-
    They only do what we allow
    Again the time will come
    Those willing to die, will die
    The rest, the sheep,
    Go on their knees crying in disbelief
    Like lambs to the slaughter
    So docile, they must be kicked
    To be enjoyed
    —————-
    With her mouth and her ass in motion,
    She makes a very annoying temptation.

  120. Gee Richard, could you be a little more smug and condescending please? It really felt like you were holding back. I’m sure the people that have to work in factories for a living appreciate you getting out of your hybrid mercedes to ridicule them, but is there really any point to that? I don’t see how pointing the finger and going “look at the morons” provides anything but self satisfaction for the finger pointers, but then again, I’m not too bright myself, so perhaps this is all over my head.

  121. Flaming Phone Book:

    Everyone of your items is a half truth, a false dichotomy, a bias,or some other illogical dead end argument that’s not worth even refuting, as they refute themselves. I’m sure we all think you’re capable of a more reasoned argument.

    That said, your flaming lack of understanding of the left completely guts your arguments. Try, please, to understand the opposition before you start misrepresenting their views. Stick to misrepresenting your own views, please.

    And we’re supposed to take lessons in tolerance from YOU? That’s like the Republicans asking us to believe that they will regulate business. What kind of fucking cretins do you and they take us for?

    Fact 1: intolerance is written into so-called conservative (actually reactionary) ideology and the Republican platform.

    Fact 2: tolerance is written into liberal ideology. That’s why it’s called “liberal.” Call liberals on intolerance if you wish, but don’t impugn the philosophy.

    Fact 2: the fact that you know a liberal who is intolerant does not negate the liberal ideology, anymore than the occasional tolerant reactionary turns he reactionary ideology on its head.

    Sylkworm: consider changing your party affiliation if you feel so strongly about “elitist liberal bullshit.” You’ll feel right at home with the other “independents” on the Right.

  122. The only thing that made this thread worthing scrolling through were Theresa NH’s comments, and I always have to scan Takuan and Antinous. That said, this is the ugliest presidential campaign I can recall in my 30 years as an adult. The Democrats suck at polarizing, the Republicans are brilliant. I think we should put both Barack and John in charge, rotating POTUS every 6 months and forcing the other to sit as VP for that period. Neither get paid if they don’t get the House and Senate to work together. Neither get credit for success or failure, they share. Oh, and Ovaltine for each just before bed. The Jr. Economy we are suffering under is scary enough with out these violence-tinged flame wars in the national lime-light. BTW, since when does a US Senator become a terrorist-leaning Socialist? And why is no one on the right concerned about a small town governor ruling the land? Jr.’s “Eyes to the front” approach to diplomacy and the economy has gotten us into this mess.

  123. I feel that there is trend in America toward anti-intellectualism when it comes to politics. We Americans love our smart people when they are business magnates, astronauts, engineers, screenwriters, doctors, etc. But when we’re talking about someone in a public office, why darn it all, they’d better be just like US! It’s like we are living in the prologue to that movie “Idiocracy”.

  124. The New York Times had a good opinion piece that may help explain this:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/10/opinion/10brooks.html?ref=opinion

    My Version:
    American Politics is about mudslinging – making the other guy into “the worst thing to happen to America.”

    Whenever the Democrats nominate an intellectual, the Republicans respond by spinning the candidate into an “out of touch, ivory-tower know-it-all” and emphasize the fact that Republicans are “common folk – real American heartland types.”

    The goal is to make the Democrat look bad, but a powerful side-effect is that it recruits the people you saw in this clip. People who feel threatened by intellectuals begin to flock to the Republican party.

    In response, the Democratic Party spins the Republican candidate into “ignorant Redneck” and launches a campaign to emphasize the Democratic candidate’s “intellectual superiority.”

    These attacks infuriate the people from that clip, and recruits even more of them to the Republican party.

    At the same time, it recruits intellectuals to the Democratic Party, which makes them more likely to nominate an intellectual, starting the cycle all over again.

    I’m a Republican, but I see this pattern occurring. I see intellectuals, many of whom agree with the values the Republican party once stood for, voting Democrat because of this pattern.

    The solution is simple to understand, but will likely never be implemented:

    Stop attacking the other side.

    Compliment them for their intelligence and education.

    Emphasize that you can be an intellectual and “Joe Sixpack” at the same time, that “City Folk” and “Country Boys” can live by the same values, and that America’s Heartland stretches from sea-to-shining-sea.

  125. Creesto… this is nothing compared to the elections of the early Republic.

    Takuan… you didn’t — as usual — really give anything to respond to and since name-calling or smart-aleck is the only response — I’ll refrain. Tell me exactly how what I said was mistaken and we can “talk” — otherwise — exactly what is the purpose. I won’t be driven away except by the draconian censorship around here and that certainly isn’t going to convert me to your view. Kudos from your compadres is reward enough.

  126. Floyd: re-word whatever it was you were trying to say. Your comment as posted literally makes no sense. Please try again.

  127. Ah, I’m so glad I logged into DailyKos today. For a minute there, I thought I had come to a Directory of Wonderful Things.

    Guestblogger, first it was condescension to anyone who isn’t an audiophile, now it’s insults to anyone who isn’t a Democrat. Lay off the arrogance! Or did you miss the ‘happy’ part of happy mutant?

  128. Like many others, I wonder why Blogger Interrupted does not try to entrap stupid Obama supporters (say, in low-income housing areas, where Acorn is active) to say dumb things. It would be at least as entertaining. Shame on you, BI.

  129. Several parallel comments to this content.

    1. Good first-person blogging.
    2. The reality of populist politics is that regardless of party or leader, the ‘reasons’ for people’s loyalty and vote is often remarkably thin.
    3. The old ugly tradition of nativism is far from gone in my country.

    The question is whether the votes in any of the given districts in any election will be so narrow that an ill-informed electorate will have decisive influence on the outcome, in whatever direction.

    This then takes us to the question of redistricting, and whether it’s healthy for a democracy to have “purified” voting blocs, or to keep trying to mix the voting populations to reinforce the necessary political conversation between people with divergent interests and levels of interest.

  130. Flamingphonebook@110:

    “With the ignorant belief that the government can run a socialist economy better than the free market?”

    The Bush administration has been running a socialist economy for the rich. For everyone else, though, it’s been dog eat dog.

    “With the ignorant belief that it will help the above cause to not call it socialism?”

    See above.

    “-With the belief that everyone, no matter how lazy and incompetent, can and ought to be able to afford a house?”

    That’s McCain’s idiotic and desperate campaign promise, not Obama’s.

    “-With the belief that health care is a right in the same way that life, liberty, and property are rights?”

    Now, *that’s* ignorant! What makes you think anybody really has a *right* to life, liberty, and property? There are no rights. All rights are just made up by people. The universe doesn’t know what a “right” is. Once you understand that, things become more clear.

    “-With the belief that you can always negotiate with terrorists?”

    Nice trick, sticking “always” in there.

    “-With the belief that if you find a logical flaw in a religion, that its proponents ought to toss it in the trash immediately?”

    I don’t care if someone worships Allah, as long as they don’t make me abide by their religious-based rules.

    “-With the belief that since *we* don’t need SUVs to get where we’re going, no one should?”

    If your big car makes you feel like a big man, keep driving it. Vroom vroom!

    “-With the belief that since *we* love drugs and debaucherous sex, that anyone who doesn’t must be a prude or a hypocrite?”

    Ha ha! You are running out of steam now.

    “-With the belief that men=women, gay=straight, and black=white=Hispanic=Asian=other?”

    You don’t understand what “equal” means in “all men are created equal.”

    “-With the belief that passive wiretapping is beyond the pale, but usurious taxation is a necessary evil (if not a good thing)?”

    Eh? how do these two things relate?

    “-With the belief that a gun-free zone will stay that way?”

    I know plenty of liberals who are packing heat, buddy. You’d be very surprised.

  131. wow! Does anybody else think a second civil war is coming to our country? This time, let the rednecks keep their cornfields.

  132. You know I was going to reply to a bunch of posts, but you know I thought of something…

    Why should I? If someone is so ignorant they can’t see reality from their fictional world they live in then their ignorance is their own bliss.

    If you can’t see the world as it is, at face value. If you can’t discuss it without resorting to X party is so dumb, and general elementary school tactics. If you believe your party, or person, can do no wrong. If you are any of these things, then I don’t need to hear it.

    My mom is die hard core right wing conservative all the way. They said to me recently (when discussing Obama and politics), “We didn’t raise you that way”. I simply said, “No you raised me to think for myself, and analyze my world.” That automatically made me the winner of that argument.

    If you don’t find faults with either party; you aren’t looking hard enough. If you don’t see things wrong in your home town; look harder. If you can’t think of something that can be done to help the whole; then try.

    I believe it is every persons innate human ability to describe a world we all want to live in. This world, I believe, is similar among all people. And it is one that we could build together, if we could get out of our own way.

    This might happen. Not in my life time, or probably the next several hundred year. (Not unless the machines take over……) But one day, I think humanity will find a common goal and be united for the good of one and all.

  133. I have always been left bemused byt working people who despise left wing politics and decry those who are of the left as liberal elitist snobs.

    The same liberal elitist snobs (LES) who have at every turn tried to improve the lot of the people who actually do the work neeeding done.

    The right wing always has and always will view workers as property at worse or serfs at best.

    Those working people who espose the right wing ideology are like slaves with Stockholm syndrome.

    Absolutely mad, they have adopted the creed of divide and concquer with out ever understanding that it is they who are the concquered and that their masters revile them for being prolotarian wretches and doubly so for their cravenly willing deference to them.

    People who as they say in Yorkshire would “borrow a pair of boots to walk the 20 miles to vote Conservative”

  134. the purpose of the “American Dream” meme is just that. The fact remains, everyone on top everywhere wants cheap labor.

  135. Those working people who espose the right wing ideology are like slaves with Stockholm syndrome.

    Error404: Well said.

  136. The thing about these videos that I find most curious is that he’s simply asking questions which are pretty neutral: “When did you first hear about Sarah Palin?” and “When did you first hear about Barak Obama?” (I’m undecided on “Is Barak Obama a terrorist?”– but the fact that he’s asking that question really leans right more than left). Were there other questions he edited out that clued the crowd into his “liberal media bias”? or did they infer it some other way, like by his tone, or maybe he was wearing an Obama t-shirt? (I’m suspecting his tone was leading, but the link is down right now so I can’t check my memory).

    I’m curious if a conservative could go to an Obama rally and ask the same questions and get a similar reaction. I like to think the people would be more honest and informed, and less knee-jerk, but there’s always some loudmouth in every crowd.

    There’s definitely a certain pride-in-ignorance on the right, like the conservative offense over Petreaus’ pronunciation of “Pakistan”– which reminds me. . . I recently saw footage of Bush pronouncing “nuclear” correctly, from before he became President! (I guess he switched to appeal to his base.)

  137. What I also find weird is that blond woman appears to think that “providing low income housing to people who couldn’t afford it” is a bad thing . . . isn’t that the point of “low income housing?” Or maybe she prefers homlessness. (I guess she’s blaming Obama and ACORN for the real estate bubble bursting. Wow.)

    (Yeah– now the link is working and I guess his tone is a little smarmy, leading them to suspect his party affiliation. This would be better blogging if he tried to remain neutral and just ask non-leading questions, then do the same at an Obama rally.)

  138. Damn I’ve final;ly worked out what itis about the blond woman that was bugging me.

    She looks like Sabine Scmidt the Queen of the Nurburg ring.

    She for real can thrown a ford diesel van around the Nurburg Ring in under 10 mins.

    Most people would be very hard pressed to do that in a brand new porsche.

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